Eclipse Stakes

[Gamla Stan]

Steve, it seems as though your strong opinions about the Eclipse & Arc are pre-conceived based on totally anecdotal observations so there's little point in trying to convince you otherwise!

 

[Bar the Bull]

I agree wholeheartedly with DO and EC1. Too many people poo-poo work like EC1's without any proper riposte.

 

[trackside528]

25 years of strikingly different relative results in two races such as the Eclipse and the Arc, should be enough to alert anyone that something basic is going on.

At a bare minimum, any analysis of relative results should surely factor into account:

a) % of horses of a given age that contested the race(s)
b) the quality of horses of a given age (difficult concept to quantify I know) that contested the race.

Without quantifying the "expected" result vs what actually happened, any conclusions derived are beyond flimsy for me.

 

[SteveM]

At a bare minimum, any analysis of relative results should surely factor into account:

a) % of horses of a given age that contested the race(s)
b) the quality of horses of a given age (difficult concept to quantify I know) that contested the race.

Without quantifying the "expected" result vs what actually happened, any conclusions derived are beyond flimsy for me.

For the love of sanity. Of course other things come into it. This originated from the simple comment that three-year-olds are up against it in the Eclipse. That other things come into does not disprove this. Even three-year-olds brilliant enough to win such races as the Eclipse and KG, such as Nashwan, can be bottomed by early exposure to the older horses.

 

[edgt]

Sir Henry Cecil was quoted as saying The Eclipse was not a suitable race for 3 year olds for that reason in a review of the 1987 race when Mtoto beat Reference Point.