Winston's ride on Patkai?

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Colin Phillips

At the Start
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I did mention this on The Leger thread but no-one responded but in the light of posts from Chris Beek and Shads, I ask the question again.

Chris said something like, everyone in Newmarket was laying the horse, and Shads, everyone knew that the horse wouldn't act on the course.

Why, on a horse that had won the Queen's Vase at Ascot, did Winston hold him up, at the back of the field, in a race run at a moderate pace?
 
For a horse everyone was laying, he didn't drift much, did he? He also arrived to win the race (traded very short in running) before hanging his chance away. The tactics have been overplayed. He didn't outstay his field in the Queen's Vase, he sprinted past them if you remember.
 
Sprinted being a relative term, of course, in a two-mile race.

Yes, he did run away from his field at Ascot but Saturday's trip was half-a-mile less, and presumably he was running against horses with a better turn of foot.

Rory, t'wasn't I that said - everyone in Newmarket was laying him. ;)
 
I didn't actually use the words "everyone in Newmarket" was laying him;

My words were;

I know pretty much everyone I knew was laying him today as Goodwood was never going to suit him.

Now I know alot of people in racing, but the whole of Newmarket I do not.
 
i'd say there are plenty of horses ridden like this every day..it's nothing unusual

it's either they are being told to hold horses up..irrelevant of pace...or the jock has no clock in his head

probably either/both
 
Colin Phillips said:
Yes, he did run away from his field at Ascot but Saturday's trip was half-a-mile less, and presumably he was running against horses with a better turn of foot.
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My points were made in general Colin. BTW, you don't need to presume regarding the horses with a turn of foot ~ we know what was in the field and not one of them could be described as having a change of gear at group level. Bear in mind that the Voltigeur, although over twelve furlongs, is essentially contested by would be two milers. Bear in mind also that it is a classic trial, and not a pot that trainers hunt on its own account, so Michael Stoute was unlikely to instruct his jockey to put the field to the sword from the front and sacrifice the St Leger then and there.
 
rorydelargy said:
Bear in mind that the Voltigeur, although over twelve furlongs, is essentially contested by would be two milers.
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As a general rule of thumb I would agree Rory; that said, I remain unconvinced that this year's winner will stay 1m6f, much less two miles. Lucarno won the race as well of course. Very much the exception rather than the rule though, as you said.
 
I wrote elsewhere:

Goodwood 2.10

Top Lock (117) is a few pounds clear on his German Derby form and I think Patkai (bottom rated on 106) is a very bad favourite, especially at the forecast odds on. I’d fancy him more to finish last.

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Looks to me like he ran pretty much to form.
 
Colin Phillips said:
and Shads, everyone knew that the horse wouldn't act on the course.
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Jeez, your memory is shocking, Colin. What I actually said was

It takes Patkai an age to get warmed up for his challenging run, today's race/trip was never going to suit him.
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...which bears little resemblance to the quote you have attributed to me. How can my personal opinion being expressed be morphed into "everyone" knowing something? It's got me knackered!
 
The horse is seriously slow.In running on betfair he was fairly strong despite always looking out of his comfort zone to me.The boys who backed him at 1-10 are nuts.
 
Reminds me Of Des Cahill's greyhound, the dog was so useless and he wanted rid of him that he brought him to the local park, let if off the leash and ran away from him.
 
Patkai worked all over a leading middle distance horse of Stoutes and a lead this morning and definitely goes for the Leger as the yards number one, Ryan Moore will ride.
 
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