Ballydoyle 2 Year Olds - 2008

Originally posted by Euronymous+Mar 30 2008, 02:26 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Euronymous @ Mar 30 2008, 02:26 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Galileo@Mar 29 2008, 10:21 PM


How about a little fun comp...Anyone care to take a guess at naming their highest rated two year old of the season?
Ven beat me to the Imperial Beauty colt so i`ll have Sea Of Maramara. [/b][/quote]
I would have went for him as well....

So I will put up- Sawtooth Mountain (USA) – Johannesburg ex American Jewel – Colt.

On a little side note, how often does A.P Indy get top class two year olds? I am under the impression the older his stock get the better?
 
I'll go for Black River Falls.

With regards to AP Indy, I have always regarded him as a siginificant stamina influence (especially in a dirt pedigree) whose progeny generally progress. That said, he has had a number of top class 2yo's. Majestic Warrior last year for example, while AP Valentine was a awesome as a 2yo.
 
Gal, first of all thanks for that, very interesting.

What we noted is that there is not a single Peintré Celebre in the lineup (or did we miss it? ), one single High Chaparral; 20 Sadlers Wells´ - that must be about his full annual crop as we were told he covers (and has covered) about 40 mares - with the usual deduction there cannot be many outside ones; and a rather "shocking" lack of support for the "lesser" Coolmore stallions.
 
To be honest I cannot think of the last Peintre Celebre Coolmore did have. Sound stallion that he is (and he is still priced like a good one as well), he has yet to produce a serious stallion prospect (that I can think of anyway). He’ll continue to do well but he is not the type that Coolmore will (or needs) to support.
 
Well, if thats the way you see it, I cannot see the need to support the likes of Montjeu and Galileo. Surely they do support themself´s as well.

(realize this sounds harsh, certainly don´t mean it that way)
 
IMO He is a good stallion and it's only a matter of time before he produces a good stallion. Pearl of love has his first yearlings this year. I don't know what his book of mares are like but he sure could shift at two. Castledale stands in the U.S. Mr Monet died he was a good candidate for stud.

On a different note I think it's a pity they don't feel some responsibility to the breed to keep different sire lines represented. The Irish national stud is not much better. The English national stud I think provides a good service with top class horses from the different lines there. I think Val Royal in particular will go from strenght to strenght.
 
Firstly Peintre Celebre is a horse I like. Fabulous racehorse who has had top class performers on the turf…Pride being the obvious one.

The comparison with Galileo and Montjeu is not accurate, imo, as they are in a different league to PC as a stallion…though the quality of mare they receive obviously has something to do with that.

Coolmore are all about making stallions….a stallion by Galileo or Montjeu is far more desirable for them based on commercial reasons alone.
 
Galileo, cetainly do not want to offend you, and really thinks its something worth discussing. But you clearly have a spelling mistake in your last posting, you certainly mean

"Ballydoyle" :)

is all about producing stallions, as its their list we are discussing.

I am not comparing montjeu, montjeu, danehill dancer etc. with PC, I have merely noted something we noted when reading through the list.

I admire all the racehorses Aidan o´Brien has produced for Coolmore so far, and will certainly continue to do, but personally I start feeling whether they start getting a bit into a one-way-street. Now surely everybody can argue that we do talk about the most successful sireline (in Europe at least) , BUT think their roster shows a frighting concentration on sons of danehill, not even Sadlers Wells anymore. He himself is represented by Galileo and Montjeu who no "normal" breeder can afford anymore, and High Chaparral, who nobody seems to want to support (anymore). the "cheap" stallions like, say, Night Shift or Antonius Pius, who will have his first 2yo runners this year, Catcher in the Rye or PC (who will now fit in this group but should really belong to another) are not supported - meaning none (OK, bar the one HC) of their offspring will get the benefit of one of the best training facilities in the world, yet about 100 breeders (per stallion) are supposed to use the respective stallion.

Surely what Coolmore does suits their own bank account, but equally surely they do not seem to care that well for smaller breeders who after all are the bread and butter of the racing world.

PS: this does not mean they didn´t look after us well, and it is fascinating to see their operation; but clearly from the small breeders point of view I have to think the above.
(And please nobody to say "If you do not have enough money, don´t breed!)
 
“Galileo, cetainly do not want to offend you, and really thinks its something worth discussing. But you clearly have a spelling mistake in your last posting, you certainly mean

"Ballydoyle" ”

Fair point!

“BUT think their roster shows a frighting concentration on sons of danehill, not even Sadlers Wells anymore. He himself is represented by Galileo and Montjeu who no "normal" breeder can afford anymore, and High Chaparral, who nobody seems to want to support (anymore). the "cheap" stallions like, say, Night Shift or Antonius Pius, who will have his first 2yo runners this year, Catcher in the Rye or PC (who will now fit in this group but should really belong to another) are not supported - meaning none (OK, bar the one HC) of their offspring will get the benefit of one of the best training facilities in the world, yet about 100 breeders (per stallion) are supposed to use the respective stallion. “

Again you make fair points, but that is how Coolmore has always operated. The other stallions you are referring to will be supported by other operations…they are under no obligation to support every sire they have. No One Coo Cat’s this season either. Danehill Dancer has only really become established in Ballydoyle since Danehill died. Before that he never really figured despite doing well from the start in his stallion career.

As for the stallion roster, again it is really nothing new…but Coolmore have shown some interest in broadening their purchases recently with Excellent Art (Pivotal) and Thewayyouare (Kingmambo).
 
Yes they seem to have decided the Dansili branch of the Danehill/Danzig line and Pivotal are worth cultivating. I thought they had supported Kingmambo for some time.
 
Thanks Galileo

a great post, really helpful.

You can view the 2009 Derby entries on the Racing Post site and it includes some other Ballydoyle entries. Are they no longer in training?

Statue of Liberty x Skidmore Girl
Rock of Gibraltar x Sudden Hope
Peintre Celebre x Tricoteuse
Montjeu x Funsie
Montjeu x Souffle
Sadlers Wells x Gwynn
Storm Cat x Quarter Moon

I'm really looking forward to the flat season
 
Originally posted by chroniclandlord@Mar 31 2008, 10:02 PM
Thanks Galileo

a great post, really helpful.

You can view the 2009 Derby entries on the Racing Post site and it includes some other Ballydoyle entries. Are they no longer in training?

Statue of Liberty x Skidmore Girl
Rock of Gibraltar x Sudden Hope
Peintre Celebre x Tricoteuse
Montjeu x Funsie
Montjeu x Souffle
Sadlers Wells x Gwynn
Storm Cat x Quarter Moon

I'm really looking forward to the flat season
Hi Chronic, sorry only just seen your post now...


Statue of Liberty x Skidmore Girl - Gluteus Maximus
Montjeu x Funsie - Sirgarfieldsobers

These two are the only extra's I know for sure are in Ballydoyle. The rest could be there and I will try to find out but alot of the time they are entered at yearling stage but often sold on.
 
I take it there is no 2yo from Imagine that you know of? She's listed as being exported to the States in 2005 although I don't know if she went to Ashford or was sold off. Any thoughts?
 
She certainly has not been sold off! Did not get in foal to have anything for 2008 but for 2009 there is a Giant's Causeway colt.
 
:clap: Excellent news! Thanks for that. Something to look forward to for next year already :D
 
Yes I don't think it will be too hard to think where that one will end up in training! Must be enjoyable training a son/daughter of two of your previous stars.
 
Late additions/amendments...

Francisco Goya B C 06 by Galileo - Onereuse (GB)
Grand Ducal B C 06 by Danehill Dancer - Mood Swings
Hard Ball (GB) B C 06 by Pivotal (GB) - Miss Pinkerton (GB)
Perfect Truth CH F 06 by Galileo - Charroux
Spira B F 06 by Sadler's Wells (USA) - Spring Flight (USA)
Tamarind B F 06 by Sadler's Wells (USA) - Sharata
Waltz B F 06 by Sadler's Wells (USA) - L'Ancresse
Born To Be King (USA) 2006 B C by Storm Cat (USA) - Quarter Moon
 
Originally posted by Galileo+Mar 29 2008, 11:51 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Galileo @ Mar 29 2008, 11:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Gareth Flynn@Mar 29 2008, 02:05 PM
Derby winner warning:

Man Of Iron (USA) – Giant’s Causeway ex Better Than Honour – Colt
Well spotted Gareth, didn't notice that was the dam of Rags To Riches and Jazil. [/b][/quote]
And the dam of Casino Drive, a son of Mineshaft, trained in Japan, who went over to (where else) Belmont last night to win the 9f, G2 Peter Pan Stakes by 5 3/4 lengths. No prizes for guessing what his next race is!
 
Just looking through the full list tonight (bit bored!), and one that caught my eye was Mr. Mistofflees. By Storm Cat from a precocious family, and I remember costing quite a bit at Calder.

Also a colt called United States (AP Indy-Blithe) was one to catch the eye for obvious reasons. $2,000,000 yearling as well.
 
The colt ex Fire The Groom is called Augustusthestrong. Half brother to Stravinsky.

Is United States in training in the US trackside because I cannot see him anywhere here.
 
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