Martin Pipe

[LUKE]

No one will ever beat his record they say..........Few years left in PN yet ;0) Michael Dickinson and family,(The famous Five) Tom Dreaper,(Arkle and Flyingbolt) Fulke Walwyn (Mill House and The Dickler), Paul Nichols (Kauto Star and Denman), Nicky Henderson (See You Then and Sprinter Sacre) , Fred Winter (Pendil), Gordon Richards (Sea Pigeon and One Man) Willie Mullins (Hurricane Fly and Douvan*hopefully) ,have all been the people champions which is more important to racing fans but at the end of the day their horses are remembered. Gloria Victis the best Pipe ever had will sadly be remembered for all the wrong reasons.

It's not all about numbers it how people perceive you and very few would argue the most popular and probably the greatest trainer of all time was: Dr. Vincent O’Brien
During a 52-year career, O’Brien became both the greatest jump trainer and the greatest Flat trainer. His trophy cabinet includes 3 consecutive Grand Nationals, 4 Cheltenham Gold Cups including 3 consecutive with Cottage Rake, 3 Champion Hurdles with Hatton's Grace, 6 Derbys and three Arc de Triomphes. He was truly a master trainer.

His first champion was Ballymoss, who won the 1957 St Leger and proved himself the best horse in Europe the following year, winning the King George and Arc.

During his long life as a trainer, he looked after some incredible horses including Sir Ivor, Nijinsky, The Minstrel, Try My Best, Storm Bird and Golden Fleece.

The man trained 3 consecutive winner in each of the 3 most important national hunt races and you can bet no one will ever do that again

I grew up on the legend of MVOB what made him stand out in my eyes as a NH trainer was the fact that he could get Cheltenham winners like Hattons Grace and Cottage Rake to win good handicaps on the flat.
I think Willie's exploits with the likes of Simenon & Max Dynamite top those by a long way,two hurdlers who aren't Champion Hurdle class-turning them into Group winners and ultimately International horses-that takes beating.

 

[granger]

You're rewriting history, I'm afraid.

Ruby was WPM's stable jockey and then started riding for Nicholls as well. He was number one to both trainers, who were willing to share him rather than not have his services at all.

That was some position of power. Like the head of the mob also being the head of the fbi

 

[Tanlic]

Exactly, Tanlic spouting rubbish as usual. There is a season outside of Cheltenham... Where Ruby was riding mid week for Mullins for years, but you can completely forget/ignore/re-write that part of history if it fits your argument Tanlic!!!!

Do we need that kind of talk when debating something?

 

[Tanlic]

You're rewriting history, I'm afraid.

Ruby was WPM's stable jockey and then started riding for Nicholls as well. He was number one to both trainers, who were willing to share him rather than not have his services at all.

Ruby most certainly was not stable jockey for Mullins when he rode his first Cheltenham winner despite it being trained by Mullins. He was an Amatuer at the time Mr. Ruby Walsh. Alexander Banquet was the horse.

Willie Mullins used Barry Geraghty David Case Davy Condon and sometimes Ruby. Ruby later was always referred to as top jockey for Willie Mullins so if he became Stable Jockey with a retainer I didn't know he had.

It really was not the point of my post but thanks for pointing my error out. When did he actually become stable jockey?

 

[edgt]

Ruby turned professional at the behest of WPM in late 90s after his Bumper win on Alexander Banquet.
Ruby wanted to wait until after Galway to win big Amateur handicap but Willie told him that as a pro he would have the price of a house by Galway !
Had Ruby ever a retainer ?
Not for Nicholls and hardly for WP but I cannot say.
Ruby has had a lot of injuries through his career so WPM use of long standing jockeys is understandable.
Remember turned pro at 18 or 19 so Casey, Carberry, Dickie Johnson and Adrian Maguire had some of the "sexier " mounts in big races.

 

[Tanlic]

I had a look and Ruby actually rode in the next 3 races at Cheltenham that Mullins won but was always on the wrong horse. Not that it meant anything as all the horse Muillins ran in those three were unfancied outsiders like 16 and 25's :blink: Those were the days

I don't recall hearing Ruby being called stable jockey back then only as Mullins's top jockey. I remember Casey Geraghty and Paul Carberry riding the best horses in the yard and eventually Ruby taking over. I was wrong about Quvega Ruby won on Fiveforthree before her.

I had a look through several years when Ruby was riding for Mullins and he didn't stand out as riding that many initially.

Ruby had ridden Florida Pearl 3 times on the trot failing to win any and never sat on him again for 2 years and lost again in the King George just about everyone rode the horse bar Ruby so someone never wanted him way back then.

Barry was on board when he won the Gold Cup Carberry and Richard Johnson also won on him.

David casey name keeps popping up as much as Ruby's back then when you look through Mullins best horses of the time.


People seem to forget, when they say Ruby is a Jockey and his advise plays an enormous part in the yards successes, that Mullins himself was a damn good amatuer and David Casey, who still works for Mullins I believe, was a damn good professional. With Ruby Patrick and DC on board he has a great team but it is a team and not all about Ruby.

Saying Ruby tells WPM the time of day is nonsense WPM is a genius in his own right and if you gave hima 3 legged donkey he'd find a race he could win with it.

Ruby is brilliant at riding that doesn't make him a good judge. AP is a shockingly bad judge who can't pick his own nose and he's ridden more winners than anyone..