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The 2025 Ladbrokes Handicap Hurdle

Following Glengouly's impressive success on the back of a string of poor efforts, I've decided to take a punt on the trainer's No Ordinary Joe, which I'd thought was GATG, at 66/1. It's currently top-rated on RPRs. The double with Doctor Ken in the big chase works out at 2277/1. Fish supper money on that could net a very respectable return.
 
28 in this 1m7f110yds Ascot Saturday banquet, again the weights have been out for a bit and the five-day confirmations will be made on Monday.

Ante-Post Betting: https://www.oddschecker.com/horse-r...ational-hunt/ladbrokes-handicap-hurdle/winner
YFUSA can wait until the final decs but, in an open-looking race, Hardy Du Seuil seems unlikely to be "double carpet" if he shows up.

At 33/1, he's at least double the odds of others with, to YFUSA's frankly-supernatural way of thinking, similar prospects.
 
I'd like to know if Air of Entitlement is coming over for this.

She jumped off the page to me. I'd imagine it's a UK mark check. They'll be very happy with 140 for a crack at a Coral Cup. Not a chance it runs over a sharp 2m at Ascot.

As an aide, I'd imagine De Bromhead's stats in the UK outside the festival are rancid.
 
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She jumped off the page to me. I'd imagine it's a UK mark check. They'll be very happy with 140 for a crack at a Coral Cup. Not a chance it runs over a sharp 2m at Ascot.

As an aide, I'd imagine De Bromhead's stats in the UK outside the festival are rancid.

Imagine my shock when I saw she wasn't declared. 140 in the bag, they can now work backwards from the Coral Cup.
 
Following Glengouly's impressive success on the back of a string of poor efforts, I've decided to take a punt on the trainer's No Ordinary Joe, which I'd thought was GATG, at 66/1. It's currently top-rated on RPRs. The double with Doctor Ken in the big chase works out at 2277/1. Fish supper money on that could net a very respectable return.

Neither runs.

Between these and Tommie Beau in the Welsh National I'm back to avoiding ante-post betting in these races until the 5-day stage at the earliest. Money chucked away. Maybe not big money but money I could still have put to decent use.
 
YFUSA can wait until the final decs but, in an open-looking race, Hardy Du Seuil seems unlikely to be "double carpet" if he shows up.

At 33/1, he's at least double the odds of others with, to YFUSA's frankly-supernatural way of thinking, similar prospects.
Actually 40/1 with SkyBet/Paddy Power (more or less joined at the hip nowadays) now, but YFUSA is still going to WAIT. #ifyoudontrunyoucantwin
 
Having been watching the weather reports on TV during the week so far, I'm surprised the ground looks like being pretty decent even if the forecast 12mm arrives. This is the turftrax map as it was yesterday. It looks like only backers of mudlarks need worry about the conditions.

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Easy to understand why it could be fancied. These things shouldn't be taken literally but it is arithmetically 19lbs better off for 1½ lengths with Alexei from the Chepstow race and the winner, Celtic Dino, was the only one to give the good thing Wodhooh a race at Ascot. Obviously Alexei has improved a lot but what's to say Wilful hasn't improved a bit too?
 
Hardy wants it soft, I believe.

Live Conti wants it soft.

Will it be soft enough for those two? Maybe not. I'm about 10 miles east of Ascot right now. Was damp overnight, but nothing heavy. Forecast is for heavy rain today, but no sign of it so far. Then dry tomorrow/Sat.
 
Rainfall, or lack of it, may well be key - weather watch here too, but 26 miles away so Chaumi The Weather Man is the guy to listen to - no pressure!
 
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Taken all the 14s Live Conti - though that might be a little premature. Can't shake the feeling we might witness the ultimate definition of a proper graded runner in a handicap.
 
Taken all the 14s Live Conti - though that might be a little premature. Can't shake the feeling we might witness the ultimate definition of a proper graded runner in a handicap.

I just hope now that it runs as I opted to go in antepost at the 14s thinking along similar lines, suspecting this is maybe a 160 horse waiting to show its hand (or at least a couple of aces within it).
 
Taken all the 14s Live Conti - though that might be a little premature. Can't shake the feeling we might witness the ultimate definition of a proper graded runner in a handicap.

For the likes of me that missed it what on earth points to that ? I can't see that he's been let in easily off 143 the horses in an around him at Aintree are only rated roughly the same and not really shouting out that they are well handicapped. Throw out Mondo mans Cheltenham run and his Juvenile form wouldn't be too far removed yet he gets in 20lb lighter plus he'd have the benefit of of a recent run. I know Topspeeds and RPR's aren't the be all and end all but to be rank bottom on both doesn't exactly scream Graded horse in disguise. I wouldn't exactly say that I'd fancy Mondo Man but I'd think if you were looking at one let in lightly it might be him especially given his most recent flat form. By all means being a Skelton horse he might just win regardless but without a crystal ball how anyone could think he's a possible 160 horse is beyond me and I'd say that with genuine curiosity as to how anyone could draw that conclusion by any logical means.

As for me as I'd put on the Antepost thread I'm on Wilful at 9's and he holds his chance but is probably the right sort of price. The fav is possibly thrown in but he can make a mess of his hurdles at times and I wouldn't be with him at short odds. If I was looking at anything that might be a bit of value on the day then Helwein is about 10's now can see him drifting out a bit from that due to being unfashionable. Last 2 runs a decent 2nd in the Swinton hurdle and 2nd in the Greatwood. Gets a 9lb pull with Alexi for 6 lengths but add to that Alexi was race fit and that was first run of the season for Helwein. Only really faded after the last travelled really well coming around the last bend looking to be going even better than the winner was at that point, a slightly shorter trip, hopefully less testing ground and the benefit of race fitness this time makes any sort of double figure price look like a bit of value to me.
 
Well, personally ratings and weight pulls never enter my head (for right or wrong), and I take no notice (unless the ratings are on a DO-formed appraisal of a contest! edit: or are related to a Pawras database).

So, there are several obvious contenders here. As you've eloquently laid out, Dan. It's not easy (or worth it? on the prices) trying to split them (for me, anyway). We already have the best outsider advised, and he gets his ground now.

So attention turned to 'OK, so what might win it on class, if the rest are 'just' good handicappers'.

And, I'd say, the obvious one jumps out.

Lightly raced, won the first race in France over 2m2f on heavy ground well. One or two behind have already proven graded form. The second in that race went to WPM (though hasn't done much yet, watch out for him).
Walked his UK novice.
Only his 3rd run in the Aintree Grade 2 - a speed track which may not have fully suited. On ground that may not have been ideally soft enough. Showing speed DS probably didn't think he had. The winner Murcia will probably end up in the mares in March.

Gets his ground (though not sure why he was pulled from the Gerry Fielden - that might be a worry)
DS is already on record as stating 'it's a nice handicap, then graded races in the spring.'

And if Conti gets beat here, it'll likely be on no prep run. He'll return the stakes next time. And he's a backable price, which might look pretty stupid post-race . And he comes from the Skelton yard.
 
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That's fair enough mate and I know it wasn't you that said it but when Maurice says possible 160 horse just to put that into context.

Lossiemouth 159
Golden Ace 152
Sir Gino 157
The new lion 159

You can see why that's a bit of wild thing to say on anything its achieved thus far. I'm fairly sure if Skelton thought it was anywhere near the New lion that 14/1 would've been having his house on.
 
Could be (in light of that Fielden withdrawal) that I'm totally misinterpreting/misunderstanding the ground requirement, and Dan S was holding off having his house on till he knew he had a definite runner :p

But looking at a few reruns from Newbury just now from that weekend, it didn't look particularly soft to me. I'd say the withdrawal was because it was too fast for him. Given the rain today, unlikely to be a problem on Saturday.

What I would say - while kind of speaking for DO even though I know he doesn't need me to - is we all arrive at selections/thoughts on a runner or race based on the total sum of every (horse racing) experience we've ever had. Well, those who don't just blindly follow others (and nothing wrong with that in my book per se).

So if anyone rated a horse at x whatever, it's the sum of their racing experiences from the age of 12 or 13 - for some a bit older - that led them to that conclusion.

Nowt wrong with questioning that, ofc, and seeking an understanding of why exactly.
 
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