Grand National 2009
- Thread starter Ricko
- Start date
Euronymous
Senior Jockey
Depends whether Denman turns up or not.
Powerscourt
At the Start
Snowy Morning may be the one if he is given a less prominent ride.
I remember Hedgehunter in his first national where too much use was made of him and he fell at the last when beaten. Next year connections used different tactics and won.
Ruby may be on Snowy next year when the horse will be nine years old.
I remember Hedgehunter in his first national where too much use was made of him and he fell at the last when beaten. Next year connections used different tactics and won.
Ruby may be on Snowy next year when the horse will be nine years old.
Shadow Leader
At the Start
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2003
- Messages
- 9,884
Gwanako is a pony. He might've won over the fences but I can't see him winning a National - it surprised me enough that he got around in the Topham.
As rightly pointed out elsewhere by DO, Snowy is likely to have a big weight next year. In fact, if he goes to Punchestown now and runs anywhere close to Neptune Collonges then he'll be guaranteed to carry a similar weight next year to the likes of Knowhere etc did this time
If SM wasn't going to Punchestown I would strongly consider backing him every week between now and next years National.I really don't like backing horses who turn out again after the National and after his flop at Punchestown last year I am amazed they are going back for more of the same.Look at the big picture boys -run in the Hennessey receiving lumps off Denman and then the National-everything else is trivia.
Powerscourt
At the Start
Would agree with that Headstrong ... I think going to Punchestown would be a negative for the horse.
Next year ...Snowy may end up running in hurdle races just to keep his weight down which is really a shame... but that is just the way it is ..
Next year ...Snowy may end up running in hurdle races just to keep his weight down which is really a shame... but that is just the way it is ..
Desert Orchid
Senior Jockey
- Joined
- Aug 2, 2005
- Messages
- 24,803
Yet Mr Frisk came out and smashed the track record in the Whitbread. I reckon each horse should be taken on its own merits but we're at the mercy of trainers who think they know about the well-being of their charges.
To balance that assertion, it has to be recognised that only a race itself tells us for certain. I remember trying to play a very important cup-tie only three days after a league decider. I was totally knackered on the Sunday evening yet felt 110% on the Tuesday. I was buzzing for the first 25 minutes of the second game but suddenly my legs turned leaden and became very painful as though right through to the bone. I was a total waste of space from that point on and had to be subbed early in the second half. I imagine a lot of horses will give off all the right signals in training a few days after a hard race but a proper race will find it out.
To balance that assertion, it has to be recognised that only a race itself tells us for certain. I remember trying to play a very important cup-tie only three days after a league decider. I was totally knackered on the Sunday evening yet felt 110% on the Tuesday. I was buzzing for the first 25 minutes of the second game but suddenly my legs turned leaden and became very painful as though right through to the bone. I was a total waste of space from that point on and had to be subbed early in the second half. I imagine a lot of horses will give off all the right signals in training a few days after a hard race but a proper race will find it out.
Desert Orchid
Senior Jockey
- Joined
- Aug 2, 2005
- Messages
- 24,803
I really don't think that will make any difference to what the handicapper will do.
If SM goes hurdling the handiapper will simply ignore the form altogether and go back to yesterday's run. I can't see the horse getting any less than 11-10.
Powerscourt
At the Start
Agreed Desert Orchid ....if he gets 11.10 he would have little chance of winning it.
Definitely - he's what I call a 'proper National horse' and it would be awful if he never got the chance to win it.
Same goes for quite a few others. the handicapping really does need looking at. Denman will of course be the fly in the ointment, as they are almost certain to enter him whether they run him or not.
Same goes for quite a few others. the handicapping really does need looking at. Denman will of course be the fly in the ointment, as they are almost certain to enter him whether they run him or not.
Euronymous
Senior Jockey
It would have to be a terrible renewal for Slim Pickings to win one.
BlazingWalker
At the Start
Anything under 20/1 & carrying less than 11st 
Chelsea Harbour would be of interest if having a few pounds less.
ANybody fancy Cloudy Lane to come back next year & win?
Chelsea Harbour would be of interest if having a few pounds less.
ANybody fancy Cloudy Lane to come back next year & win?
No. Even the McCains have admitted CL's not really ideal for the race or the course
I don't agree it would be a bad renewal if Slim Pickings won it. The GN has in the past been a race where horses can do well enough getting round and learning the course, then come back and win. but the handicapper no longer gives them that chance.
As was noted above, the handicapper now adopts a 'one strike and you're out' policy and that imo is unfair. It also leads to trainers being tempted to run horses long before they are ready, so as nto to waste their careers 'in waiting'. It's a problem which imo needs to be addressed. The GN used to be the culmination of a career, not a one-off, when you had to hide and hedge your horse's talent to get there at all!
Desert Orchid
Senior Jockey
- Joined
- Aug 2, 2005
- Messages
- 24,803
I totally agree.
The handicapper's job is to give each horse an equal chance. I'm always defending him but I can't defend his treatment of some of the beaten horses in the National.
I was quite happy with the ride. He ran prominently early and was allowed drop back to about 7th/8th for a few fences when the field thinned out, before coming through again, which he managed primarily on jumping. When the handicapper gives a relatively inexperienced horse a decent chance of winning, you want to give yourself every chance of still being there with 5 or 6 fences to jump.
As stated above while the handicapper underrated him this year, he's almost certain to overrate him next year.
As stated above while the handicapper underrated him this year, he's almost certain to overrate him next year.
Because he finished so close it seems silly to think that Snowy Morning needs chasing experience. Amazing how well he jumped given the hairy round in the Bobbyjo, but maybe getting another chase into the horse this season is something to do with that. I'm sure he wont see a fence until February next year. (that is if they have a handicap mark to protect)