Cheating in relationships...

trudij

trudij

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I have a dilemma. A friend of mine has just told me that her husband has been playing away - for a good few months,and with more than one other, from the sounds of things.

She is absolutely devistated,but as I know she snogged someone that wasnt her husband before this all came up (as it were!!) surely shes not whiter than white either??

In my book,kissing someone doesnt automatically make an affair - but willingly sleeping with them, does. None of this "I was drunk" bollocks, once,maybe if you trust them and they are suitably sorry - but not more than that.

I just dont think I can help her out much - Ive never (knowingly!) been cheated on - certainally not more than drunken one night stands. Ive gone behind bofriends back before, so I dont know that i can help her much - anyone got any ideas?? ALl Ive done so far is tell her that she can call me whenever,and I will be there whatever she decides to do - but only she can decide what that is.... am i right to do that?? Loads of her other friends are telling her hes a shit,dont take him back,etc - but that to me doesnt seem very helpful in the long run - surely she has to decide for herself?? I also cant quite shake the feeling that if you are cheating,theres something wrong anyway and you need to at least talk....
 
It's not that simple Trudi, there usually a host of reasons, rights and wrongs etc If I can bring myself to, I'll PM you (that's not being sarcastic or anything) its just that I'm in a bit of hurry at the mo, and things still hurt on the historical side and always will I feel
 
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An ex-buddy of mine had a long, deep, loving, but platonic relationship with a woman who was not his wife. I found this to be far more treacherous than a couple of loveless shags but he couldn't see why I saw it that way. Was I being a bit of a girl?
 
No, AC you weren't. Had I been his wife, despite being hurt by the "loveless shags", I would have felt much more threatened by that relationship.

Trudij - if she is a close and good friend and you want to keep her so, never advise. Just support her whatever her decision.
 
I disagree. AC's ex-buddy's relationship didn't get physical and I firmly believe platonic love is non-threatening.

Trudi, I'd suggest distancing yourself from the sitch. By all means let her phone you but don't offer advice. You'll end up being blamed if your advice turns out not to have been helpful. Believe me.
 
Dessie; I think it is an interesting conundrum. What is the bigger betrayal, loving somebody or shagging somebody?

I am in the former camp, although both are treachery.
 
It is interesting. I suppose a lot depends on your own concept of love. I doubt I'd bat an eyelid if I found out Mrs Orchid had a long-term platonic friend. But if I discovered she'd sought gratification with someone else I'd break out the bubbly.
 
It's a difficult situation alright but I'd tend to agree that if he's off with lots of other women it's pretty much crystal clear that something is badly wrong with their own relationship. From my experience people who have affairs often do s since they're not happy within their own relationship and need to go elsewhere to find happiness.

That said, I'm not one who can carry on an affair whilst with someone else; it might be simplistic but I don't see the point in carrying on a relationship that is dead in the water. Once you realise you don't want to be with your partner I don't see the point in staying with them since you will only make each other unhappy in the end. I've been there; twice I have ended long term relationships as although I was very close to my partner at the time (I lived with both of them) and got on great with them I didn't love them enough to stay with them. It was hard both times but as far as I was concerned it had to be done before we ended up hating each other.

I've also been cheated on so I know what it's like and I have never and could never cheat on anyone.
 
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Marriage was invented for the propagation of the species and it worked because until recently people didn't usually live very long. Many women died in childbirth and many people died of disease, or men died in war etc etc. Marriage was never intended to be a marathon, of the sort which would be normal now if marriages lasted - 50 or 60 years. In the past the average age of a marriage was probalby aobut 10 years. At least many people are marrying later now, but that creates a different problem - the halves of a couple are very used to their own independence, their own way of doing things.... we have become in many ways more isolated and less socialised

I know of several marriages which have survived a very serious affair of one or other partner; my own didn't, but then it was broken anyway.

I also of know of couples where one partner has for a period of months or even years fallen deeply in love with another, but got over it in time. I think it's unnatural to expect that we will never again love anyone deeply except the person we choose to share our lives with.... People change, they sometimes grow in different directions and have changing needs both intellectually and emotionally - how can one person necessarily supply all that? A bit more pragmatism and understanding woudl keep a lot of marriages going, which if there are children is very desirable.

A strong partnership or marriage will allow space to breathe, and will survive some degree of relationship outside itself. When it comes down to serial self-indulgence however, which is usually the case and seems to be the case here, then there is not much to be said or done. On the other hand, a few women I know who are married to serial philanderers just turn a blind eye. They are wise to do so if the marriage or partnership is otherwise strong and rewarding, and so long as they are not pubicly humiliated by it - ie, a little discretion is employed. There are men to whom such things mean very little.

The point for me here is that they ARE married - and that is in my book a life committment, whatever parameters you create for your own version. Every marriage is its own secret world. There is nothing you can do Trudi but listen, and perhaps advise them to sit down and talk. Don't get too involved.
 
ALl Ive done so far is tell her that she can call me whenever,and I will be there whatever she decides to do - but only she can decide what that is.... am i right to do that??
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phew - at least Im doing right by not ploughing in!! I think shes hoping I can shed some light on why people cheat cos she knows that in the past Ive hardly been the most fidel(is that a word??!!) person - but just because I know why Ive done it, it doesnt follow that his reasons are the same.(just for the record,in the past - Ive never slept with someone else while Ive been seeing someone - but theres been enough regular contact to be classed as a fling.the main one was married himself - and I considered what he was doing to his wife FAR worse than what I was doing to my alcoholic boyfriend!)HHaving said that - he wasnt cheating on me (with wifey) in my mind cos I knew all about her - what he chose to risk was up to him.(does that make sense?? I does to me,but I know what I mean!!):lol:

FWIW I dont think a loveless one night stand is the same thing as an affair at all - we all do stupid stuff when drunk (for example) its how you choose to deal with it after that counts.

However - I do agree with the people who say that marriage vows are "sacred" - its not something you should go into lightly. I can well understand being able to love more than one person at a time-but surely a marriage or a long term relationship (cos lets face it - once you decide to commit to each other in whatever way,be it marriage or living together or even just to be exclusive!) you should honour that (in my book!)

oh what a tangled web people weave....
 
I think you're right n saying there was a problem in the relationship, Trudi and they needed to sit down and thrash it out to find a way to keep it going if thats what she wants ultimately.
I knew a woman who treated her OH as a bit of a dog on a leash, at her back and call for her every whim. She was off galivanting around the place, ignoring him when it suited her so it was hardly suprising he found comfort elsewhere. I think a few women may be suprised to know that alot of men have emotional as well as physical needs.
 
Oh I dont know,shes not like that at all - if anything shes a bit of a wallflower(shes more shy than I am!!) - i feel really awkward, my usual reaction would be to just say its not my business,and try to stay out of it - but shes made it my business by asking me in the first place!!!

Shes moved in with a friend for the moment,while she "considers her position" - to be honest, I think I watch too much Jeremy Kyle - Im a big fan of what I know of councelling - and maybe,if they want to save the relationship, thats the way for them to go - if only to let her come to terms with it and move on.
By all accounts, its some young dolly bird he works with that hes had/having the affair with, so maybe, just maybe he will come to his senses and realise what hes messsed up.(lets face it - it worked in Love Actually - Alan Rickman went back to Emma Thompson after a flipn with s bimbo!!!)

I jsut hate them being sad - they are lovely. Im not taking sides,thats not fair.(nad would be very hipocrtical!!!)
 
I would agree that something may be fundamentally wrong if he feels the need to go elsewhere(I would tell her to not think for one instance her kissing someone else is in anyway the same degree of action he has taken), but some men do because they can. And women for that matter. Both sometimes just because they have 'egos', fragile or big, which feel the need. She should think things out carefully before having the big discussion and be as prepared as she can for any answers/explanations he comes back with. Does she want to stay with him - really stay with him? If he has done it once, or more as you stated she thinks, he will keep on doing it so it's her who has the decision to make. Two of my married male friends at the moment are involved with other women. Their wives know, they chose not to do anything about it. All you can for now is listen if she needs you.
 
Are we forgetting that sleeping with someone who you shouldn't is really exciting and for some people a massive turn on? In the cold light of day it may be more "fashionable" or in your circle "acceptable" to be with your current partner but sleeping away from home has been and always will be the apple in Adam and Eves garden.
 
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Surely a lot also depends on the ages of those involved too - plus their financial and work status? I see where you're going with your analysis, Headstrong - a couple of centuries ago, life expectancy was shorter - especially for women and it was 'accepted' that women were chattels and therefore fidelity wasn't an expectation for men.

Nowadays, with almost one in three marriages ending, it's become almost accepted that problems will occur during a marriage! Giving advice to anyone else on what they should do about a partner's unfaithfulness is treading on deadly dodgy ground in my experience - all you can do is just be there for a good friend and try to stay as neutral as possible.

Some marriages/long-term relationships can survive affairs - others can't.

An's example is an interesting one - if his ex-buddy's relationship is truly platonic, it's exceptionally unusual! However, if that's the case, then how is it any different to a similar friendship with any close male friend?

In virtually every case I've ever come across where infidelity has occurred, there's usually a pretty even division of blame as to why it's happened and Trood's friend would probably do well to look long and hard at her own behaviour to see why it's happened - and the longer you've been together, the more likely it is that it's a 50/50 situation!

I also find it incredibly distasteful that so-called 'close friends' (or anyone else for that matter) take it upon themselves to inform the partner who is unaware of the affair. Who are they benefitting?

Absolutely no-one. If there are children involved, then the informant is actively malicious, as the kids are the true 'victims' when an outsider decides to become the messenger. If the other partner has been blissfully ignorant and their life is perfectly acceptable, then what's the point other than the obvious buzz it must have given the informer......

It may be a different case if no children are involved, granted but it's still unacceptable behaviour to inform 'friends/acquaintances' of their partner's supposed infidelities in my opinion and says an awful lot more about their character than ever it does about the one playing away....
 
Have you got any type of connection with her husband/partner? Or are you just a mutual acquaintance to him?

Agree with most sentiments above, tell her you will be there for her as a friend for support and encouragement, but its up to her to make the decisions of how she wants to sort out the situation.
 
they are both friends of mine - hence my desire to keep out of it!! Ive told them both that I am not going to take sides,and that I think they need to talk to some kind of councellor (that isnt me!!!!) I am, and will endeavour to remain, friends with them both, either as a couple or seperately.Ive got no idea how easy thats going to be, guess I'll find out soon enough!!
 
Colin Phillips said:
"In the past the average age of a marriage was probalby aobut 10 years."

Any stats to back up that statement, Heads?
You seem way off the beam there, m'dear.
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Not at all offbeam Colin. Life expectancy has doubled then tripled in the last 100 years, compared to what it was in the West at least for most of historically recorded time - certainly for ordinary working people. It was rare enough for anyone to live past 40 let alone for both halves of a couple to do so, therefore the chance of a marriage lasting over 20 or even 10 years was historically quite small. Short serial marriages were quite common, evne among the rich
 
Not so much the middle ages, but the two big step changes came at the end of the C19th, then after the war, with the welfare state.

Graveyards esp up North are full of gravestones of children and of young women who died eg in childbirth etc etc

The point I was making, is that trying to keep a monogomous marriage going over a very long period of time, is a very new challenge for humanity. We are not rising to it well so far! - and it can only really be done imo with a lot of social control mechanisms (eg via religious pressures) - or with (as in the past) a degree of hypocrisy or broad tolerance
 
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