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The 2025 King George VI And Queen Elizabeth Stakes

Starting to look that way, Luke - and fair play to you as you were saying that before the race.

Calandagan has given him a head start off a moderate (by Group 1 standards) early pace and still mowed him down, along with the rest.
 
Ian_Davies said:
I can't have Rebels Romance running to his OR of 123 today.

He had his ground, but nothing else has gone right for the old boy - pace not strong enough, got trapped on the rail, ... it just wasn't his day.
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Watching the replay, I can buy that so it downgrades the form all round, providing another nail in the coffin of British & Irish G1 form.

I hope the added prize money next year entices Japan to send their best over although their horses don't seem to travel too well and even the £2m prize fund is peanuts compared to what the Middle East can offer.
 
The sectional graphic shows how slow it was early on. Even Continuous, which was eased down in the last furlong, has beaten 100% at the finish and Calandagan has won despite getting the least efficient ride and will get the biggest mark-up, which maybe just emphasises that he was the best horse in the race.

1753599243357.png
 
Desert Orchid said:
Watching the replay, I can buy that so it downgrades the form all round, providing another nail in the coffin of British & Irish G1 form.

I hope the added prize money next year entices Japan to send their best over although their horses don't seem to travel too well and even the £2m prize fund is peanuts compared to what the Middle East can offer.
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Always glad when we agree, but I had a horrible feeling it would send you back into the sub-OR 130 "Slough Of Despond" and my fears were realised! 😂

I could watch Group 1 races at that standard all day long and, much though I liked the horse, I actually got a bit bored at times when Frankel was around - guess I'm all about the betting.

Each to his own.
 
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Desert Orchid said:
The sectional graphic shows how slow it was early on. Even Continuous, which was eased down in the last furlong, has beaten 100% at the finish and Calandagan has won despite getting the least efficient ride and will get the biggest mark-up, which maybe just emphasises that he was the best horse in the race.

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Just a complete cock-up by Coolmore - everyone makes mistakes at times and thinking they are exempt and always know better than any onlooker is the road to the poorhouse.

Every idol reveals at least one foot of clay occasionally eventually. 😂
 
I don't share your conspiracy theories at Group 1 level, Maurice.

Big prize money and even bigger stud values at stake.

Coolmore make mistakes sometimes and tbf, Aidan O'Brien, who I actually quite like (absolute modest gentleman in person) and even feel a bit sorry for (Coolmore use him as their marketing mouthpiece and he annually has to come out with all sorts of "best we've ever had" BS to please his employers) is actually very self-deprecating in terms of admitting to errors he's made at times.

They get a lot right - that's why they are where they are in the game - but even they get things wrong sometimes and it puzzles me some worship them so much they can't see that or, in your case, explain it away with some Group 1 betting scam theory.
 
They made a bollocks of it by going too fast in the Prince of Wales’s Stakes, then overcompensated by going too slow yesterday. Like a golfer who hooks it left off the first tee, then shanks it right on the second.
 
Slim said:
They made a bollocks of it by going too fast in the Prince of Wales’s Stakes, then overcompensated by going too slow yesterday. Like a golfer who hooks it left off the first tee, then shanks it right on the second.
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Infinitely more plausible than "O'Brien and Moore know everything inside out and never ever make mistakes" or some betting scam (to win even more money than first prize in a seven-figure Group 1 with seven and even eight-figure stud valuations at stake) malarkey.

Get a grip, fellas, your Uncle Slim is odds on to be closer to the truth on this one. 😂
 
It looked for all the world as if they were trying to kill off Rebel’s Romance by keeping him boxed in, although it was probably just the draw that made it look that way. Buick had to sit and suffer, but moved when a chink of light appeared two out when Jan Brueghel rolled off the rail only for the gap to close again before he got his nose into it. Funny race, it was only slow by 0.04 seconds in the end.
 
Ian_Davies said:
I don't share your conspiracy theories at Group 1 level, Maurice.
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Nobody in their right mind does.

But suppose they knew JB wasn't quite 100% going into yesterday's race - just to dig a bigger shithole for myself - but he was their only serious arrow. If they anticipated defeat they could content themselves with place money while mopping up on Calandagan to make up a chunk of the difference.

I don't put anything past anyone involved in racing.
 
I wouldn't be looking for inspiration for the Arc from the Ascot King George VI And Queen Elizabeth Diamond Flat Stakes, because since 2000, 53 runners from the Ascot race went to the following Arc, 5 won (9.43%) and 15 won or placed (28.3%) , that includes 12 winners of the King George VI , of which only 2 won (16.7%) the Arc in Oct.
 
reet hard said:
It was definitely slowly run.
A length would have covered the field on the last bend.
As I said pre-race Calanagan is a speed horse,and tne race fell right into his lap.
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The sectional graphics back this up. A finishing sectional speed of a fraction under 40mph is fast. Probably not many 5f horses do that at Ascot.

If Coolmore had wanted Calandagan to win they couldn't have done a better job of it ;) ;)
 
Calandagan win at the expense of what?

Rebel Romance isn't exactly Northern Dancer.
 
reet hard said:
Calandagan ;last 2f = 11.55 & 11.16
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Those are actually the third-last and second-last times, reet. His final furlong was 11.77.

Both he and Kalpana broke 12s for each of the last three furlongs.

...and in the closing 5f sprint Cover Up, while breaking 12s in both final furlongs, wasn't as quick through either at 11.38 & 11.93.
 
Not sure how using Continuous as a roadblock is within the rules. Clearly instructed to sit on shoulder of JB throughout with no intention
of trying to compete for the win in its own right.

Isn't that usually called a non trier?
 
I remember a former colleague of my father's called Paul Barrett (think he's a racecourse bookmaker and stands and sponsors at Market Rasen) asking the very same question about pacemakers generally in a published letter to the racing press way back in 1983 after a horse called IIRC Sailor's Dance was pacemaker for Sun Princess in the St Leger.

No one had a satisfactory answer for Paul
then and tbh I haven't really heard or read a satisfactory answer in the 42 years since!
 
Coolmore haven't got any proper top draw 12f colts. They either have boats like JB, LA and Lambourn or classy 10 and sub 10 animals like Delacroix, Henri Matisse and CP. If they truly wanted a King George they'd have run one of the fillies.
 

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