Uzbekistan

[Will]

i am quite surprised no one has mentioned this but what has happened over there is horrific. I first heard the news on Monday morning and has heard nothing since, was busy losing a club match on Monday night, couldnt get hold of a decent paper and no one mentioned anything at worka bout it, they did mention that love island programme though.


Uzbek officials put toll at 169

Andijan has been under a curfew since the weekend
Uzbekistan's chief prosecutor has said 169 people died in clashes in the town of Andijan last week, but he denied security forces had killed civilians.
An Uzbek military source has however told the BBC that the true death toll is more than 500, with many more injured. He spoke of a "massacre".
Some Uzbeks believe bodies are being released slowly to keep the death toll in doubt, a BBC correspondent reports. The US and UK have condemned the violence and urged political reform. Moscow has reacted officially for the first time to the events in Andijan, echoing Uzbek President Islam Karimov's assertion that Islamic militants were to blame for the violence. However, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov acknowledged that "a great many completely innocent people" had died in Andijan and he expressed "profound regret".
Troops moved into Andijan on Friday soon after protesters stormed the town's prison and freed 23 suspected Islamic extremists, who then joined a public rally in the centre. The town has been under curfew since the weekend.
'Terrorists'
"Only terrorists were liquidated by government forces," said Prosecutor-General Rashid Kadyrov, adding that 32 members of the security forces also died.
"Not a single civilian was killed by government forces there," he told reporters, and described as "absolutely absurd" reports that troops had fired on peaceful demonstrators.

Most populous central Asian former Soviet republic, home to 26m people
Ruled since 1991 independence by autocrat Islam Karimov
Accused by human rights groups of serious abuses, including torture
Rocked by violence in capital Tashkent in 2004
Government says radical Islamic groups behind violence


Border town trade revives
Who are the Islamists?

According to Mr Kadyrov, gunmen killed three women and two children.

Reports of a much higher toll were "willing misinformation put out by the international community", he said.

The military source who spoke to the BBC said he had come forward because he wanted the world to know what really happened.

The BBC's Monica Whitlock notes that Uzbekistan is a tightly controlled state in which officials almost never speak to journalists and invariably state the government line.

That a military figure should break silence on such a vastly important and sensitive issue is unprecedented, she adds.

According to an Uzbek opposition party, 542 people were killed in Andijan on Friday and 203 others on Saturday in Pakhtabad, another town in the Fergana Valley.


Uzbek crisis: Your comments

Nigara Khidoyatova, leader of the Free Peasants Party, told the Associated Press news agency her party had arrived at the figure by speaking to relatives of the dead.

President Karimov dismissed her figures as a claim made by a "person who needs psychiatric treatment", AP adds.

Witnesses who spoke to the BBC earlier said security forces had shot at civilians, including women and children, though a doctor who saw bodies collected afterwards said most of the dead appeared to have been adult men.

International spotlight

Neighbouring Kyrgyzstan has registered more than 500 refugees from Andijan. Some said troops shot at them as they tried to cross the border and that some died.


The London protesters may be charged with criminal damage

The US said on Monday it is "deeply disturbed" by reports from Uzbekistan that troops fired on unarmed civilians.

Since events started unfolding on Friday, Washington has been under pressure to take a tough line against the Uzbek regime, a key US ally.

On Tuesday, about 30 protesters gathered outside the US embassy in the capital, Tashkent, to condemn Mr Karimov as a "killer of the people".

In London, police arrested 37 people outside the Uzbek embassy there after demonstrators daubed the building with red paint.

A member of the Islamic group Hizb ut-Tahrir told the BBC the protest was a "show of solidarity with Uzbek Muslims".


NOT GOOD, i cant believe an incident like this happens in our modern day and age. Furthermore, im shocked by the lack of coverage about it.

 

[Will]

further article from the times

An Uzbek opposition leader said today that her party had compiled a list of 745 people allegedly killed by government troops, while the President continued to claim that only militants were killed.

Nigara Khidoyatova, head of the Free Peasants Party, said the toll was expected to rise, with bodies still being buried in mass graves under the watch of security service agents. She said her party arrived at its figure by speaking to relatives of the dead. "The count hasn’t yet finished," she said.

Last week’s unrest was the worst since Uzbekistan won its independence from the Soviet Union in 1991. The Government, which denied firing at civilians, has blamed Islamic extremists for the violence.

The crackdown came after protesters stormed a prison in the eastern city of Andijan on Friday, freed inmates and then seized local government offices.

Many of the demonstrators were citizens complaining about poverty and unemployment. Similar unrest broke out on Saturday in Pakhtabad, another city in the volatile Fergana Valley.

Ms Khidoyatova said that 542 people were killed in Andijan and 203 people in Pakhtabad, about 30 km (20 miles) to the northeast. "Soldiers were roaming the streets and shooting at innocent civilians," Ms Khidoyatova said. "Many victims were shot in the back of the head."

Others gave similar accounts. Abdugapur Dadaboyev, an activist with the local Ezgulik (Kindness) rights group, said today that at least 200 bodies were seen at an Andijan morgue and that were further corpses at a local clinic and a hospital. Most of the victims appeared to have been shot in the back, he said.

A respected local doctor in Andijan has said that about 500 bodies were laid out at a school over the weekend for collection by relatives. Other witnesses also have said hundreds were killed when troops put down Friday's uprising.

However, Uzbekistan’s chief prosecutor claimed today that only 169 people, mostly militants, had been killed in violence in Andijan.

Rashid Kadyrov said that 32 of those who died on Friday were government troops and that the others were militants. "Only terrorists were liquidated by government forces," he said at a news conference with President Islam Karimov.

Mr Kadyrov also said that more than 50 of those killed were foreigners, including two Kyrgyz nationals. Five more Kyrgyz citizens have been detained, he said.

The President lashed out at foreign journalists, accusing them of slanted coverage of events in Andijan. He said official restrictions on journalists’ access to the area were motivated by concerns about their safety.

Mr Karimov also shrugged off allegations of troops killing civilians. "Who would kill people who have no weapons?" he said.

Security remained tight in Andijan today, with armoured vehicles guarding approaches to official buildings and troops in full combat gear watching out from behind concrete barricades.

Witnesses said that an armoured personnel carrier fired at a vehicle trying to leave the city, killing several passengers. The victims allegedly were businessmen connected to Akramia - a group of observant Islamic businessmen at the focus of the unrest.

In another Andijan neighbourhood, about 20 troops in full gear, some wearing balaclava masks, came in an armoured personnel carrier to arrest a criminal suspect, pointing sniper rifles around to prevent people from coming too close.



The violence puts the United States in a difficult position because it relies on Mr Karimov’s authoritarian government for an air base in the country and anti-terrorism support. In Washington, the State Department said it was "deeply disturbed" by the reports that Uzbek authorities fired at the demonstrators, while calling for political reform in the country.

"We certainly condemn the indiscriminate use of force against unarmed civilians and deeply regret any loss of life," the State Department spokesman, Richard Boucher, said yesterday.

"We had urged and continue to urge the Uzbek Government to exercise restraint, stressing that violence cannot lead to long-term stability. And we have made that point with senior Uzbek authorities in Washington and Tashkent."

But the US also criticised protesters for taking up arms and said it was concerned that Muslim extremists who had been detained at the prison were now at large. It also urged the Uzbek Government to give the international Red Cross full access to the region.

"The armed attack by civilians on the prison in Andijan and other government facilities is the kind of violence that we cannot countenance in any way," Mr Boucher said.

Cemetery workers hastily buried 37 bodies in a mass grave in Andijan this morning as residents mourned the dead. The 37 young men were wrapped in traditional white shrouds before being placed in a common pit at a cemetery in the southern part of the city.

There was no identification on the bodies, and the grave - dug at a distance from other graves - was marked only by a small sign.

Although Mr Karimov’s Government has denied shooting at demonstrators, reporters witnessed troops opening fire on the crowd at Andijan’s central square.

"Relatives of the victims are in shock, and they can’t understand why their close ones were killed," Ms Khidoyatova said. "Once the funerals are over, they aren’t going to let it go unpunished and will take revenge. They are boiling with anger."

In one example, she said, members of her party had attended the funeral of Sardor Khasanov, an 18-year old resident of Andijan who walked out to buy a loaf of bread and was killed with a bullet to the back of his head.

In Pakhtabad, virtually all the victims were women and children apparently trying to flee violence by escaping into neighbouring Kyrgyzstan, Ms Khidoyatova added. "They were refugees trying to escape."

Ms Khidoyatova predicted that explosions of anger following the massacre will soon spread to other cities in the volatile, densely-populated Fergana Valley and eventually topple the Karimov government.

"It’s the beginning of the end of Karimov’s regime," she said.

 

[sunybay]

Originally posted by Will@May 17 2005, 11:02 PM
i am quite surprised no one has mentioned this but what has happened over there is horrific.

I am surprised that someone here is surprised.


If the yankees are not involved in this kind of situations people doesnt mind what happens in other places of the world or how many people die.


This is the world in what we live.

 

[krizon]

That's completely unjust, suny. Simply because we haven't put up a reaction to every dreadful thing that happens in the world - I suspect that would need an entire website of its' own - doesn't mean that we don't care.

I have made a lot of contributions about the plight of Palestinians on here, and although there is clearly a connection to American interests via Israel, it is Zionists who I have particularly singled out for approbrium.

We have had lengthy discourses on here, as you well know, about terrorism and how it has affected various countries (not just the USA or Madrid), we've discussed the Asian tsunami, a number of issues about Africa (poverty, AIDS, colonialism, etc.), and have reacted to various international issues, whether out of sorrow or jubilation.

If it wasn't for the fact that America inserts itself into most international issues, it wouldn't keep cropping up. But it is the world's most powerful nation, if not the most intelligent one, so it's obvious that it generates more influence globally, and thus more reasons to be discussed, and its ethics and aims debated.

It's an unfortunate situation for the Uzbeks - I have a friend there married to an Uzbek woman, who has a young daughter, and I hope they'll be all right. But what does Spain propose to do about a situation where it has no influence? Countries all, at some time, go through periods of inner or outer violence. Apart from saying it's a bad, sad thing, what influence does anyone have over it?

 

[Bobbyjo]

Erm, it's probably worth mentioning that America has been quite friendly to the ruling regime in Uzbekistan,

Therefore, this is not being highlighted as a major issues. Believe me, if it was Islamic militants carrying out the atrocities we'd have plenty of reaction from certain quarters,

The silence from Washington is deafening - where are the protectors of democracy now? A tame statement from the State Department is not sufficient

 

[krizon]

America is pretty warm to Eastern European, post-Communist countries where oil pipelines are being run, Uzbekistan being prominent in that. It's a wealthy country thanks to the post-Communist burst into capitalistic ventures, new construction taking place everywhere, but also rampant with corruption and gangsterism, as are so many of the East European states.

But what is anyone going to do about things? Invade? (Again...)

 

[BrianH]

suny, the only reason I posted nothing on the subject is that I am sick and tired of detailing the wrongs of this US administration. The good news is that millions of Americans are now recognising the deep flaws in the people they put into power and the actions that they take under an all-encompassing umbrella of 9/11.

Yes, of course the Americans are involved – and very deeply. Karimov knows full well that he would not be able to get away with his despotic regime without the tacit support of the Bush administration.

Uzbekistan holds up to 6,000 political prisoners; independent economic activity has been crushed; religious practice is severely restricted; there is no free press; and the internet is censored. On December 26, when the world was marvelling at Ukraine's orange revolution, Karimov was hosting an election that was not nearly as close - he had banned all the opposition parties

If the figures are correct, the crackdown in Andijan and elsewhere has been the most violent in Asia since the Tiananmen Square massacre in 1989.

In 2002 Karimov boiled alive two of his critics.

A tyrant who kills his own people – haven’t we been there before? Are these not the people that should be removed, even if it means going to war on an illegal pretext? The double standards that apply in politics say not, if the tyrant is “our friend”.

And Karimov has certainly been “our friend”. Shortly after 9/11, he allowed the US to locate an airbase at Khanabad - a helpful contribution to the upcoming war against Afghanistan. Since then he has been happy to act as a reliable protector of central Asian oil and gas supplies, much coveted by a USA eager to reduce its reliance on the Gulf states. And he has gladly let Uzbekistan be used for what is euphemistically known as "rendition", the practice of exporting terror suspects to countries less squeamish about torture than Britain or the US. This was the matter over which the heroic Craig Murray, the former UK ambassador to Tashkent, fell out with his employers: he argued that Britain was "selling its soul" by using information gathered under such heinous circumstances.

Brushing Murray's qualms to one side, London and Washington remained grateful to Karimov. A procession of top Bush administration officials trekked to Tashkent to thank the dictator for his services. Donald Rumsfeld, not content with that 1983 photo of himself shaking hands with Saddam Hussein, praised Karimov for his "wonderful cooperation", while George Bush's former Treasury secretary, Paul O'Neill, admired the autocrat's "very keen intellect and deep passion" for improving the lives of ordinary Uzbeks. Craig Murray was sacked.

This week the world saw Karimov in action again. When opponents took to the streets last Friday, the dictator ordered his troops to open fire. Uzbek official figures speak of 169 dead; human rights groups estimate the toll at between 500 and 750 - most of them unarmed.

When crowds demonstrated in Lebanon, Ukraine and Georgia, the Americans welcomed it as "people power". But the brave stand in Uzbekistan brought a different response. Washington called for "restraint" from both sides, as if the unarmed civilians were just as guilty as those shooting at them. In the past couple of days, the tune has changed slightly. Now the state department wants Tashkent to "institute real reforms" and address its "human rights problems". It is at least possible that Washington may soon decide Karimov has become an embarrassment and that he should be replaced by a new, friendlier face - but one just as reliable. A less murderous “friend” but still a “friend”.

Because, as everyone should realise by now, when it comes to oil- and gas-rich Uzbekistan, which has opened its doors to US bases and signed up to George Bush's 'war on terror, the Bush administration sees, hears and speaks no evil. Britain's stance is little better. Let's get this straight. From the American point of view, the people's overthrow of oppressive governments is commendable except when those governments are US allies working hard to do its bidding, as is the case with Uzbekistan.