Ken Bigley murdered
- Thread starter 221bar1
- Start date
Desperate Dan
Senior Jockey
Very,very sad.No doubt Connolly will be sending the family his sincere condolensces.
at a show somewhere it was widely reported that he said in reference to Mr Bigley " I don't know about you but I wish they would just get on with it"
someone in the audience then stood up and retorted " but you are talking about someones life Billy"
BC replied " F**K off"
He then went on to make a remark about Mr Bigleys Thai wife.
someone in the audience then stood up and retorted " but you are talking about someones life Billy"
BC replied " F**K off"
He then went on to make a remark about Mr Bigleys Thai wife.
If true it's very sad but was also almost inevitable.
However, the risk was always there - why else would they be paid so much to work in Iraq - and therefore Mr Bigley's family would do well to stop throwing accusations about and just preserve a dignified silence and mourn in private.
However, the risk was always there - why else would they be paid so much to work in Iraq - and therefore Mr Bigley's family would do well to stop throwing accusations about and just preserve a dignified silence and mourn in private.
He has/had worked for a middle eastern company for 7 years so was not an opportunist.
Songsheet, maybe you would think differently if you were one of the family, we live in a terrorist era where mostly innocent people are losing their lives due to political agendas.
Songsheet, maybe you would think differently if you were one of the family, we live in a terrorist era where mostly innocent people are losing their lives due to political agendas.
A
Ardross
Guest
The BBC at present say it is unconfirmed .The only thing that surprises me is that it is Abu Dhabi TV rather than it appearing on a website and being handed to Al Jazeera
The way he has been treated is indefensible - there can be no disagreement with that.
But no one made Mr Bigley go out there (not that I am aware of, anyway) and again, he wasn't out there as a charity/Aid worker either. He went there to earn more money than he presumably could in the UK. That was a calculated risk he no doubt didn't think he would end up paying for. So what if he's worked for Middle Eastern companies previously? Most people that I have known who've worked in the Middle East have done so because they earn far more than they do here and don't pay tax - what's not opportunist about that!?
Of course his family were going to make every effort they could do achieve his release and I certainly don't blame them for doing so but - and this is a huge but - everyone knows the terms upon which foreign nationals operate on in countries such as these. Mr Bigley's family seem reasonably intelligent and they aren't blind - they knew when he went out there that this government would not be seen to do deals with terrorists (which isn't the same as saying they never have or never will - just that it won't be in the public domain) and working in Iraq was hugely risky as a British national.
I am not saying he deserved his fate - anything but - no one deserves to be kept in terror as he obviously was - it's just I can't be surprised or even shocked that it's happened.
I just feel a whole lot sorrier for the families of those men in the Armed Forces who have died in Iraq, because they joined up in the belief that serving in the Armed Forces means defending your country and knowing that you may pay the ultimate price doing so, not invading another country illegally, under false pretences and then dying because of two power-crazed politicians with an eye to the main chance. Now they do have a just grievance in my book!
But no one made Mr Bigley go out there (not that I am aware of, anyway) and again, he wasn't out there as a charity/Aid worker either. He went there to earn more money than he presumably could in the UK. That was a calculated risk he no doubt didn't think he would end up paying for. So what if he's worked for Middle Eastern companies previously? Most people that I have known who've worked in the Middle East have done so because they earn far more than they do here and don't pay tax - what's not opportunist about that!?
Of course his family were going to make every effort they could do achieve his release and I certainly don't blame them for doing so but - and this is a huge but - everyone knows the terms upon which foreign nationals operate on in countries such as these. Mr Bigley's family seem reasonably intelligent and they aren't blind - they knew when he went out there that this government would not be seen to do deals with terrorists (which isn't the same as saying they never have or never will - just that it won't be in the public domain) and working in Iraq was hugely risky as a British national.
I am not saying he deserved his fate - anything but - no one deserves to be kept in terror as he obviously was - it's just I can't be surprised or even shocked that it's happened.
I just feel a whole lot sorrier for the families of those men in the Armed Forces who have died in Iraq, because they joined up in the belief that serving in the Armed Forces means defending your country and knowing that you may pay the ultimate price doing so, not invading another country illegally, under false pretences and then dying because of two power-crazed politicians with an eye to the main chance. Now they do have a just grievance in my book!
Desperate Dan
Senior Jockey
I find it difficult to believe how anybody cannot be "shocked" by the beheading of an innocent man.
I cannot say I agree with you here, Julie.
That implies that the entire Arab world is unsafe for Westerners, a fact that Jon will certainly not agree with. I applied for a job in Kuwait last year, partly for monetary reasons and partly to gain life experience. Had I been abducted and killed, I would like to think I would not be slagged for going and that there would be sadness when I die.
That implies that the entire Arab world is unsafe for Westerners, a fact that Jon will certainly not agree with. I applied for a job in Kuwait last year, partly for monetary reasons and partly to gain life experience. Had I been abducted and killed, I would like to think I would not be slagged for going and that there would be sadness when I die.
Merlin the Magician
At the Start
and the statement made by B/C was a cruel blow..... I supposed he was pissed again on stage??.....also to belittle the guys wife is not on either..............
But these people are for real!! they are brought up with different values!! to westerners and to die doing what they are doing is martydom to these people, they are fanatics through and through................
But these people are for real!! they are brought up with different values!! to westerners and to die doing what they are doing is martydom to these people, they are fanatics through and through................
Merlin the Magician
At the Start
pardon?????????????? who you talking too?
Its common knowledge broadcast on( all news media) how come you see them as different when the world wide consensus says it daily, hourly, by the minute............
that these people are fanatics I cant see no reason why I can't call them the same as everyone else calls them?...........................
Its common knowledge broadcast on( all news media) how come you see them as different when the world wide consensus says it daily, hourly, by the minute............
that these people are fanatics I cant see no reason why I can't call them the same as everyone else calls them?...........................
Shadow Leader
At the Start
- Joined
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- 9,884
Not good news, sympathies to the family.
Unfortunately the situation in Iraq is getting out of hand and the Iraqi extremists are aware now that they can, literally, kidnap people and execute them without fear of retribution. What can be done about this I really do not know, but something has to be done or the situation will only escalate.
I think that those of you who are arguing about Songsheet's post have escaped the point she is trying to make - I have no doubt whatsoever that she finds the situation deplorable but she also makes a very good point. Ken Bigley stayed in Iraq to work when he knew he was living in a war zone and that as a British National, he would be unsafe. I'd like to point out that this will have no doubt been against the advice of the Foreign Office, who publish lists of places they have advised against travel to, both on the internet and on teletext. The situation that arose was both horrendous & unforgivable, but Ken Bigley and his family also knew that by remaining in Iraq against FO recommendations his life was in a great deal of danger. In case anyone is interested, here is what the FO currently have to say about British Nationals in Iraq - Foreign Office Advice
Unfortunately the situation in Iraq is getting out of hand and the Iraqi extremists are aware now that they can, literally, kidnap people and execute them without fear of retribution. What can be done about this I really do not know, but something has to be done or the situation will only escalate.
I think that those of you who are arguing about Songsheet's post have escaped the point she is trying to make - I have no doubt whatsoever that she finds the situation deplorable but she also makes a very good point. Ken Bigley stayed in Iraq to work when he knew he was living in a war zone and that as a British National, he would be unsafe. I'd like to point out that this will have no doubt been against the advice of the Foreign Office, who publish lists of places they have advised against travel to, both on the internet and on teletext. The situation that arose was both horrendous & unforgivable, but Ken Bigley and his family also knew that by remaining in Iraq against FO recommendations his life was in a great deal of danger. In case anyone is interested, here is what the FO currently have to say about British Nationals in Iraq - Foreign Office Advice
Merlin the Magician
At the Start
The people doing the beheading I thought that was quite obvious Paul..... but feel you could have thought me as referring to your thread, as it was not on here when I started writing and I was interrupted by a phone call WITHOUT SEEING YOUR THREAD.... sods law ? 
I can understand people disagreeing with the war, even if I don't agree with them. However, I also think that those who hold that view need to realise that these murders are designed to cause exactly the reaction seen in this country since poor Bigley was kidnapped. If you don't agree with the war then fine, but we are in Iraq now and walking away isn't a realistic option, so we should be united in the battle to prevent these murderers from getting what they want.
Merlin the Magician
At the Start
7-48 yours 7-49 mine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 
oh sorry John oh thats o/k Paul!!!!!
oh sorry John oh thats o/k Paul!!!!!
A
Ardross
Guest
Today is not the day for debates but for condolences . I can't imagine what they must be feeling like it is beyond belief and comprehension one's heart goes out to all his family
Desperate Dan
Senior Jockey
As do I.It is totally inapprropiate at this time to do anything but offer sincere condolences to his family who have tonight behaved with incredible dignity.
Ian Davies
At the Start
I admire his family for refusing to shut up like the Foreign Office told them to and doing everything they could to save him.
There is no ''wider picture'' where your loved ones are concerned, and you don't care if negotiations lead to a million subsequent abductions - blood is thicker than water and no one will ever change that.
That said, I wouldn't go within a thousand miles of a place like Iraq, no matter how lucrative the work was and, had I been working there when the invasion was impending, I'd have got out pronto, and sod the job and the money.
Every single abduction victim was allegedly ''just trying to help Iraq'' - the real fact is that most of them will have been seeking short-term financial gain and gambling with their lives (and their family's peace of mind) to do it.
There is no ''wider picture'' where your loved ones are concerned, and you don't care if negotiations lead to a million subsequent abductions - blood is thicker than water and no one will ever change that.
That said, I wouldn't go within a thousand miles of a place like Iraq, no matter how lucrative the work was and, had I been working there when the invasion was impending, I'd have got out pronto, and sod the job and the money.
Every single abduction victim was allegedly ''just trying to help Iraq'' - the real fact is that most of them will have been seeking short-term financial gain and gambling with their lives (and their family's peace of mind) to do it.
Desperate Dan
Senior Jockey
Ian,most of your last paragraph could equally apply to NH jockeys and we do not criticise or disparage them if they are injured or worse.
At times I feel we have more sympathy for a horse who spreads a plate than a human who loses his life in barbaric circumstances.
At times I feel we have more sympathy for a horse who spreads a plate than a human who loses his life in barbaric circumstances.