Brexit In The Cold Light Of Day

If You Could Vote Again Now How Would You Vote?

  • Leave

    Votes: 7 46.7%

  • Stay

    Votes: 8 53.3%
  • Total voters
    15
M

Maruco

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So things have had time to settle down, and reality is beginning to settle in.

It appears that absolutely nothing that the Brexit campaigners promised will happen. The NHS money isn't coming, immigration will continue pretty much as before, the rest of Europe is going to make our exit hard and painful to deter their own populations from exiting, most of the G20 have dropped us to the bottom of the list for trade and issued warnings over major institutions pulling out of the UK (Obama and Japan in particular making it clear that we've scored a massive own goal with regards trade in their countries), and at some point in the future we're likely to see the breakup of the UK.

Where's the upside? Well as I see it the only wins seem to be we no longer have Cameron and Farage, and that muppet Gove is dead in the water.

My question therefore is how would you vote now in with the benefit of hindsite? Do you see a silver lining somewhere on the horizon, or do you see it as I do?
 
So David Davies the 'Brexit Secretary' addressed The Commons this afternoon to set out his vision. I've just read the transcript and he said pretty much nothing.

Article 50 won't be triggered until next year at the earliest says Theresa May, when we were assured that it would happen before the end of 2016 previously.

I seriously wonder if anyone in Parliament has any idea of what they're doing with the handling of Brexit.
 
In complete agreement with your first post.
The migration control fantasy was exactly that, a fantasy. The impact on the economy will take longer to understand.

Convenient for the BBC to focus on the NHS with their 6PM bulletin tonight, forgetting the shocking lies on migration control, the Japanese at boiling point, and just about everything else in your post.

I guess there's being objective and backing the minority outlook on news output.

Then there's being in denial and ignoring what's staring you point blank in the forehead.

Some of what I've seen on the BBC recently falls in the latter.

Why do I have to pay for this again?
 
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Well, I've written to my MP [Leave] and told her that she still has to represent me in parliament and keep me informed as to what's going on. I've written Anna Soubry and thanked her for giving voice to my opinions even though she isn't my MP. And I've emailed James Dyson and asked when he's going to relocate his factories to this country to provide jobs in areas such as Cornwall and Wales,now that he has achieved what he campaigned for during the referendum. I do wish I lived in the world of a leave voter so I could just chill out and wait for Utopia to arrive though.
 
I suspect that most of those who voted leave won't realise that they are not going to get what they wanted, being thick as **** in the neck of a bottle.
 
I don't think things will settle down nor reality set in for a lengthy time yet; hence I've yet to shift from my position of the weak wishy-washy Remainer I was on June 23rd

'Promises' made during Hustings are rarely fulfilled and that ghastly, unedifying referendum campaign is best forgotten, or if it is to be remembered then remembered as a new low in political campaigning

All of us in the UK are faced with Hobson's Choice: we're out of the EU and we don't have a credible Opposition in parliament. Therefore we have no alternative but to wish Theresa May and her government all the very best

Negativity don't pull you through
 
Nothing was going to change for at least 2 years even if the 'negotiations' started the day after the vote, so most of those being as thick as @@@@, as so eloquently put, actually knew that before they voted so wasn't expecting anything else, other than the predictable 'we're all doomed Captain Mainwaring' wailing from certain quarters.
 
G-G said:
Nothing was going to change for at least 2 years even if the 'negotiations' started the day after the vote, so most of those being as thick as @@@@, as so eloquently put, actually knew that before they voted so wasn't expecting anything else, other than the predictable 'we're all doomed Captain Mainwaring' wailing from certain quarters.
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I bet they didn't.....
 
G-G said:
Nothing was going to change for at least 2 years even if the 'negotiations' started the day after the vote, so most of those being as thick as @@@@, as so eloquently put, actually knew that before they voted so wasn't expecting anything else, other than the predictable 'we're all doomed Captain Mainwaring' wailing from certain quarters.
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Not true GG. There was a commitment to invoke Article 50 before year end, which has now been pushed back to an undefined time in 2017.

In addition, those tasked with taking us through Brexit appear to have no idea where to start or how to navigate their way through it. David Davies's address yesterday was full of absolutely nothing.

Mutterings from around the world on trade aren't exactly good either. Japan in particular have viewed us as a gateway to Europe, and their now stated position is concerning to say the least.

I don't disagree with the view that there is unlikely to be a second referendum, but neither should I give up on it. From where I'm sitting the whole basis of the leave campaign was a complete sham. I don't buy into the scare tactics counter-argument, because the emphasis was on the leavers to make their case for change. They lied, and they were wrong, as simple as that. We as a nation should have been voting on a clear and provable case that would come to pass, not a bunch of fairy stories. That wasn't the case, and we've been conned.

When a nation has been lied to on something as fundamental as this, and we see that the case that was made won't come to pass, then surely Britain deserves a second chance to vote now we are better informed.
 
And I've emailed James Dyson and asked when he's going to relocate his factories to this country to provide jobs in areas such as Cornwall and Wales,now that he has achieved what he campaigned for during the referendum.
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Nice idea
 
I'll add something to my previous post. Theresa May seems to be taking some heat from the media over the current position. She never made the promises that the media, many 'Leavers', and some on here, want to make her accountable for. The utopian promises were made mostly by Farage, who by my reckoning was one of the least qualified men in the county to do so having failed to be voted in as an MP more than a dozen times. The right wing conservatives simply saw it as a way to swoop and advance their careers. Fortunately the slimeball Gove and buffoon Johnson showed themselves to be the clowns they are and failed miserably.

The bottom line is, Theresa May is simply the messenger. She's now responsible for delivering the bad news, and we have to accept that the lies of others have taken us to this position. Essentially nothing that was promised by the Leave campaign will happen, and Theresa May is in an impossible position where all she can do is attempt to deliver the least damaging outcome.

I posted this thread up because I've had a number of conversations with 'Leavers' recently, and most who are staying close to it are now somewhere between having doubts and having serious regrets only 10 weeks after the vote. Hardly surprising really with the run of information coming out.
 
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Maruco said:
When a nation has been lied to on something as fundamental as this, and we see that the case that was made won't come to pass, then surely Britain deserves a second chance to vote now we are better informed.
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Nice idea - can we have second Scottish independence referendum first if this is a criteria.
 
People who live in glass-houses selling oil at $113 a barrel, shouldn't throw stones.

;)
 
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Maruco said:
Not true GG. There was a commitment to invoke Article 50 before year end, which has now been pushed back to an undefined time in 2017.

.
QUOTE]
So nothing is going to change for 2 years then. No doubt the 'commitment' was 'at that moment in time'. Now, not so much. Tomorrow - who knows?
Can we have the general election again 'cos I bet not all those were elected were allegedly telling the whole truth and nothing but? Oh wait and the one before that because apart from anything else, they lied about Student fees. Oh no wait they didn't, they said 'at this time there are no plans' so that was alright then. Oh and the one before that, and the one before that........
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Relevant how GG?

We have an election every five years or so and we can vote out the Government. Brexit is a fundamental long term decision and direction for the county, where it's completely impossible to vote in and out every five years.

Also you also only pick on one point and have chosen to ignore all of the rest. I can add another four or five if you want. The bottom line is that not one of the issues that the 'Leave' campaign trumpeted will come to pass. And using your poor comparison, even the worst election campaign or Party Manifesto in history has never fallen so miserably short as to deliver on precisely zero.
 
Every Leave voter that I've spoken to thus far is still happy with their decision, and all I seem to get are 'you lost, just get on with it and stop moaning'. I don't understand why there is no anger about the fact that the leave promises were false and no one will admit that immigration was a major influence as to how people voted as they all say they didn't vote for that reason [but can't see that many people did]. The racism that was unleashed 'didn't happen/isn't happening'. I still don't believe that Jeremy Corbyn actually voted 'remain' [if he voted at all] so I don't even have a political party to turn to, the only politician that seems to be speaking my language is Anna Soubry. I don't recognise my country any more, and still can't get over the huge 'We Want our Country Back' posters that I saw throughout Yorkshire. I don't think I've got the physical/mental energy to get behind the country and make it great again as I quite liked it as it was.
 
Before the results were announced, Farage was saying that he thought they had lost by about 52-48%. He said that that was close enough to make another referendum a reasonable short-term proposition.
 
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I voted leave; it had nothing to do with immigration and I remain happy with the choice I made.
Both sides lied in the run up to the referendum, that's simply what politicians and CEO's do.
 
If there hadn't been these immigration promises you'd be looking at a huge majority for remain,probably 90% of the working class that voted leave would've been their only reason,
blatantly obvious it's going to haunt brexit especially with working class voters,ukip thibnk they were going to get huge increases in voters absolutely no chance eventually all this will catch up with them thankfully..
 
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