Scary thought

R

redhead

At the Start
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There is a paper being presented to Parliament from Revenue and Customs asking that all employers pay their employees' salaries directly to the Government. HMRC will then make all necessary deductions and pay us all directly.

HMRC say that many mistakes are made by employers, but what about their employees who have recently made such a mess-up?

What happens if your salary goes astray? Who the hell do you talk to then? What if the wonderful computer crashes, or the inputting clerk gets it wrong?

At least in firms/services with Accounts Departments you have someone to liaise with.

I can see why some people - mainly employers - would think this a good idea as it would mean having to employ fewer people in their accounts departments.

If passed, they will probably try it out on the public sector first, but I'm sure that this would prove a false economy as very few people get made redundant and are generally redeployed.

Very scary thought.
 
Tantamount to theft, if you ask me.

Employers already deduct PAYE at source, so the HMRC argument would seem not to apply to the vast, vast majority of tax-payers - making the very suggestion an absolute affront to our civil liberties.

If there are holes in the tax system it is patently down to a care of duty by the Revenue itself, and bolsters the argument that we could have zero faith in them implementing this proposed system properly. There would be absolute carnage.

I'd imagine the Revenues hoped-for outcome is people shrugging their shoulders with whatever they do receive, and never bothering to actually check whether their payment is accurate or not.

Let's face it, if my PAYE in October was £100, and in November it was £125, would I seriously question it? No, because it would be more effort than I could bear, and the time would cost me more than £25 anyway. The end result is the Revenue get an extra pony every month for zero effort. Mutiply that by tens of thousands of people, and - hey presto! - the deficit reduces at a faster pace.

This has the potential for larceny on a grand scale - by the Government. If it gets through Parliament, we should take pick-axes to the fuckers.
 
This to be presented at a time when the government's trying to swing a darn great axe through its own services? The daft buggers have just proved that they're as fallible as any other organisation with their cock-up, so 'improved reliability' would hardly form part of a decent multi-point justification for it to go through. Hundreds more staff would be needed at cosy, never-get-fired civil service jobs with guaranteed pensions and paid leave from HMG, presumably with bonuses for Outstanding Incidents of Incompetency every year. "Cost savings" not on the agenda, either. So the two main reasons to change something aren't valid for a start...

Additionally, does anyone want one's bank account details accessed by any number of 'the team' - ergo, no single person will be accountable and responsible as they would be now in an accounts office - not to mention them trying to handle Casual, Part-time, full employment details. When they can't keep track of who they've overpaid and who they've underpaid themselves, I'd say leave the damn issue alone. It may be broke, but there's no need to smash it to tiny fragments with the collosal weight of bureaucratic incompetency.

(It's way too early for April 1st jokes, but it would've been a good one!)
 
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2mployers will push back because it knocks a hole in their cashflow. Never underestimate how important that is. Dreadful idea
 
Grasshopper said:
This has the potential for larceny on a grand scale - by the Government. If it gets through Parliament, we should take pick-axes to the fuckers.
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I think people in this country put up with a lot, but this would be the straw that broke it. If my pay was wrong I would firebomb a Government building with not a second thought.
 
I suppose it took some overpaid and imbecilic quango to come up with it? What on earth next - the NHS to do our shopping for us, to ensure we get our five a day? How much in this oversurveilled little country is going to be surrendered quietly to State control, tovarich?
 
I really do resent the fact that, as Krizon points out, a whole load of people who shouldn't will have access to my bank details.

We've already had the scandal of the banks who moved their call centres abroad opening their customers up to being ripped off by the call centre staff. What's the betting that someone will think the same thing in the Tax Offices here?

The whole lack of accountability that will leave us all open to being ripped-off is scary enough, but the feeling that Big Brother is taking a step closer is even more worrying.
 
This is being discussed on a couple of other forums I use and I haven't seen a single person say its a good idea.
HMRC are inept at best and this must be one of the worst idea's ever.

If they introduced it you can guarantee after time they would want to streamline payments so everyone would get paid on the same day/date each month rather than have different payment days, weekly and monthly pays.
The computer will crash one week and no one will get paid. Can you imagine the chaos if everyone was due to be paid on the 23rd December and no wages went in? There would be riots.

In the past 18 months, HMRC have lost a tax return of mine (it was logged as being recieved but they didn't know where it was), didn't tell me for over 6 months, then fined me £100. To get the fine wiped I had to appeal, so sent it special delivery, had proof of delivery, inc a name and signature, and they couldn't find that either for over 4 months. Then it took them 3 months to decide I didn't have to pay the fine! God knows what they will be like paying everyones wages :(
 
Well, there's a very simple solution -we don't give over our bank details. If a significant proportion of the employed population refuse to play ball, what can they do ?

Can you honestly think the Banks are going to support this one - they make millions a year from salary bank transactions that they certainly won't get from the IR !!

Sounds like that twit Hartnett again to me.....
 
Songsheet said:
Well, there's a very simple solution -we don't give over our bank details. If a significant proportion of the employed population refuse to play ball, what can they do ?QUOTE]

Problem is that our employers have them and will probably have to hand them over.
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Employers are people who usually pay PAYE/NI themselves, Redhead - I'm one of them - if enough of us choose to refuse to hand over the details, then the plan fails - bit like Poll Tax!
 
That'll be the problem, won't it? As Redhead says, it could kick off with a gigantic national organisation deciding it's a wonderful idea, followed by the equally inept Home Office, Dept of Agriculture, then the MoD, and there you go. Fine, let the government balls-up its own payrolls, but leave private business to be what it is - private.
 
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