Chasers & Hurdlers 2016/2017

Grasshopper

Grasshopper

Senior Jockey
Joined
Nov 14, 2006
Messages
16,012
Chasers
Douvan 182
Altior 175p
Cue Card 174
Thistlecrack 174
Great Field 170p (Same as the Gold Cup winner? Can't have it at all)
Fox Norton 170
Sizing John 170
Djakadam 169
Many Clouds 169
Un De Sceaux 169
Coneygree 168
Menorah 168


Hurdlers
Buveur d'Air 170
Camping Ground 166
Nicholls Canyon 165
Unowhatimeanharry 165
Yanworth 164
Arctic Fire 163
My tent Or Yours 163
Lil Rockerfeller 162
Petit Mouchoir 162
Ptiz Zig 161
Alex de Larrayda 160
Diakali 160


Other notables
Defi Du Seuil 151p
Labaik 160$
Bacardys 155p
Finians Oscar 155
Our Duke 167p
Might Bite 166
Yorkhill 161p
Min 160P
Coney Island 159p
Fayonagh 118


Others on request, as always.
 
Last edited:
Camping Ground higher rate than UKWIMH..That stopped me right in my tracks:blink:

Just goes to show that to some people if it says Group 2 then automatically u get bumped up even if you beat 2 dogs and a pregnant donkey
 
There's usually a few ratings I would quibble with, and much as I love Great Field, it takes an extreme interpretation of his form, to have him rated as high as the Gold Cup winner. I'm not as jazzed as some about last season's Gold Cup form (hence my strong advocacy of Our Duke, and to a lesser extent Might Bite, for this season's race), but it's more GF's rating that I have the problem with.

Whilst it's true that he easily beat horses who went on to win competitive spring handicaps, Timeform appear to have taken a fairly literal interpretation of that form, to derive his mark. It seems an overly-generous award to me - or should I say, it's difficult to argue convincingly that it's accurate.

All that said, having taken plenty of 25/1 for the Champion Chase, I sincerely hope they are right! :lol:
 
Last edited:
Charlie Parcs: h144

There's no essay. It only states 'Useful looking gelding', followed by a brief breeding synopsis, and a run-through of his races - oddly though, none of his 2017 outings warrant a mention (neither his fall at Kempton nor his Triumph run), and neither do his future prospects. It's almost like they got half-way through it, and then forgot to finish it.

I think they have Defi's rating quite low at 151p, which would hold CP's down, and he might be an attractive prospect in a handicap, off a similar mark. The race that Brain Power won last year, for example, might become a target, as I think connections will want to see what they've got on their hands, before considering a switch to fences.
 
Last edited:
Re Triumph: Katchit was one of the few rare winners of the race who went on to win the Champion and only Our Conor and Peace and Co were touted as possible winners recently.

Do you know how Defi's 151p C & H rating compares to any of theirs.

I would have thought the reason he is lower than you would expect is because of the aforementioned lack of success
 
Defi and Katchit were awarded the same rating (151) in the respective C&H volumes.

Timeform highlight the breeding and physical differences between the pair (Katchit Flat-bred and small, Defi from French-Jumps stock, and robust in physique), and suggest DDS will likely need to improve a bit more than Katchit did (12lbs), to win the next season's Champion Hurdle...though they counter that by saying that Defi has a lot more scope to improve (hence the 'p'), than Katchit seemed to have after his 4yo season.

They further suggest that connections might choose to go chasing with the "strong travelling" Defi Du Seuil "given that his owner already has the reigning Champion Hurdler".....though that does seem to have been ruled-out - for the time being at least.

For a point of reference, the ill-fated Our Conor was rated 165P and Peace & Co was rated at 160P, following their juvenile seasons. Neither horse won a hurdle-race in open company thereafter.

I expect the laughably-high rating for Peace & Co, probably has something to do with the circumspection around Defi Du Seuil's somewhat mean-looking number. :cool:
 
Last edited:
Here you go, granger:


Any Second Now: h138p
Sutton Place: h160
Alto Esqua: No Rating
Apple's Jade: h158
Bacardys: h155p
Monalee: h149

The no rating for Alto Esqua looks like an(other) potential oversight, given he ran once in Ireland last season (December 2016). I have tweeted Timeform to ask about this and the apparently incomplete Charli Parcs entry.
 
Last edited:
Grasshopper said:
Here you go, granger:


Any Second Now: h138p
Sutton Place: h160
Alto Esqua: No Rating
Apple's Jade: h158
Bacardys: h155p
Monalee: h149

The no rating for Alto Esqua looks like an(other) potential oversight, given he ran once in Ireland last season (December 2016). I have tweeted Timeform to ask about this and the apparently incomplete Charli Parcs entry.
Click to expand...

I see TF has given their reasons on your Twitter feed Grassy
 
Diamond Geezer said:
I see TF has given their reasons on your Twitter feed Grassy
Click to expand...

For the record, Timeform's responses were as follows:

Charli Parcs
His form when falling and when beaten in Triumph not as good as from December 2016 at Kempton - inference being it therefore didn't warrant a mention. Space pressures applicable.

Alto Esqua
Horses who ran exclusively in Ireland, are only included if rated 130+ ("AE just falls short")
 
Last edited:
A bit more for you, granger:


Any Second Now: h138p
Useful form over hurdles. Bred to stay at least 20f, remains open to improvement.

Sutton Place: h160
Bumper winner. Smart form over hurdles. Stays 21f, acts on Soft.

Apple's Jade: h158
Tall, unfurnished mare. 20f suits better than 16f (related to several decent stayers e.g. Bristol De Mai). Acts on heavy, races prominently. Good jumper.

Bacardys: h155p
Angular gelding. Looks sure to stay a good deal further than 20f, when sent over fences. Well bred (out of Robin Des Champs mare, and related to Vautour and Quevega).

Monalee: h149
Tall gelding. Smart form over hurdles. Stays 3m, acts on Heavy, and often travels strongly.
 
Last edited:
Grasshopper said:
Here you go, granger:
Click to expand...


Any Second Now: h138p - Christmas paddy power winner 2019
Sutton Place: h160 - would of won a Ryanair/King George if staying right
Alto Esqua: No Rating - Will win a race for some fun when the trainer decides so
Apple's Jade: h158 - Just below very top class hurdler - aintree hurdle winner maybe - send her chasing
Bacardys: h155p - Gold cup battle awaits in 2019
Monalee: h149 - Thyestes winner 2019
 
Last edited:
Back
Top