Terrorist In Action In Madrid

B SPECIALS
IRA
PROT TERRORISTS
IRISH GOVERNMENT COLLUSION
NO BORDER CONTROLS

Clueless form liverpool (more CATHOLIC IRISH irish than the VATICAN)

BELFAST and LONDONDERRY East Belfast,Bogside.

Of course you are used to living in TOXTETH (spelling)

Shoot to kill! Bollocks,

Both sides IRA and PROTESTANTS shot and Bombed to kill.

The British Army did not go around bombing and shooting innocent civilians in Northern Ireland.

BLOODY SUNDAY is a spot in a field full of shite.
 
I am not advocating a Republican analysis of Norn Iron. All I am suggesting is that the prescence of the British army was part of the stew and anybody advocating otherwise has a seriously shallow view of the issue.
 
An Capall,
the stew had been simmering for years and had the BA not been sent to NI there would have been Civil War with thousands killed.

I agree that the Police in NI was riddled with corruption and that the B Specials were a festering shower of shite.

On the other hand,to pretend that the IRA were the SAVIOURS is also wide of the mark.

The disbanding of the B Specials (although correct) begat a terrorist organisation that is still present today.Just as the the IRA are still present.

To apportiion blame on the BM is wrong.

One could back a couple of hundred years and discuss the rights or wrongs of what happened,but it is better to look forward and hope that IP and JA can come to some agreement about IRA Weapons,although it trouble me that there is nothing being done about Non Catholic terrorists.
 
Hi Brian,
i only wrote one line.

TOXTETH is where ARDROSS lives,it is alleged. :P

Him being an expert in NORTHERN IRISH affairs,i never met him in the DIVIS FLATS Area,nor in the BOGSIDE.or in EAST BELFAST.

Of course,it could have been he that picked my beret up on the SHANKHILL,sorry that i did not stop to take it back from him :D
 
Brian,
maybe he is a rovery, or a Wild Colonial Boy,who has been heard to sing It's not the leaving of Liverpool that....... :P
 
Suny,

It is nothing to do with Moscow Flyer, I'm just slightly annoyed by your simplistic discussion of the Northern Ireland conflict - I know academia doesn't matter for much these days but I've already got a degree and currently working on a post graduate degree almost very specific to the subjects we are dealing with on this thread,

Additionally, growing up not too far from the border has given me quite a realistic view of the conflict there although I wouldn't pretend to have 5% of the knowledge that anyone actually living within it would do...

I'm certainly no raving nationalist and have no time whatsoever for the xenophobic and deeply disturbing party that is Sinn Fein, so I'm not speaking on this from a particular side of the fence,

All I will say, is that to incinuate that the British troops in Belfast caused no problem is a complete fallacy.

To be honest, as there's people on this forum who, for all we know, could have been affected in some way by the conflict I don't particularly want to get into this emotive topic but as cited above, you can check the Bloody Sunday inquiry, you can have a look into the case of Brian Nelson, and you can also have a look at how two British Army officers that were sent to prison for their behaviour were released early and duly promoted.
 
Derek, I lived in Toxteth for 2 years and think that it is nowhere near as bad as people say.
 
Suny.

Nelson's shadowy past
Brian Nelson
Brian Nelson operated as the intelligence chief of the UDA
Brian Nelson, the former British army agent at the centre of alleged security force collusion with loyalist paramilitaries in Northern Ireland, has died.

It is believed he had a brain haemorrhage two weeks after suffering a heart attack. BBC News Online looks at his controversial past.

Nelson, who operated as the intelligence chief of the Ulster Defence Association (UDA), was recruited by British military intelligence at the height of the Troubles.

His death came just days ahead of a report focusing on his part in alleged collusion between loyalist paramilitaries and the security forces.

Metropolitan Police Commissioner Sir John Stevens is set to publish his findings on the murder of solicitor Pat Finucane on Thursday.

There were several occasions when targets for assassination were brought to our notice by Brian Nelson
Colonel (now Brigadier) Gordon Kerr

Key people profiled
Nelson provided a dossier on the lawyer to the UDA who murdered Mr Finucane in February 1989.

Originally from Belfast's Shankill Road, he is said to have provided the vital intelligence that guided killers to their targets.

The leading loyalist was recruited by Colonel Gordon Kerr to the Force Research Unit (FRU) - an Army agency involved in gathering intelligence from loyalists.

Brigadier Kerr, who is now military attache in Beijing, also defended Nelson to the first Stevens Inquiry.

In February, Sir John said he was preparing prosecution papers surrounding the brigadier.

Sir John stopped short of saying that he was recommending a prosecution.

He said that would be a matter for the Director of Public Prosecutions in Belfast.

'Separate individuals'

Nelson, a former soldier, was living at a secret location in England under an assumed name.

His role as an Army agent was discovered in 1990 and he was jailed for 10 years on five counts of conspiracy to murder.

Many of those publicly identified as playing a role in that killing have themselves now died
Alex Maskey, Sinn Fein

Stevens inquiry: Collusion

At his 1992 trial, Brigadier Kerr said Nelson's work had "saved many lives".

He said at the time: "There were several occasions when targets for assassination were brought to our notice by Brian Nelson... something like 730 reports concerning threats to 217 separate individuals... threats to life of the individual in all cases."

However, in June last year, BBC's Panorama programme alleged Brigadier Kerr tried to cover up the extent of Nelson's involvement in the murders of Catholics.

He admitted he had used Nelson to redirect loyalist murder gangs' guns at IRA targets.

'Questions remain'

It is understood that Sir John has passed on files on at least 20 members of the security forces, both serving and retired, to the Director of Public Prosecutions.

Sinn Fein has said Nelson's death reinforced calls for a public inquiry into the murder of Pat Finucane.

Senior member Alex Maskey said Nelson had been "central to the British policy of collusion and had played a central role in the murder of the Belfast solicitor".

"Many of those publicly identified as playing a role in that killing have themselves now died," he said.

"But the questions for the British Government will remain until the truth behind collusion is uncovered."

A heavy smoker, Nelson had suffered from heart trouble for several years.

He learned six months ago he was suffering from cancer, according to friends.
 
Hi Daniel

It was a mistake to name the subject about North Ireland by myself.

It is obvious that Ï didnt write what I wanted and especially that the post was about the situation in my country.


I dont have any respect for any terrorist in the world but in the Pais Vasco conflict I am well informed and what has been happening in Spain in the last 30 years is pathetic.


The army is the last recurrence in a conflict of thi kind but could be useful, all these conflicts have frequently a source and this is the education and the history the children learnt since their younger year.


If I have to excuse for anything some of you are offended I dont have any problem but as I said previously this conflict is obviously not one I wanted to talk about.
 
I am missing something Suny,

What good would it do the Socialist government now (post-election) to pretend that Islamic terrorists caused the explosion, when they have evidence to suggest that it was ETA?

I am not fully au fait with the situation in Spain, but I do not believe that there would anything except support from the non-Basque parts of the country for any government which hunted down ETA? (Not sure how the Basque people in general feel about ETA)

The only plausible explanation I can come up with is to give them an excuse to withdraw from Iraq, but they would have done that anyway.
 
Derek, I lived in Percy St ( off Catherine St ) in L1, but to all intense purposes on the edge of Toxteth for 4 years about a decade ago with an ex. As per what Paul says, it's not as bad as is made out. I think you are still imagining the scenes of the early eighties.
 
Liverpool 8 is very up and coming as far as I can see whenever I go to visit a friend of mine who lives there. Lots of stunning old houses .
 
Originally posted by simmo@Dec 6 2004, 10:56 AM
I am missing something Suny,

What good would it do the Socialist government now (post-election) to pretend that Islamic terrorists caused the explosion, when they have evidence to suggest that it was ETA?

The only plausible explanation I can come up with is to give them an excuse to withdraw from Iraq, but they would have done that anyway.
Click to expand...
Hi Simmo


the situation is the following


Socialist have been against the Iraq war but not because they thought it was unfair or an error just because they oposed anything the former goverment did.

They associated the attack in Madrid to the presence of our troops in Iraq and being the elections so close to the terrorist attcack many uncultured people went to vote them.

Socialist expected to lose the elections by a wide margin and they had an stupid programm because they knew they were going to lose, in fact ,ZP was going to be sacked but the surprise arised and they are in the leadership of the country and you must live here to believe what is happening and what they are doing.
 
Well I undertstand that they used the explosion as a means to getting into government, and I understand that you and many other people dislike their policies. The bit I don't understand is how covering up the fact (if it is so) that ETA were responsible for this bombing would assist them in any way.

I would have thought that, since their prior ambitions of removing Spain from Iraq have now been achieved, that to now fully investigate and make some arrests of ETA terrorists would be a popular move with the greater population? So their covering it up doesn't make any sense to me.
 
The explanation of is that Socialist needs in the parliment the votes of Independentist .
1 1/2 before the elections the main partener of ZP met the nº1 of ETA in Perpignan and the people was not very happy here with it.

All the other partners of socialist ar in favour of forgive the ETA members in prision and talk about dialogue with the terrorist.


Brian
There evidences ,it is not a conspiracy as you talk trying to discredit what I worte in this piece.
 
There were seven more blasts throughout Spain yesterday, a warning phone call was made beforehand from someone who claimed to be from ETA. This time round they got as far south as Malaga, it gets even more worrying when it's happening on your doorstep.
 
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