The Coalition Document
- Thread starter Ardross
- Start date
Though the education policies are utter bollocksCameron (and maybe his close associates too) strikes me as someone whos relishing this coalition. he is probably more at home with the lib dem/clegg worldview than that of the nationlistic right or the cold eyed moneterists
There is no reason to suspect that this is not appealing to many who voted tory as well
There is no reason to suspect that this is not appealing to many who voted tory as well
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walsworth
Journeyman
Bad cess to the lot of the greedy bastards.
EC1
On a break
Cameron is relieved he's got someone to help him..because its clear he isn't man enough for the job on his own..hence no majority
I think Cameron is a very traditional Tory in charge of a traditional enough Tory party and there is bound to be some trouble ahead between the two parties. A lot will depend on how he handles relations with his backbenchers and balances their concerns with those of the other party.
But single party governments are also subject to serious tensions between differing factions.
Roddy Owen
At the Start
I can tell you something, I need to buy currency every day. For months before the election GBP sterling was getting nicely stronger every week. There was a general good feeling despite the atmosphere The Sun tried to create. The day of the election and from then on ,as soon as the result was announced ,the GBP sterling has fallen every day. The World doesn`t fancy our chances under this possee it seems.
EC1
On a break
its been proven to be a wise move trying it though..they might have won with a different leader
the tories sabotaged the leader when they had Thatcher..all parties are the same in that respect..the difference between the two actions is that Thatcher would have still won the election if she had stayed..whereas Labour knew they'd lose with Brown.
All very true, too, EC, although I think when the ruckus broke out in Labour, Milliband hadn't chucked his hat into the ring, had he? Do you feel that Labour might've got back if Hoon had grabbed No.1, for example? I don't know - when the chips were down, none of the contenders seemed to get any serious support from their brethren, leaving them to twist slowly in the wind. (I don't know what that means, but it always sounds good!)
I see Diane Flabbott has thrown her hat in the ring. That should be a laugh...
Differences within parties are far more pronounced than across parties. Especially in this day and age where there is a fairly consensual non idealogical centrist worldview.
The Seamus milne cuba/islamist worshipping left and the flag obsessed Monday clubbers are many miles further away from the Blairs, cleggs, Camerons, Browns and Clarkes of this world than those politicans are to each other
Differences within parties are far more pronounced than across parties. Especially in this day and age where there is a fairly consensual non idealogical centrist worldview.
The Seamus milne cuba/islamist worshipping left and the flag obsessed Monday clubbers are many miles further away from the Blairs, cleggs, Camerons, Browns and Clarkes of this world than those politicans are to each other
EC1
On a break
as I said here a good while ago..I would have bet on a landslide for the Tories..it were an open goal..which over that period they have messed up..Brown was such an easy target for them..just media wise alone.
yes you are right ..Labour just seemed to be sinking slowly without any obvious new leader..Brown clinging on..I think he was never really leader material..he was out of his depth and they knew it in the party but had no other obvious candidate
been watching Ed Balls recently..if he has a chance of getting the job I'll emigrate..what a plum he is.
Thats true EC1. Brown was the group financial director who desperately wanted to be the CEO. Such a familiar scenario and so often a disasterous one...
Natural and real leadership skills are hugely underrated in this country. Blair has his critics (too much so i believe) but his man mangagement and leadership skills (with the odd blip) were pretty strong and the electorate sensed that
Natural and real leadership skills are hugely underrated in this country. Blair has his critics (too much so i believe) but his man mangagement and leadership skills (with the odd blip) were pretty strong and the electorate sensed that
EC1
On a break
Yes Blair looked the part - and as much as I hate that being predominant- it is important
looking the part can win you an election..hence why Brown would never have won one whilst an hole existed in his arse
Thatcher - looked strong - a natural born winner in this arena
Michael Foot looked liked a natural loser..underneath that a very intelligent genuine man
Ted Heath always looked a loser to me but had his chance..then proved he actually was :lol:
looking the part can win you an election..hence why Brown would never have won one whilst an hole existed in his arse
Thatcher - looked strong - a natural born winner in this arena
Michael Foot looked liked a natural loser..underneath that a very intelligent genuine man
Ted Heath always looked a loser to me but had his chance..then proved he actually was :lol:
EC1
On a break
check your pm's Kri
Balls is apparently intensely disliked from within, so looks like a 5 year-old bra (no support). A quote from The Economist says he's clever, tough and ambitious but his thuggish ways - he pursued some brutal vendettas within the party - have left him with an 'uncomfortably large number of enemies'. Another quote from The Observer says that choosing a leader will be difficult, but it'll be more tricky to coalesce around an agreed account of why Labour lost. A concensus emerging within the party (from The Times) says it was chucked out because it lost touch with its core vote (the Mrs Duffys of Rochdale) on crime, immigration and welfare.* But The Times thinks that's too generous for a party which lost 95% of its seats in the south, outside London.
(In case anyone thinks I'm culling brilliantly from miles of newsprint, I'm not. I rely on tasty slices of the best bits through a sub to 'The Week', a digest of the week's world and national news.)
* So expect endless droning on and on about these three issues - they had 13 years in which to listen to their 'core', but resolutely put on ear defenders and listened only to themselves. Too late, I think, to start trying to paper over these significant cracks.
(In case anyone thinks I'm culling brilliantly from miles of newsprint, I'm not. I rely on tasty slices of the best bits through a sub to 'The Week', a digest of the week's world and national news.)
* So expect endless droning on and on about these three issues - they had 13 years in which to listen to their 'core', but resolutely put on ear defenders and listened only to themselves. Too late, I think, to start trying to paper over these significant cracks.
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EC1
On a break
as a lifelong labour voter they lost my support in 2001..i felt they were too pretentious and the Blair clone mentality didn't go down well with me.
I remember when Blair first got in they said about him that he was more power mad than Thatcher..whenever an outgoing MP left they reckon a replacement always had to sing from Blairs sheet...this was made clear locally when he foisted one of his followers on us in Chesterfield after Tony Benn packed in..our town turned against this including the local party and the lib dems took power here..unheard of in my life.
the main problem is that politicians are not in touch with real life..they might be whilst climbing the ladder but once they get what they want they forget all about real people..until election time comes..that joke about heaven and hell is brilliant by the way..its so true.
Balls come across as a bit thick..stumbling..buffoon..just my opinion
I remember when Blair first got in they said about him that he was more power mad than Thatcher..whenever an outgoing MP left they reckon a replacement always had to sing from Blairs sheet...this was made clear locally when he foisted one of his followers on us in Chesterfield after Tony Benn packed in..our town turned against this including the local party and the lib dems took power here..unheard of in my life.
the main problem is that politicians are not in touch with real life..they might be whilst climbing the ladder but once they get what they want they forget all about real people..until election time comes..that joke about heaven and hell is brilliant by the way..its so true.
Balls come across as a bit thick..stumbling..buffoon..just my opinion
What's happened to Labour is what happened to the Communists back in the 1930s - they became upwardly aspirational. My mother was drawn to non-elitist parties, felt firmly behind 'the workers', perhaps having the genes of the deeply Labour Harry Pollitt (Manchester) in her having this effect. She attended a fervent Commie rally one evening, when the speaker thundered, "And one day, brothers and sisters, we too shall live in big houses, and drive big cars!" She was stunned - hallo, what happened to fair pay, equality for wimmin, healthy living conditions and the end of an elitist society? Nahhh... that didn't seem to be on the agenda. Big houses, big cars, materialism. And that's how I viewed Labour - bourgeois as any middle-Englander, consumerist and materialist attitudes. Okay, so H&S has put paid to many old tirades against bad working conditions (thank God), and landlords (Church, Council, or private) can't allow their properties to become filthy, unsafe slums any more, and the NHS has pulled thousands from death's previously inevitable door, so that Labour, as it was, didn't have so many windmills at which to tilt.
But it totally misread the writing on the wall regarding its slapdash Home Office, its over-zealous protection of those publicly calling for harm to this society, its bogging-down of the Police with unnecessary form-filling, the reckless abandonment of support for teachers beset by abusive pupils, and the overburdening of hospitals with a bloated, overpaid administration, at the expense of bed time and nurses' pay. They forgot that their core still consists of people who are concerned about local crime, health care, and the perception - if not the reality - of their communities being overrun by foreign incomers who turn areas into racial or religious ghettoes.
But it totally misread the writing on the wall regarding its slapdash Home Office, its over-zealous protection of those publicly calling for harm to this society, its bogging-down of the Police with unnecessary form-filling, the reckless abandonment of support for teachers beset by abusive pupils, and the overburdening of hospitals with a bloated, overpaid administration, at the expense of bed time and nurses' pay. They forgot that their core still consists of people who are concerned about local crime, health care, and the perception - if not the reality - of their communities being overrun by foreign incomers who turn areas into racial or religious ghettoes.
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EC1
On a break
that looks a very good comparison to whats happened - mirror image really
walsworth
Journeyman
It was never officially called a poll tax and it never really went away did it? They just changed the format slightly, for the worse in my particular circumstances at that time.
EC1
On a break
tosh .. lol
as the previous post says..we still have it..its called council tax..which is actually more unfair than the poll tax..the poll tax was fair..the one flaw was that it cost 4 times more than it should..but the idea was correct
tory party has never gotten over the thatcher thing..even with the poll tax she would still have hammered Kinnock..he was worse than Brown
are you sure you were around then Ardross?
..do you not remember how poor Kinnock was..a total twonk...if thatcher had doubled tax she would still have wonThe poll tax was fair ! Everyone paying the same amount regardless of their income and wealth - give me strength !
The Tories were MILES behind in the polls - Thatcher was showing signs of megalomania as Howe's devastating speech showed,no wonder they got rid of her and we were about to enter a recession in which people were told unemployment was a price worth paying .
Anyway for Labour if not the country it turned out to be a good election to lose - Norman Lamont promptly showing he did not have a clue.
The Tories were MILES behind in the polls - Thatcher was showing signs of megalomania as Howe's devastating speech showed,no wonder they got rid of her and we were about to enter a recession in which people were told unemployment was a price worth paying .
Anyway for Labour if not the country it turned out to be a good election to lose - Norman Lamont promptly showing he did not have a clue.
EC1
On a break
the poll tax was fair ! Everyone paying the same amount regardless of their income and wealth - give me strength !
Whereas the rates was very fair wasn't it?..lmao.....a family of 8 using education, roads, recreational facilities 8 times more than pensioner next door ..but pensioner pays same as family of 8..is that your sort of fair Ardross?..its a funny one if it is...stick your exclamation mark after that badge of fairness you seem to support.
they reckon that a 7th of the number of people paid rates that paid poll tax..so the poll tax if done based on how much the rates amassed should have been a relatively small figure..its not the tax's fault that it was implemented in a greedy way to pull more money in that the old rates actually did.
most of the objections to the poll tax were from people that wanted facilities but didn't want to pay anything towards them...freeloaders is the word...basically the same people walking into our benefits office with hands out every day...won't work..won't contribute.
how the fook is the size of my house connected to how much I use the roads or local swimming baths or have my bin emptied?..when i go to tescos my shopping bill is the same as anyone elses..why are public services charged any different?...the council tax is bollox..but there are no riots about it because as law abiding citizens..not tattoed thugs..we accept it.
there are a section of people in society that want a free ride..we saw most of them on those poll tax riots..basically lazy freeloaders who want others to pay their way for them...well lets all be freeloaders then and all refuse to pay the council tax..its right isn't it?..the tax is not fair...and according to you if we don't agree with something then we should just not pay it Ardoss..like the poll tax mob eh?
Whereas the rates was very fair wasn't it?..lmao.....a family of 8 using education, roads, recreational facilities 8 times more than pensioner next door ..but pensioner pays same as family of 8..is that your sort of fair Ardross?..its a funny one if it is...stick your exclamation mark after that badge of fairness you seem to support.
they reckon that a 7th of the number of people paid rates that paid poll tax..so the poll tax if done based on how much the rates amassed should have been a relatively small figure..its not the tax's fault that it was implemented in a greedy way to pull more money in that the old rates actually did.
most of the objections to the poll tax were from people that wanted facilities but didn't want to pay anything towards them...freeloaders is the word...basically the same people walking into our benefits office with hands out every day...won't work..won't contribute.
how the fook is the size of my house connected to how much I use the roads or local swimming baths or have my bin emptied?..when i go to tescos my shopping bill is the same as anyone elses..why are public services charged any different?...the council tax is bollox..but there are no riots about it because as law abiding citizens..not tattoed thugs..we accept it.
there are a section of people in society that want a free ride..we saw most of them on those poll tax riots..basically lazy freeloaders who want others to pay their way for them...well lets all be freeloaders then and all refuse to pay the council tax..its right isn't it?..the tax is not fair...and according to you if we don't agree with something then we should just not pay it Ardoss..like the poll tax mob eh?
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