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Donald Trump

I suspect Vance engineered it all. He started with the aggression and then wouldn't let Zelensky speak. Trump saw he was only a minor player and took the haranguing to a whole new level.

It was like a pair of out of control dogs rounding on a quiet one.

I suspect the millions outside of America who saw that episode will feel more for Ukraine than before.
 
Absolutely DO it all part of the preconceived ambush to show how masterful Donald Duck is ……..think it might backfire and hopefully unite Europe.
It would be interesting to hear from some of the many trump supporters who were contributing in support of him in the run up to the election.
 
Mrs O was out earlier and has just come back in. I mentioned the Jeremy Bowen TV piece this morning and tried to find it on iPlayer for her. I could find it but he has followed it up with a written piece.

This is an extract:

There are suspicions now that the public row was - in the words of one diplomatic observer - a planned political mugging: either to force Zelensky to do America's bidding, or to precipitate a crisis that would allow them to blame him for whatever happens next.
 
It definitely looked pre-planned with the whole disrespect for not wearing a suit, so maybe that was why it was public to get the most impact on a world stage. I think its back-fired spectacularly though and the world are astounded by their attitude. I thought Zelensky was incredibly restrained. They treated him like an idiot and Trump mocks him for being a poor comedian but the guy actually has a law degree. AND he won their version of Strictly!
 
I think that Starmer (and Charles) have shown political dexterity by inviting Zelensky to meet the king today. Given Trump's awe of the monarchy, it shows him like nothing else where our support lies. Starmer's body language and actions in Downing Street yesterday were also spot on.

As a by the by, has anyone seen quotes from Farage or Badenoch about Friday's farce? Definitely questions that need to be asked.
 
So this was taken from a post on Facebook and its an alternative view. I wondered what opinions are on this:

Many of you probably watched what took place between Donald Trump and Zelenskyy tonight. Whether you're a Democrat or a Republican, you might be thinking to yourself, Oh my God, Donald Trump just screwed up.
However, as a lifelong practitioner of martial arts, strategy, and philosophy, let me explain the difference between what you believe you witnessed and what actually happened.
Donald Trump has been under constant political persecution since the beginning of his first term. Over time, he has learned to be patient and calculated.
Tonight, Zelenskyy was invited to the Oval Office. However, both Trump and JD Vance knew exactly what Zelenskyy was going to do—he would use this opportunity, in front of the American people, to make a power play. Both Trump and Vance anticipated this.
When Zelenskyy began appealing to the emotions of the American people, JD Vance stepped in, accusing him of disrespecting Donald Trump. This was brilliant strategy. It’s important to understand that Zelenskyy is trying to gain access to NATO.
Trump knew this but could not allow it to happen. If Ukraine joins NATO, the U.S. would be bound by NATO’s collective defense agreement—an attack on one is an attack on all.
Now consider the larger implications: Ukraine and Russia despise each other. If Ukraine were to become a NATO member, any future skirmish between them would obligate the U.S. to enter into direct conflict with Russia. This would mean World War III. And if that happened, China would have to choose a side—they would almost certainly align with Russia.
So what you witnessed tonight was a setup. Trump and JD Vance knew that the only way to achieve peace was to strategically align, at least on the surface, with Russia. Why? Because Russia would never sign a peace treaty if Ukraine were admitted into NATO.
This is why Trump dismantled Zelenskyy’s argument. And when Zelenskyy, seeing his play failing, tried to backtrack and offer a treaty, Trump refused.
Zelenskyy’s real intent was clear—he would not agree to peace unless security guarantees were in place. But what was he actually saying? That NATO must accept Ukraine. However, Russia would never agree to peace, knowing that NATO, their historical adversary, would surround them.
Zelenskyy, Putin, and Trump all knew this. Zelenskyy, thinking he had Democratic support, believed he could make this bold move on live television. But Trump and Vance saw right through it and outmaneuvered him.
They knew that, in the short term, Democrats and the media would try to use this moment against them. But they also knew they had two years before midterms to prove their strategy was the right one. So they held their ground—brilliantly so.
Now, Zelenskyy will have no choice but to back down and accept Trump's terms. But here’s the genius part—Trump is actually protecting Ukraine without dragging the U.S. into war.
By negotiating a mineral deal, Trump ensures that Americans will be involved in Ukraine’s mining industry. This prevents Russia from launching an invasion, because attacking Ukraine would mean endangering American lives—something that would force the U.S. to respond.
Trump played both sides like a master chess player. In the end, Zelenskyy will have no choice but to concede, because without U.S. support, Ukraine cannot win a prolonged war against Russia. And once U.S. companies have mining operations in Ukraine, Putin will be unable to attack without triggering massive international consequences.
Don’t underestimate Donald Trump. In this game of chess, he’s 10 moves ahead of everyone.
All reactions:
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A very thoughtful piece there jinny, I didn't see/understand much of that detail when I commented earlier that " it's only a means to an end" but it's the take I got from Trump's performance
 
I think it’s a fanciful piece, jj. Trumps’s modus operandi is to keep repeating a barefaced lie until people come to believe it and let him get his way and/or just bully people into submission. If he’s a Grand Master of anything in ain’t political chess.
 
It strikes me as a very defensive piece of propaganda by the more intellectual minds within the Trump administration.

Trump is no genius. He has proved this over and over again. Vance is much the same, as is Musk.

I think the whole thing backfired spectacularly. That seems to be the consensus within worldwide political media.
 
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