Free entry - a monster success at Ascot

krizon

krizon

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Not restricting entry to online-only petitioners, Ascot opened its doors for a historic first free entry fixture this afternoon, more than doubling their meeting's intake last year of just over 8,000 to more than 19,000. The bookies were very busy with old and new customers and it would seem that the exercise was a huge success. The card wasn't restricted to low-quality races, either, so it wasn't a bargain basement effort.

Big Mac drew mixed reactions about bookies displaying their SPs in decimals instead of fractions, from "I dunno what you mean, mate" to "excellent idea - I could understand them immediately", so it seems that the jury's out on decimalising that for now. Big Mac's feeling is that old-time punters will know what they're getting anyway, with only newbies finding the decimals possibly easier than fractions, but there didn't seem to be a huge swell of positive or negative either way.

Both were Racing for Change initiatives and while the issue of decimals doesn't seem to be of much interest, if the other courses offering free entry this week have the sort of uptake Ascot's had, it can surely only be good for the product? My caveat is why restrict it to online only? A spokesman for RfC was about to go on about H&S (courses do have max crowd levels), but Big Mac cut him off short about that. Obviously, today was well within Ascot's safety remit, but avoiding overruns has to be a consideration at small tracks where safety numbers are regulated to no more than 10,000.
 
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I don't know how anyone could prefer to see 3.33 to 100/30 - that and apparently the bookmakers boards could only go to 1 decimal place so there was no 11/4 equivalent or 9/4, 8/11, 4/6 etc.

Call me old fashioned but I much prefer the fractions - even the books who take it to the extremes with 17/4, 41/10 and the like.

Don't see the point of the free entry either - it's not like Ascot will start doing it for all meetings, you only need to look at Towcester to see that it's an amazing success.

Sadly the money men running British racecourses would sooner see 5,000 turn up at £20 a head than 10,000 turn up and pay nothing.
 
How does Towcester fund its necessary staffing and amenities - anybody have a clue? It's all right saying all racing should be free, but we know it can't be. Insurance costs alone are humungous since they have to cover every numpty who can't read PUSH or PULL on a door (and by God, I could measure them in their thousands by now!) and gets a bloody nose demonstrating his illiteracy, then tries to sue the course. The costs of just hiring doctors, vets, and all the other support staff are huge. I realise that the bung from SIS goes a long towards all this, but even so, how can one course go it alone free, and with a restricted season at that?
 
I'd prefer 4.33 to 3.33 but would still much rather have 100/30.

It will also be more confusing for punters if they see 3.33 on the bookmakers electronic displays and 3.95 on the Tote screens they're more inclined to bet with the Tote.
 
Irish Stamp said:
Don't see the point of the free entry either - it's not like Ascot will start doing it for all meetings, you only need to look at Towcester to see that it's an amazing success.
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If you build it (and give them the first go for free) they will come.
 
Shame Ascot couldn't sort their usual departments out today. A friend of mine rang to book for the Royal meeting and was asked to call back tomorrow as they were racing today.

Cue a sarcastic response from said friend when enquiring if the ticket staff were leading the horses round in the paddock.
 
That sounds like the sort of thing they would do,good riposte!

Kri, presumably Brighton were approached about making tomorrows' evening meet free entry.
A little surprised they didn't go for it although presumably they didn't feel it was financially viable.
Was the crowd for last weeks' evening meet higher than what they normally get for a day meet?
Seems to me like an ideal track to hold a few more evening meets during the summer.
 
I was being cheeky Irish Stamp, but I see they have actually gone with 3.33 = 100/30. Apologies. But why? Like you say it just puts them at a PR disadvantage with the tote and the exchanges.
 
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That's my view too Betsmate - you might as well show your prices in fractions, decimals, US, Italian and RFC Decimal Interpretation odds. It's a poorly thought out idea IMO though could work if they decided to introduce it properly.
 
The attendance figures are indeed pretty interesting - lets hope they are being encouraged when they get there to return.
 
Irish Stamp said:
apparently the bookmakers boards could only go to 1 decimal place so there was no 11/4 equivalent or 9/4, 8/11, 4/6 etc.
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I don't know where you received that information, Martin, but it is incorrect - they were displaying to 2 decimal places.

The whole idea of decimalising odds is still bollocks though, in my opinion.
 
Thanks SL - it was the impression I was given by McCririck and Barry Dennis on ATR.

Good to hear that they were able to do 2 decimal places but I don't suppose RFC have thought about who'll be buying the bookies new boards at 8k a pop should they attempt to implement this on a permanent basis.

RFC would be better off attempting to get all bookmakers betting to the accepted industry standard place terms, there are a few who bet to the old terms but far too often you see 1/5 1-2-3 on 16 runner handicaps and even 1/6 or 1/7 on occasion in smaller field races.
 
I agree with you, unfortunately now nothing can be done [it's no longer legal to force them to] to make books bet to terms, even though in my opinion it would be a good move.

I wouldn't pay any attention to what McCririck was saying and even less to what fat lad Dennis was saying - Dennis doesn't have a clue what's going on and all his quotes to the papers are laughable since he invariably is giving out on something about which he knows nothing. It was hilarious that he gave out so many expert opinions on the Kempton AW betting markets; even more so that he claimed that he was 'holding up the ring' along with Ladbrokes and Hills - please, someone, do notify me when he bothers turning up for these race meetings!!!!!! Dennis' specialty is talking out of his not inconsiderable backside.
 
Arkwright: I've no idea if Brighton was approached about hosting a free meeting. Can't help out on that without asking (which I might if I remember tomorrow). The paying turn-out was as good or better than if it had been a day meeting, but the pre-booked hospitality was almost zero. Be interesting to see if tomorrow's second evening meet goes down any better with the post-work crowd, particularly as it's TGIT - Thursday evenings usually being a popular time for Brighton's young people to hit the town.
 
krizon said:
How does Towcester fund its necessary staffing and amenities - anybody have a clue? It's all right saying all racing should be free, but we know it can't be. Insurance costs alone are humungous since they have to cover every numpty who can't read PUSH or PULL on a door (and by God, I could measure them in their thousands by now!) and gets a bloody nose demonstrating his illiteracy, then tries to sue the course. The costs of just hiring doctors, vets, and all the other support staff are huge. I realise that the bung from SIS goes a long towards all this, but even so, how can one course go it alone free, and with a restricted season at that?
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Towcester manage it mainly because they own and run all the things on the racecourse. Whereas many racecourse will lease the restaurants, and retail premises, anything to do with food/drink etc. or anything on the course selling anything, Towcester run them themselves and that's how they make their money. Whether they actually make a profit, I have no idea, but I doubt they'd still be doing the free tickets if they were making a loss, but that's how they try and make a go of it for free, anyway.
 
I'd always presumed the odds were originally geared towards the wealthier racegoers to simplify how much they would need to bet to win £100 (or possibly 100 Guineas), therefore 100/30 meant they'd have to bet 30 to win 100, hence 100/8, 100/7, 100/6, etc., meaning punters weren't encouraged to go in too heavily on longshots.

Changing these odds to 12/1, 14/1, 16/1, etc turned the percentages much more in bookies' favour. I'm cheeky enough to, on the now very rare visit to the track, ask for £100 to £8 about a 12/1 shot.

I'm against decimalisation and would prefer to see a return to 100/y etc.

However, I'm realist enough to accept that I'll be pushing up the daisies soon enough and that it doesn't really matter to me all that much in the big scheme of things!
 
Thanks for your response re Towcester, Simon, but that still doesn't quite answer it for me. Arena Leisure turned its contract caterers into staff when it began doing its own in-house catering a few years ago. It also has its own stalls handlers. On the busier days, it does have in an assortment of mobile caterers, but they all pay for their pitches, of course, as they do everywhere.

I still don't see how you can not charge an entry fee and pay all of your permanent staff, casual raceday and catering staff, groundsmen, grounds and buildings maintenance, utilities, insurance, fees to professional bodies, etc. For example, it might not ever water the track, but, if it does, unless it has its own borehole, it'll cost thousands just to do that. Even if you run with a minimum of office staff, they still cost thousands, have to take paid holidays, just like any other commercial business. It just doesn't stack up. They must be doing a helluva lot of non-racing events to make the place pay for its racing, so one can't, in that case, say that racing pays its way.
 
Kri, not to put a finer point on it but they don't exactly over staff at Towcester. Getting a drink on the busy days can be a nightmare. There are a lot of volunteers and the track is not huge so probably does not need huge staff numbers. I don't think they water either. They also do weddings there and maybe some conferences but i'm not sure how many.

I don't think it's too difficult to see how it stacks up though. They will get the same revenues as other courses in terms of TV and bookmakers (All the pitches are always taken) and then you just need to think about the spend per head after that. If every punter comes in and spends on average £15 behind the bar say (They will take all of the bar money), if they get a crowd of 5000 thats £75000. If they charged £15 entry I reckon they'd struggle to get 1000 people through the door and using the same spend per head as above they'd only take £30,000. Even if they got 2000 through the door they'd still be down. These are totally hypothetical figures but i'm just trying to illustrate a point.

Most businesses when trying to expand will sacrifice margin for turnover which is all Towcester has done here and they've made it work because they've probably trebled raceday takings due to the massive increase in crowds.

I think the phrase is speculate to accumulate
 
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