Cue Card

T

treetangle

At the Start
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
290
Three runs from horses who finished behind - the first two in the Aintree bumper and a horse who should have won a novice at Kempton yesterday. He looks an exceptional prospect. Is anyone else concerned about Tizzard riding him over hurdles? Personally, I think it is a bigger worry than Brian O'Connell and Dunguib.
 
he won me so much at Cheltenham that Joe Tizzard is better than McCoy Walsh and Geraghty put together and he can ride the bloody horse forever:p
 
Galileo said:
Any prospect of him being sold?
Click to expand...

Apparantly,the owners have already turned down offers and if he was going to be sold I suspect it would already have happened. It is their horse of a lifetime and they strike me as being pretty loyal. Most of their horses have been placed with middle division trainers. As far as I am aware Tizzard will have never have ridden anything similar. It is one thing travelling round on the bridle in a bumper another thing altogether over obstacles. No problem with him initially taking the ride but for the sake of the horse how long do you stay loyal if things go wrong? The whole family connection probably complicates things even further.
 
Last edited:
Whilst I agree with you Treetangle over your preference that Tizzard isn't on board, I really cannot agree with you that Tizzard has never "ridden anything similar". In his brief tenure at Nicholls' as stable jockey he will have ridden plenty of horses of similar, even superior, quality - remember an old nag he used to ride called See More Business??
 
Hidden Universe franked the form again today in Limerick. Very snug winner of a bumper, and the front two pulled clear.
 
Shadow Leader said:
Whilst I agree with you Treetangle over your preference that Tizzard isn't on board, I really cannot agree with you that Tizzard has never "ridden anything similar". In his brief tenure at Nicholls' as stable jockey he will have ridden plenty of horses of similar, even superior, quality - remember an old nag he used to ride called See More Business??
Click to expand...

I am not talking about overall quality, I was talking about riding a horse with plenty of speed over two miles. Cue Card would have laughed at See More Business in a two mile bumper.
 
Except SMB didn't need to get warmed up with soppy Bumpers first - he just went straight into hurdling and ripped off four straight wins including Group level... and the rest is history. If this nag can laugh at SMB in ten years' time, I'll buy the forum a round of drinks. With twirly cocktail umbrellas, if you insist.
 
See More Business could raise a right gallop! As for not having ridden horses with plenty of speed over two miles - for starters, he rode Flagship Uberalles to enough wins, including in a Tingle Creek. So, really, that theory doesn't hold much water.
 
krizon said:
Except SMB didn't need to get warmed up with soppy Bumpers first - he just went straight into hurdling and ripped off four straight wins including Group level... and the rest is history. If this nag can laugh at SMB in ten years' time, I'll buy the forum a round of drinks. With twirly cocktail umbrellas, if you insist.
Click to expand...

What has this got to do with 10 years time? Are you seriously suggesting See More Business could have won the Festival Bumper on the bridle? He would have been lucky to have finished halfway. With Cue Card we are talking about a potential Supreme Novices horse. Whatever races See More Business racked up that race was never on the agenda because basically he was too slow.
 
Tizzards most notable skills were on display at both the Cheltenham and Aintree Festivals, mainly on Hey Big Spender.
 
I'm sure I remember Nicholls saying he's never seen a horse as quick over five-furlongs as See More Business.
 
What I'm saying is that SMB didn't need to win a Bumper to becoming a long-time, top-grade horse. You seem to be implying that winning a Bumper or two means there's another genius chaser in the making, Treetangle, but Bumpers equate to diddly-squat. They're intended to get some wannabe chasers acquainted with courses, and aren't an end in themselves. With Bumpers you're talking about potential, full stop. Let's see how CUE CARD does once he's tackling obstacles, and shows he isn't a one-trick wonder. The road to chasing stardom is littered with bright Bumper horses who showed all the potential in the world - and failed when push came to shove.

But your beef was about Joe Tizz riding, not the qualities of SMB or any other brilliant chaser, to which the riposte was that he'd ridden something none too shabby on a few occasions. But I guess it doesn't really matter what anyone says to you, because you seem to have a mind cast in concrete when anyone offers up an alternative point of view. C'est la vie - I don't actually care enough to continue.
 
This thread makes Joe Tizzard out to be a mug and a liability to a up coming young novice. He has ridden two of most memorable horses of the early noughties in See More Business and Flagship Uberalles so to suggest that he will not be able to handle such a quick horse jumping hurdles is possibly the greatest load of bollobks I have seen on the forum in at least 4 days.
 
Bit of a backlash against Treetangle here - I'm guessing that non-one followed his advice to back Cue Card for the bumper ;)

Let's be reasonable re: Joe Tizzard - his tenure as Paul Nicholls' stable jockey wasn't an unalloyed success by any means and even his closest family wouldn't call him a great jockey. Good lad, honest, solid, hardworking, a vital cog in the family operation etc but he's no better in the saddle now than he was as a teenager and the task of turning Cue Card into a potential champion isn't an easy one. Joe may come up trumps but it's perfectly reasonable for Treetangle to be a trifle concerned.

Regarding his handling of See More Business - if you look at the record of certain jockeys on the horse then Andrew Thornton's 2 from 2 including a King George stands out but I don't see many defending him as a decent jockey (and rightly so).
 
Hopefully, this forum isn't just about tipping 40/1 winners, otherwise I am in trouble. Hardly a backlash, basically one person talking nonsense, not for first time in my short time on here so I should be used to it by now.

This thread was about arguably the most exciting horse going jumping next season, not All Our Yesterdays. Like them or not, bumpers are important and the Festival version is extremely competitive. Few involved would refer to it as 'soppy'. Many great horses started off in bumpers including the best of them all so it really is pretty silly to knock them for the purposes of casting a few misguided stones.

My point again for those who didn't get it the first time was that as far as I am aware Tizzard has not ridden a top class two mile hurdler.

Flagship Uberalles was a chaser (he was beaten in two starts over hurdles when partnered by Tizzard) probably best known for that slow motion finish at Cheltenham. See More Business was a three mile chaser who never ran at a distance below 2m4f - Tizzard was 1/6 on the horse, the only victory coming in a three horse race.
 
Back
Top