Is Chamberlin Right?

[Desert Orchid]

I've copied and pasted the RP site article detailing Ed Chamberlin's views as expressed at the Gimcrack dinner.

I'm not sure I agree with him but it might be worth discussing:

ITV Racing's main presenter Ed Chamberlin believes racing needs to learn from other sports and become less reactionary if it is to increase its popularity.

Chamberlin's message was delivered in a speech at the 247th Gimcrack Dinner at York racecourse on Tuesday night when he told guests that much-maligned racecourse concerts were a way to educate people about racing and that jockeys were vital in helping promote the sport.

He said he believed there was much ITV could do to move the sport forward, adding: "But to do that we need your help."

Chamberlin, who returned to racing having been one of Sky's main football presenters, said that in contrast to football the language of racing "intimidates and restricts" and needed "demystifying."

He added: "Some frown on concerts that are now so popular at race meetings in the summer. To me they offer a perfect opportunity to educate people about our sport, engage them in our sport, and entice them to come racing again."

Chamberlin said he believed racing "has many advantages over football" but "there is also plenty we can learn from football and other sports."

"Sports always needs to stay trendy," he went on. "To be vibrant and appeal to the young. Football never stands still. It's always modernising. The latest innovations with the likes of Friday night football and Manchester City launching a restaurant with a one-way glass into the tunnel.

"In cricket the advent of 20/20 and its ever changing and hugely popular finals day. Plans are afoot to make Test cricket more sexy. A few years ago cricket looked to be dying on its feet but with its innovations, it seems to be on the rise again and set to join horseracing as one of the few sports on terrestrial television.
"Racing needs to do similar and get on the front foot and be less reactionary."

Chamberlin also called trainers to not only allow apprentice riders to do media training but to encourage them to do so.
"So far, we have just scratched the surface with the players, the jockeys, on ITV," he said. "It is crucial in the modern age with so much information so readily available, that we tell viewers something they don’t know. To be different. To give them unique insight. I believe jockeys are in the best place to do this."

Chamberlin concluded: "These are exciting times – yet I'd love to see racing modernise and engage.It's a wonderful sport – for the many – not the few."

 

[wilsonl]

but he completely and utterly misses out a key point

"Some frown on concerts that are now so popular at race meetings in the summer. To me they offer a perfect opportunity to educate people about our sport, engage them in our sport, and entice them to come racing again."

"Sports always needs to stay trendy," he went on. "To be vibrant and appeal to the young. Football never stands still. It's always modernising. The latest innovations with the likes of Friday night football and Manchester City launching a restaurant with a one-way glass into the tunnel.


Fair enough, let's open all of the stadium bars two hours ahead of the next West Ham v Spurs game and leave them open throughout the game, allowing the spectators to drink at their seats. Then, after teams have departed, open up the pitch so the crowd can mingle and watch the Madness tribute act late into the night.

 

[Desert Orchid]

The first thing I would disagree with is this assertion:

in contrast to football the language of racing "intimidates and restricts" and needed "demystifying."

I don't believe this is in contrast to football. A lot of people don't follow football at all and would be as intimidated or mystified by the terminology as in any sport.

I watch lots of 'minority' sports when they hit the main channels but have little understanding of them. Ice skating, shinty, even Rugby Union (my wife understands this malarkey a lot more than me because she followed it as a teenager). I have no idea about them but it doesn't stop me watching or enjoying them when I choose to do so.

And that, to an extent, is the rub.

I choose to watch them. And I choose to watch them when they're on mainstream channels. I wouldn't look through a TV guide for a station showing American Football. (For the record, I have no understanding of that either.)

What I do rely on is perceptive analysis, and that requires top notch people on the programme. Racing doesn't have that. In my opinion, football seldom has it but it's a sport for which I don't need it as I played at a decent amateur level until my late 20s and I reckon I can analyse a game better than most of the so-called experts with a TV sinecure.

All the programme needs to do is spark people's interest. It's then up to the people to go and find out more about it for themselves. If they can't be bothered to do that we shouldn't be banging our heads against a brick wall trying to explain the finer points. Engagement with the sport has to be a two-way street.

There is hardly a news bulletin goes by without some reference to cricket. I don't know the first thing about cricket. I don't want to know the first thing about it and I object to its being on the main TV news bulletins so often. But if I did decide one day to take an interest, I'd go and find out more about it for myself.

I'm just starting to do that with poker. I've seen it on telly and in films, going back to The Cincinnati Kid. I never got further than 5-card Brag at school but I'm interested in taking it up as my visual issues are restricting my form study. I've organised a toy-money session over the Christmas holidays as a way of 'revising' and learning more but I don't know the rules of, for example, Texas Hold 'Em. But I can go online and read up on it.

TV only needs to spark the interest. Moving the racing to the main ITV channel (indeed, that is what the presenters call it themselves) would help. Moving it to the BBC would help even more because people are lazy. BBC ratings are higher than elsewhere because it is the default channel on TVs. Many people switch their TV on and don't bother to change channels afterwards.

 

[an capall]

I think it was the mysterious complexity of the racing lexicon that first caught my interest to be honest. Decoding John Rickman and Julien Wilson while landlocked on rainy Saturday afternoons as a teenager tickled my interest enough to randomly pulled John Oaksey's biography of Mill Reef from the sports section of the library and I was hooked. On the sport, not the betting.

I feel the central thrust of ECs argument is that we need to package racing to attract the people that watch The Only Way is Essex as they are an untapped source of disposable income. He may be right - I just hope not. Mob chanting is already bleeding in at Cheltenham and I could do without it.

 

[Desert Orchid]

I feel the central thrust of ECs argument is that we need to package racing to attract the people that watch The Only Way is Essex as they are an untapped source of disposable income. He may be right - I just hope not. Mob chanting is already bleeding in at Cheltenham and I could do without it.

Yes. Exactly the type unlikely to want to find out more for themselves. Keep them the fvck away from us.

 

[Len Madeiros]

I think any sport can create an interest, just as easily as it can lose its casual audience's attention. Most sports will gamble that they won't lose too much of its hard-core support, but they can increase attendances and viewing figures by reaching out (I know, we all hate that soppy phrase) to a wider audience with disposable income ie, younger people. Without creating an interest among younger people, racing risks dying on its ars. I suppose one consequence of inviting a younger audience into the sport is that they will spot that NH racing is quite cruel, and will eventually call for its abolition.

 

[Grasshopper]

I think it was the mysterious complexity of the racing lexicon that first caught my interest to be honest.

I'm much the same, Colm.

Racing offers an intellectual puzzle that has absolutely no parallel in any other sport. Any comparison with football is therefore invalidated at source. You cannot dumb-down horse-race form into easily-digestible chunks. It takes effort (and time) to understand form, and the myriad inputs that go into weighing-up a horse-race.

The issue racing has - if indeed it actually has one (I'm not convinced of the argument myself) - is that people are lazy, and instant-gratification is preferred to any sort of graft. Chamberlain's states that there are "vast amounts of information available", as if this does not apply to horse-racing, when the reality is that the information available to punters in weighing-up a race is inordinate - but you have to have the will to apply yourself to assimilate that information, to form a view.

It sounds very-much to me like EC wants what is best for ITV Racing i.e. more engagement from surly jockeys. Maybe that's no bad thing, but if he thinks this will make the puzzle easier to solve, then he is blowing it out through his rear-end. Each jockey will have a totally different view on any given race; but they can all be boiled-down as follows:

"My horse has a great chance, and even if it doesn't, I won't say so, because I don't want to wind-up my Owner".

That being the case, jockeys input is basically useless, and renders Chamberlain's idea useless, in terms of its purported desire to demystify the sport and make life easier for punters.

Your average-Joe would rather spend 15 minutes sorting-out his 10-line Fixed-Odds coupon, than an hour trying to figure-out the winner of a single Saturday handicap - whatever a jockey might have to say about it. Such is the nature of the world we live in. Racing cannot change this, because it is a much-wider cultural issue.

PS. I have heard about racing being on the verge of dying on its arse, ever since I started following it in 1991. It's the same train of though that had IBM going bust because of Microsoft and Apple i.e. a load of old cobblers.

 

[Colin Phillips]

It seems to me that regular followers of racing are being taken for granted again. Is there any thought given to how many regular race goers would be driven away by trying to attract a younger following.

We see this in many instances of a business making offers to new customers without caring whether their present customers walk away or not.

I remember in the early days of Racing UK they reduced the subscription fees quite substantially, naively, as it turns out, I expected some sort of refund for the early subscribers. When I rang up Jim Ramsey, who was one of the head honchos, and asked about such a refund he laughed. I was not happy and told him I would end my subscription, his reply was Oh no you won’t and if you do, so what!

He was right I didn’t cancel my subscription but I was one very disgruntled customer.

 

[an capall]

i am thinking of franchising a new sport with the right tempo for modern TV audiences. I am torn between chess without pawns and bridge without hearts.

Any preferences?

 

[Dante]

I disagree entirely with everything Chamberlin says. I wonder how much he pays to get in any racecourse any time, nevermind just the extortionate charges that proper racing fans are expected to pay for the "pleasure" of having Madness or The Wurzels on, often accompanied by mediocre cards.
I used to love football in the late 60's and early 70's but detest it now.

 

[Desert Orchid]

Good stuff, GH.

Your average-Joe would rather spend 15 minutes sorting-out his 10-line Fixed-Odds coupon, than an hour trying to figure-out the winner of a single Saturday handicap - whatever a jockey might have to say about it. Such is the nature of the world we live in. Racing cannot change this, because it is a much-wider cultural issue.

I think your average Joe betting shop punter is as likely to spend only a very short time deciding what to bet in a horse race or, more likely, multiple races as with the football. I suppose they - the bread-and-butter punting fodder for the industry - are what keeps the whole shebang going rather than the likes of the people who populate forums like this one, who are more likely to spend some time trying to maximise their chances of finding either the winner or the best betting angle in the race.

 

[wilsonl]

i am thinking of franchising a new sport with the right tempo for modern TV audiences. I am torn between chess without pawns and bridge without hearts.

Any preferences?

I'd go for the chess but combine with a telephone vote to decide next moves.

 

[Danny]

Agree very much with the views on here especially An Capall who has probably summarised my exact thoughts on the matter. I grew up amongst hooligans, deadbeats and yobs. By whatever name you want to refer to them just basic degenerates. Racing took me away from that sort of world. I feel sorry for the people who don't get the beauty of it all I really do, I feel sorry for the people who don't understand it the passion and excitement of race day the ones who just don't get "it". To think of "making racing sexy" turns my stomach its one of the few things in life that remains unspoilt from a bygone era of respect and decency. Unfortunately the next generation who are the ones we are supposed to try and attract are generation X-Box, half the cast of Walking dead (the dead half), a generation of retards and I'd include my own daughter amongst them. Spoilt, useless and lazy in the main in they haven't got an App for it then they can't do it. They don't get it, will never get it. You want popular then you look no further than X-factor, Jeremy Kyle, Grand theft auto, Geordie shore, love island and you tube funnies of cats or people just generally being daft Pinapple pen anybody ??...we live in an age where Jedward are millionaires and I'm bloody ashamed that I even know they exist but if that doesn't say it all then nothing does.

Please don't change our sport to become more mainstream I'd personally rather it die on its arse than become an unrecognizable circus.

 

[an capall]

Agree very much with the views on here especially An Capall who has probably summarised my exact thoughts on the matter.

It's taken the best part of two decades on here to find someone who agreed with me. Worth the wait, thanks Danny.

 

[Maruco]

I'm not sure there's anything remotely controversial with what Ed Chamberlain has said. Setting aside the big Festivals and key Saturday meetings, if racecourses are to survive they need more people through the gates. The more (diversity) they offer the more likely they'll see bigger crowds. The same is true of non-raceday revenues where racecourses are generally poor at adding to their income.

On the subject of concerts, generally they are at second and third tier Friday or Saturday fixtures, where the racing is generally pretty average and not usually sold out. Also the concerts are after racing and have no impact on the racing whatsoever.

With regards media training and access to more of the jockey and trainers I couldn't agree more. How can that possibly be a bad thing. We always hear from the same old crown. Why not hear from others who are perhaps too nervous to do themselves justice in front of a camera.

His final comment is the one that resonates with me most though. Racing is for the many - not the few. I completely disagree that he's aiming his comments at the 'Only Way Is Essex' set, and that's nothing more than a cheap shot. I don't doubt for one second that Chamberlain's comments are well intentioned. He's a racing man through and through. He's just not a racing snob. I've been involved in the sport in one way or another for the best part of 50 years, and racing snobbery has been part of the problem. Fortunately though racing has been changing over the last decade with new ideas to attract new racegoers. I applaud initiatives that help to attract new people to racing, barring hooligans who can turn up at any event where alcohol is on sale. The truth is though that hooligans don't need music or media trained jockeys to act like idiots. Just alcohol. And guess what, that's always been freely available at racecourses.

It amazes me that there are still people who believe post racing entertainment ruins the sport. How??? Do they understand basic economics? If they do, they'd understand why it's necessary for many of the smaller course to put on entertainment. Getting more people through the gates is the only way they've been able to survive. What's the alternative? A significant hike in admission prices? Or close the racecourse? And guess what, if that happened the die hards will then blame the racecourse for not doing enough!!!!

 

[Danny]

It's taken the best part of two decades on here to find someone who agreed with me. Worth the wait, thanks Danny.

Hahahahaha, Magic!

 

[G-G]

but he completely and utterly misses out a key point

"Some frown on concerts that are now so popular at race meetings in the summer. To me they offer a perfect opportunity to educate people about our sport, engage them in our sport, and entice them to come racing again."

"Sports always needs to stay trendy," he went on. "To be vibrant and appeal to the young. Football never stands still. It's always modernising. The latest innovations with the likes of Friday night football and Manchester City launching a restaurant with a one-way glass into the tunnel.


Fair enough, let's open all of the stadium bars two hours ahead of the next West Ham v Spurs game and leave them open throughout the game, allowing the spectators to drink at their seats. Then, after teams have departed, open up the pitch so the crowd can mingle and watch the Madness tribute act late into the night.

Exactly - most of the people who book tickets for a race meeting when a band are on after racing have no interest whatsoever in the racing, it's cheaper to see George Ezra at Ascot than it is to book the O2 or wherever, a great many do not arrive much before the last race, and a lot that do that do just clutter the racecourse up with their **** head behaviour and don't even watch the racing. One group at a flat meeting in the summer were deafening all around with shouts of 'come on Fraaankiee' until I pointed out he didn't actually have a ride in the race. If they want to have concerts at racecourses, fine, but sell different sets of tickets and have a controlled entrance just for the concert , anything to keep them separate.

 

[Maruco]

Exactly - most of the people who book tickets for a race meeting when a band are on after racing have no interest whatsoever in the racing,

A great many do not arrive much before the last race, and a lot that do that do just clutter the racecourse up with their **** head behaviour and don't even watch the racing.

You say this based on what? This certainly hasn't been my experience. Granted that is the case with some, but certainly not the majority as you suggest. Wide sweeping comments like this GG are part of the problem. People take them at face value and then jump on the bandwagon.

As I said in my previous post, would we prefer racecourses to take the initiative or close down? I'd swear that some people think only the Grade 1 tracks exist.

 

[Grasshopper]

If struggling tracks can manage to survive by putting-on additional events like concerts, then fair enough.........but I don't see many bands rushing to play at places like Hereford or Hexham.

These events are almost exclusively held at tracks that aren't struggling - they're just a means to boosting already healthy-enough revenue, so I'm not sure your point is valid, Paul.

And I'm not sure what any of it has to do with the point that Chamberlain was trying to make either.

 

[Simon Nott]

I posted my humble opinion here http://www.starsportsbet.co.uk/simon-nott-was-what-ed-said-balls/

 

[Maruco]

If struggling tracks can manage to survive by putting-on additional events like concerts, then fair enough.........but I don't see many bands rushing to play at places like Hereford or Hexham.

These events are almost exclusively held at tracks that aren't struggling - they're just a means to boosting already healthy-enough revenue, so I'm not sure your point is valid, Paul.

And I'm not sure what any of it has to do with the point that Chamberlain was trying to make either.

Not true Nick. I've been racing at any number of smaller racecourses with post racing entertainment. I can't speak specifically for Hereford and Hexham, but I'd be surprised if they've never put on any post-racing entertainment. And those courses that are boosting the already healthy enough revenue are often compensating for others in the group that are loss making. Some are just money making and getting people through the gate. If just a small percentage of those people decide to come racing again and pick up and interest in the sport then what's the problem?

Outside 8-10 UK racecourses many of the others work on a financial knife edge each year.

In terms of Chamberlain points, of of which he says "Some frown on concerts that are now so popular at race meetings in the summer. To me they offer a perfect opportunity to educate people about our sport, engage them in our sport, and entice them to come racing again." This is what it has to do with, alongside points that have been raised earlier in this thread.

 

[an capall]

In terms of Chamberlain points, of of which he says "Some frown on concerts that are now so popular at race meetings in the summer. To me they offer a perfect opportunity to educate people about our sport, engage them in our sport, and entice them to come racing again." This is what it has to do with, alongside points that have been raised earlier in this thread.

I accept your point that my short hand stereotype of people who watch TOWIE sounded elitist, but I was trying to convey a thought with a dissertation on demographic types. Let's stick with it for now.

I probably tend towards being change averse as I get older and whilst I accept the need for change in all sports, it needs to be done without risking the embedded values of what made them great in the first place. I long for the days when a goalscorer simply shook hands with his colleagues on the way back to the centre circle and didn't spend two minutes kissing his wedding ring, making love hearts with his hands before embarking on a choreographed dance of inanity. I detest 20-20 cricket and these days even some holy hurlers are starting to simulate fouls and cheat. I go to Cheltenham every year and loathe the end of day at the course when the true believers tend to drift off and leave the place to the chanters and pukers. Sometimes it seems like there wasn't even a race meeting that day.

If I had some wishes to make going racing more attractive I'd start with these 1. Get rid of enclosure separation (especially in Britain) and the hi-viz clowns that police the accesses. 2. Increase places to sit and rest and converse by a factor of 10. 3. Pick a more intelligent point on the price curve to determine entrance fees (ref: Longchamp, Arc day)

 

[Grasshopper]

Fair enough, Paul.

Going back to Chamberlain's main point, given ITV Racing is the principal terrestrial TV showcase for UK Racing, isn't it actually part of his job, to 'educate and engage' a new audience?

Chamberlain was obviously picked by ITV as he was a well-known face from Sky, and has a smooth and professional presenting-style. Unfortunately, he is also as dry as a stick.

If Chamberlain - as the primary conduit to a new target audience - can't generate the enthusiasm he suggests is needed, then someone else should be handed the keys. Many don't like his style, but if Chapman was in-charge, I'd say he would have a much better shot at widening racing's appeal, especially amongst the young - the renegade in him would very-much appeal to Millennials, I reckon.

Whilst I still dispute the overall thrust of Chamberlain's argument, as always seems to be the case with Racing, the flaws are easy to promote, but practical solutions are rarely offered. Didn't we try all this bollocks with Racing For Change recently anyway (another black hole for money)?

I'm all for more people becoming interested in the sport..........but those already involved in Racing (trainers, jockeys, administrators, racecourse execs, the Media etc etc) all need to realise that they're actually a part of the problem. Throwing their hands-up and beseeching "What can be done??" doesn't really wash with me, I'm afraid.


Edit: some good points there, Colm.

 

[Maruco]

I accept your point that my short hand stereotype of people who watch TOWIE sounded elitist, but I was trying to convey a thought with a dissertation on demographic types. Let's stick with it for now.

I probably tend towards being change averse as I get older and whilst I accept the need for change in all sports, it needs to be done without risking the embedded values of what made them great in the first place. I long for the days when a goalscorer simply shook hands with his colleagues on the way back to the centre circle and didn't spend two minutes kissing his wedding ring, making love hearts with his hands before embarking on a choreographed dance of inanity. I detest 20-20 cricket and these days even some holy hurlers are starting to simulate fouls and cheat. I go to Cheltenham every year and loathe the end of day at the course when the true believers tend to drift off and leave the place to the chanters and pukers. Sometimes it seems like there wasn't even a race meeting that day.

If I had some wishes to make going racing more attractive I'd start with these 1. Get rid of enclosure separation (especially in Britain) and the hi-viz clowns that police the accesses. 2. Increase places to sit and rest and converse by a factor of 10. 3. Pick a more intelligent point on the price curve to determine entrance fees (ref: Longchamp, Arc day)

I think what you're describing there Colm is a change in society over the last decade or more. Racing is simply reflecting that change. I'd also say that by comparison it's more of a problem in the UK than it is in Ireland. Too much alcohol and the odd ruckus isn't a new thing though. The first time I saw a full on punch up on a racecourse was 35 years ago at Newbury, and although I've not seen it too many times over the years I'd accept it happens more often these days. In my opinion providing entertainment for racegoers isn't the problem, the problem is a something much more far reaching. Racing needs to attract a younger audience, and the younger generation seem to be less and less able to handle drink. And for what its worth though I've seen as many problems with the younger 'racing set' as I have with the younger casual racegoers. In fact when I think about it I've seen more problems with younger racing set recently than any other group.

With regards the seperate three points you make, I'd agree with all three.

 

[Maruco]

Going back to Chamberlain's main point, given ITV Racing is the principal terrestrial TV showcase for UK Racing, isn't it actually part of his job, to 'educate and engage' a new audience?

Chamberlain was obviously picked by ITV as he was a well-known face from Sky, and has a smooth and professional presenting-style. Unfortunately, he is also as dry as a stick.

If Chamberlain - as the primary conduit to a new target audience - can't generate the enthusiasm he suggests is needed, then someone else should be handed the keys. Many don't like his style, but if Chapman was in-charge, I'd say he would have a much better shot at widening racing's appeal, especially amongst the young - the renegade in him would very-much appeal to Millennials, I reckon.

Whilst I still dispute the overall thrust of Chamberlain's argument, as always seems to be the case with Racing, the flaws are easy to promote, but practical solutions are rarely offered. Didn't we try all this bollocks with Racing For Change recently anyway (another black hole for money)?

I'm all for more people becoming interested in the sport..........but those already involved in Racing (trainers, jockeys, administrators, racecourse execs, the Media etc etc) all need to realise that they're actually a part of the problem. Throwing their hands-up and beseeching "What can be done??" doesn't really wash with me, I'm afraid.

I agree with the thrust of what you're saying Nick apart from Chamberlain and Chapman themselves. I reckon it's a personal taste thing. For me I like them both in the roles they're in. In my opinion it works. In addition I can't imagine Chapman in the anchor role. He's just a shade too maverick for comfort.

With regards their responsibilities it almost feels like the team have been at pains to appeal to a wider audience. I'm just not sure they've figured out how to go about it. Widening appeal for me is about getting people to the racecourses. You don't get casual viewers watching racing and then heading off to their local racecourse the following weekend. It happens in reverse, which is the point I've been making so badly in my previous posts. Anything that can be done to encourage people to go racing should be encouraged. The key then is the experience they have, and how to get them back there again. This is where racecourses fail badly.

Bu tit's not just about the racecourses. I also think we as racefans and racegoers also have a responsibility. Collectively we are able to make the biggest difference. I've never taken anyone racing that hasn't thoroughly enjoyed it and not wanted to go again. Surely therefore the best way to introduce someone to racing is for them to go with a racing fan. What better way to find your way around, get the most out of the experience, and debunk the racing language.

I've often thought the best way to encourage this is for racecourses to offer first time discounts, referral discounts on admissions, and to add in loyalty schemes added to regualr attendance at the races. It wouldn't take a genius to get a good programme in place. Plus there is a big benefit of picking up contact details so information can be pushed out, and promotions and discounts can be offered.