A
Ardross
Guest
On Radio 4 at the moment - Krizon will be featured in this series surely
Shadow Leader
At the Start
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2003
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- 9,884
SHould have been in episode 1!
A
Ardross
Guest
Tonight it was Mrs Fitzherbert , George IV's secret wife .
A
Ardross
Guest
:lol:
:lol: As most people who've listened to my inane witterings will know, I refuse to rise for less than £50 a day. Oh, all right, then, £42.50 and chuck in a cuppa.
Didn't know about this, Arders - sounds rather interesting. I was glued to the History Channel's second of four programmes (9 pm) about 'The Secrets of the Inquisition', which was a remarkably well-documented reign of terror, now that the Catholic Church has very kindly decided to release a portion (and a darn large one at that) of the previously locked-up records painstakingly (Inquisition - pains taking, geddit?) scratched by quill. Another abomination on the face of religious intolerance, monarchical greed and complicity. And bloody centuries of it, too - not a few months or even a few decades of betrayals and living 'in fear of God' (my arse).
The Jews, who'd lived alongside the Christians for 1,500 years up til then, were persecuted, forcibly baptised, and then years later, because they became so successful as 'conversos' (converts) or New Christians, were rounded on by jealous Old Christians, branded as heretics (because many of them, having been forced to assume the airs of Christian worship, still circumcised their boys and practised other Jewish rituals), put on trial, and denounced.
The very lovely Auto da Fe, or Act of Faith, was actually shoving those ridiculous high, conical hats onto the heads of the unfaithful, putting them into tunics with a large 'X' across the front and then sending them off to be galley slaves, into exile, or into prison for the rest of their lives. The unlucky ones (yes, those were the lucky ones!) were put into black attire and fired up at the stake - that was the Act of Faith. It was interesting that Jews, per se, were regarded by the Catholics as infidels, so could not be guilty of heresy, while the 'conversos' who'd mostly been forcibly converted at the point of good old Iberian steel swords, were considered heretical - regardless of whether they'd fully abandoned Judaic ways or not.
I watched some night-time religious procession in Marbella some years ago, and the high conical hats (like those later of the KKK) were worn by a number of the faithful, along with sweeping cloaks in many colours. The difference was that their faces were covered, just like colourful members of the Klan. The faces of the Inquisition's victims weren't covered. The penitents dragged chains around their feet, walked barefoot, and moaned a lot. Probably not half as much as the hapless Jews and their brave defenders did, though, on their way after a good torture session to being burned alive.
We've got to the point where Isabella, the most powerful Queen of the time and apparently the reason a Queen was made the most powerful piece in chess, and King Ferdy, are whacking the hell out of the Muslims dahn sarf, so let it not be said that Catholicism was merely anti-Jewish. Issy is determined to create a united Iberia (later Spain), and it's not going to have any of those weirdos in it - just good, clean-living, God-fearing folk who like nothing better than the smell of burning flesh in the morning. More tomorrow...
Didn't know about this, Arders - sounds rather interesting. I was glued to the History Channel's second of four programmes (9 pm) about 'The Secrets of the Inquisition', which was a remarkably well-documented reign of terror, now that the Catholic Church has very kindly decided to release a portion (and a darn large one at that) of the previously locked-up records painstakingly (Inquisition - pains taking, geddit?) scratched by quill. Another abomination on the face of religious intolerance, monarchical greed and complicity. And bloody centuries of it, too - not a few months or even a few decades of betrayals and living 'in fear of God' (my arse).
The Jews, who'd lived alongside the Christians for 1,500 years up til then, were persecuted, forcibly baptised, and then years later, because they became so successful as 'conversos' (converts) or New Christians, were rounded on by jealous Old Christians, branded as heretics (because many of them, having been forced to assume the airs of Christian worship, still circumcised their boys and practised other Jewish rituals), put on trial, and denounced.
The very lovely Auto da Fe, or Act of Faith, was actually shoving those ridiculous high, conical hats onto the heads of the unfaithful, putting them into tunics with a large 'X' across the front and then sending them off to be galley slaves, into exile, or into prison for the rest of their lives. The unlucky ones (yes, those were the lucky ones!) were put into black attire and fired up at the stake - that was the Act of Faith. It was interesting that Jews, per se, were regarded by the Catholics as infidels, so could not be guilty of heresy, while the 'conversos' who'd mostly been forcibly converted at the point of good old Iberian steel swords, were considered heretical - regardless of whether they'd fully abandoned Judaic ways or not.
I watched some night-time religious procession in Marbella some years ago, and the high conical hats (like those later of the KKK) were worn by a number of the faithful, along with sweeping cloaks in many colours. The difference was that their faces were covered, just like colourful members of the Klan. The faces of the Inquisition's victims weren't covered. The penitents dragged chains around their feet, walked barefoot, and moaned a lot. Probably not half as much as the hapless Jews and their brave defenders did, though, on their way after a good torture session to being burned alive.
We've got to the point where Isabella, the most powerful Queen of the time and apparently the reason a Queen was made the most powerful piece in chess, and King Ferdy, are whacking the hell out of the Muslims dahn sarf, so let it not be said that Catholicism was merely anti-Jewish. Issy is determined to create a united Iberia (later Spain), and it's not going to have any of those weirdos in it - just good, clean-living, God-fearing folk who like nothing better than the smell of burning flesh in the morning. More tomorrow...
A
Ardross
Guest
Shadow Leader
At the Start
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2003
- Messages
- 9,884
I'm sure there will have been a massive hidden agenda in the persecution of the muslims during the time of the Spanish Inquisition - Isabella & Ferdinand were trying to drive the Moors out of the country after they'd been in occupation in much of Southern Spain for quite a while. They (Ferdinand & Isabella) were the first ones powerful enough to be able to start driving them out - the Alhambra is well known as being Ferdinand & Isabellas palace yet was originally built by the Moors until F & I drove them out of Granada.
Interestingly enough, in Sevilla during Semana Santa (Holy Week) at Easter there are daily parades of Catholic brotherhoods wearing the conical hats, KK style. THey parade through the streets carrying floats with effigies of the Virgin and of Christ and thousands of people turn out to see it. I am hoping very much to make it up to Sevilla during Semana Santa, hopefully I can make it this year.
A Santa Semana parade :
Interestingly enough, in Sevilla during Semana Santa (Holy Week) at Easter there are daily parades of Catholic brotherhoods wearing the conical hats, KK style. THey parade through the streets carrying floats with effigies of the Virgin and of Christ and thousands of people turn out to see it. I am hoping very much to make it up to Sevilla during Semana Santa, hopefully I can make it this year.
A Santa Semana parade :
simmo
Senior Jockey
I must say that when I opened this thread I didn't expect to find the Spanish Inquisition......
h34r:
h34r:Colin Phillips
At the Start
.........OK. I'll say it..........................NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :nerd:
rorydelargy
At the Start
Our chief weapon is surprise...surprise and fear.....Our two weapons are surprise and fear........and ruthless efficiency....Our THREE weapons.......I'll come in again 
I'd forgotten the whole spiel, rory - it really is hilarious! Do more for me, please...
Dom, yaaarse, the programme (on again tonight and tomorrow at 9 pm) did go into all the history bit as per your posting, too.
Tonight, it will be the Medici Pope drawing righteous wrath upon his head for depravity. Good that the Church cleaned up its act there, then, and it's just its priests who are regularly found to be kiddy-fiddling. Lucky bastards - wot? No fires for them, you say - just move 'em to another parish? :angry:
The idea indeed was a unified Iberia, all Catholic, no feelthy infidels, thank you. So cute that now it's the radicalized Muslims shrieking about the 'infidels'! Ah, how I love that old time religion...
Dom, yaaarse, the programme (on again tonight and tomorrow at 9 pm) did go into all the history bit as per your posting, too.
Tonight, it will be the Medici Pope drawing righteous wrath upon his head for depravity. Good that the Church cleaned up its act there, then, and it's just its priests who are regularly found to be kiddy-fiddling. Lucky bastards - wot? No fires for them, you say - just move 'em to another parish? :angry:
The idea indeed was a unified Iberia, all Catholic, no feelthy infidels, thank you. So cute that now it's the radicalized Muslims shrieking about the 'infidels'! Ah, how I love that old time religion...
Shadow Leader
At the Start
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2003
- Messages
- 9,884
Not that I'm defending the Spanish Inquisition, as it was horrendous, but the 'infidel Moors' were an invading force that occupied Spain - they did invade in the first place!
Kri, that programme sounds interesting - which channel is it on? I looked on the Radio Times website & on the History Channel at 9pm it's yet another 'FBI Casefiles' programme.
Kri, that programme sounds interesting - which channel is it on? I looked on the Radio Times website & on the History Channel at 9pm it's yet another 'FBI Casefiles' programme.
BrianH
At the Start
Well, let's sort this out - it was the Moors who named the Christians "infidels", or non-believers, not the other way round. And they certainly did invade Spain, but not "in the first place".
First were the Tartessos, an Iberian tribe.
Then came the Celts.
Next to invade were the Phoenicians.
They were followed by the Greeks.
After this the Carthaginians conquered much of Spain.
In later position than usual came the Romans.
When the Roman empire started to implode it was the turn of the Goths.
And in eighth place, in 711 AD, along came the Moors, who were second only to the Romans in their influence on Spanish culture.
Shadow Leader
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- 9,884
What I meant was that the Moors invaded, they were hardly an innocent party who resided in Spain to start with!
After the Moops (Moors who cleaned up big time), there'll be some Barbararians, a mix of elephant-keeping librarians.
Modern Spain is now infested with the Blingleesi, following dreadful invasions of garishly-gilded Anglo-Saxons, whose decadent lifestyles once again threaten the very fabric of Iberian society, blah, blah...
... they suffer the agonies of self-inflicted autos da fe through their reckless evasion of Factor 15, and are subject to violent purges, following the over-ingestion of the strange ritual of the 'Full English' accompanied by dos cervezas, por favor.
Modern Spain is now infested with the Blingleesi, following dreadful invasions of garishly-gilded Anglo-Saxons, whose decadent lifestyles once again threaten the very fabric of Iberian society, blah, blah...
... they suffer the agonies of self-inflicted autos da fe through their reckless evasion of Factor 15, and are subject to violent purges, following the over-ingestion of the strange ritual of the 'Full English' accompanied by dos cervezas, por favor.
simmo
Senior Jockey
I'm sure the Vandals had a bash at it as well.
Shadow Leader
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- 9,884
Very good Kri!! :lol: :lol:
As for the English breakfasts - it really is sad that when Brits are abroad so many of them flock to find the nearest place that serves English food, particularly breakfast. So adventurous!!! :lol:
As for the English breakfasts - it really is sad that when Brits are abroad so many of them flock to find the nearest place that serves English food, particularly breakfast. So adventurous!!! :lol: