Sea The Stars - Retirement Announced

sunybay said:
Hawk Wing had an amazing career and achieved more than ROG in the track.
Click to expand...

By achievements I mean the (Group 1) races they actually won, so it's:

a National Stakes, Eclipse & Lockinge

vs

a Grand Criterium, Dewhurst, 2000 Guineas, Irish 2000 Guineas, St James Palace, Sussex Stakes and Moulin.
 
Give me Hawk Wings National Stakes and Lockinge and even his Derby defeat over anything ROG did on the track.
 
James Willougby summed up Hawk Wing far better than anyone else ever will. 'They said he was the second coming, but he keeps coming second''
 
ROG list of achievmeants was outstanding, something that I would not say about any of his performances.
 
Galileo said:
In truth things could have been very different if Hawk Wing was kept at a mile and given a ROG campaign.
Click to expand...

In truth or in speculation? He hardly set the world alight when second to Where or When in the QEII did he? Hawk Wing's head carriage, and the traits he has passed on to a lot of his progeny suggest his issues weren't lack of stamina after the Guineas (bar probably the Derby, though lets not forget he was still 12l clear of the rest).
 
davidjohnson said:
In truth or in speculation? He hardly set the world alight when second to Where or When in the QEII did he? Hawk Wing's head carriage, and the traits he has passed on to a lot of his progeny suggest his issues weren't lack of stamina after the Guineas (bar probably the Derby, though lets not forget he was still 12l clear of the rest).
Click to expand...

There was never a hint of head carriage issues etc prior to his Derby effort. I think that effort hurt him badly and he was not the same horse that season - a season that was when Ballydoyle shutdown for a few weeks when the majority of the horses had a virus. Had he not gone the Derby route I think he would have cleaned up - but you are right it is only speculation on my part.
 
Rock of Gibralter was a very good horse and won a lot of good races, but he didn't have as much ability as Hawk Wing, who won less.

:surrender:

If Derek Thompson (:adore:)made some of the points posted in this thread he'd be accused of being a patronising wanger.
 
Last edited:
Re Hawk Wing Vs ROG in the Guineas, obviously I was aware that they were in the same field and that the form book will show ROG finishing before HW but anyone who saw the race, analysed the result and concluded that ROG was the better horse on the day should be locked in the basement and not allowed to bet horses :)

I'm more inclined to take the view that it was the Lockinge that bottomed Hawk Wing rather than Epsom. I think they went so fast that day in the first five furlongs, he must have done himself some damage. He burst a fair - but not truly top class - field to pieces yet the time was 'only' good. I'd love to know how fast he did the five and six furlongs that day on soft ground. Those eleven lengths work out at almost 25lbs on good ground (less on account of the soft but still an awful lot) and those behind had figures in the 120s on their CV. It looked easy but it couldn't have been.
 
Last edited:
Said it before, will say it again, it's what horses actually do on the racecourse that counts, not what might have been 'if'.. HAWK WING was a heavy topped, wussy bloody thing, a typical WOODMAN, who with any other trainer would probably not have done as well as he did.

ROG beat him fair and square in the Guineas. That colt won 7 GROUP Ones in succession, to a total tally of three Group Ones for HAWK WING and yet still, for some unfathomable reason, the same old guff gets trotted out every time. I just don't get it.... ROG is another horse like STS who simply didn't know how to run a bad race and who certainly never gave up either.

I know which one I'd rather own!!!!
 
Songsheet said:
Said it before, will say it again, it's what horses actually do on the racecourse that counts, not what might have been 'if'.. HAWK WING was a heavy topped, wussy bloody thing, a typical WOODMAN, who with any other trainer would probably not have done as well as he did.

ROG beat him fair and square in the Guineas. That colt won 7 GROUP Ones in succession, to a total tally of three Group Ones for HAWK WING and yet still, for some unfathomable reason, the same old guff gets trotted out every time. I just don't get it.... ROG is another horse like STS who simply didn't know how to run a bad race and who certainly never gave up either.

I know which one I'd rather own!!!!
Click to expand...

You are completely entitled to your view, and most of what you say is probably right - but it is impossible to say with any certainty that ROG beat him fair and square on Guineas day - they may as well have been running on different racetracks that day - a mess of the highest order.
 
Apparently they did the same thing with Bernardini Gal ie. it was available but not via the main site for a while. Still might be on to something.
 
I'm not sure - I think it's a spoof but it seems to be from the official Darley site which is a worry. Though the links at the side are blank.
 
No point to have tried the USA if his winter coat was coming through. Other physiological changes such as his blood thickening would also be taking place, as his system readies for winter. Flying him out into 90F heat wouldn't be a brilliant plan, so like so many other top performers now, he's off the make little starlets. Can't wait to see what his fee will be!
 
Back
Top