For the nostalgic among us the original and greatest
will win thread
Hi Slim, its been nearly 4 years since our interview during your amazing run of winners on the original will win thread in 2013 so thanks for taking the time to catch up. So its June 4th 2016 and Big Ben has just finished 3rd to Stellar Mass at the Curragh. That was the last post on the will win thread. Take me back, why was that the end
Its hard to gauge exactly when the thread died as I had a pain in my bollocks with that thread and forums in general for a while. The previous day I had put up one of Richard Fahey's that was backed from 5/6 into 2/5 and won 5 lengths hard held. I got two thank you messages on the forum, I thought "what's the ******* point." I also had a clown working me with that day saying he wouldn't back the horse because Jamie Spencer was on it, I lost it with him. The betting industry, like betting shops, is full of idiots and you get sick of educating people. I'd had enough. In my mind no matter how many winners I put up I was losing far too much life utility and was a net emotional loser regardless.
So your posts more or less fizzled out on the forum and eventually your account was deleted. Explain why one of the most frequent posters quit?
It wasn't a conscious decision to stop posting it happened organically. I probably jumped the gun having my account deleted but I was sick of people in the industry knowing what I was posting and perhaps questioning my ethics. I only ever posted information which I sourced externally from the workplace but I was paranoid to how others would view it. Also I was busy knocking winners out of the park.
So the will win messages obviously didn't stop, can you touch on what you did after the thread died.
I still posted the odds bet on the thread up to 2016 but I mostly took it offline. I needed to get on rather than give away winners for nothing other than the adulation of guys on a forum, most of whom I'll never meet. In 2015 I hadn't a betting account to my name and despite getting the best of info I just couldn't profit enough from it.
This was when you floated the idea of a betting syndicate on the forum to be taken off site?
Correct. I put it out there on the NBA thread to see what the reaction would be. I asked for people who were interested in letting me pick the bets and for them to get the bets on and we would all to share the spoils equally. That way everyone was bringing something to the table, the importance of which I touched on in our last interview. I had around 5 people contact me. One guy thought he was going to pick bets too and share information, I politely declined his offer. I ended up with three lads but one dropped out for personal reasons.
So the three of you got off to a flying start?
Quite the opposite. it was nearly dead before it started. We backed John Monash at all prices from 9/4 down in the Stratfod bumper before the Cheltenham festival. It was sent off 8/11, dogged it on the run in and got beat a head. Nothing really happened for a few weeks because I was up the walls working during the festival and didn't really have anything to get stuck into. It looked like we were going to disband and an email was sent between us saying who needed to send who what money to settle up. At the end of the email there was a rallying cry which went something along the lines "OR we could put some more bets on which is what the point of the ******* syndicate was." I respected him for sending the mail and calling it like he saw it. Our next bet was a JP winner backed from 8/1 into 11/2 and given a typical Fran Berry the money is down ride. The two lads were hooked and we never looked back.
How did the syndicate evolve and what was your relationship with the two guys, I presume they were guys given your record with women?
Ha! Yeah they were two lads, one from the UK and one from a place far far away. They were great, it was a hell of a lot of fun. I consider one of them a friend of mine now despite having never met him but he'd be embarrassed I said that. The in joke became that I was the Quarterback and what ever bet I wanted they'd get it. They were incredible at getting bets on. I'd send a bet request via Whats App and I'd have a message back in minutes saying the bet was on. We were not betting massive amounts but we were turning over a lot of cash, it was brilliant.
So what was the strategy and was there any big wins?
Good question. I didn't start out with a plan or a strategy but it evolved over time. We were building the pot easily doing singles but I kept onto to both of them that we needed to add multiples to really make an impact. We had access to two Bet365 accounts so on the big days multiples are a vital weapon in your artillery. The Thursday of Royal Ascot 2015 is a day I'll never forget.
That was the day Ryan Moore rode a 785-1 treble
So the day started with me in the PP racing department head office at 8am. There was two of us working that morning and we got hammered, I mean ******* hammered. The structure of the races on the day was insane, it was an e/w benefit for punters. The phone was almost ringing every time before I put it down.. All the bet requests were x hundred each way on the same perm of horses. It was unbelievable. Eventually the third man showed up late and the burden eased somewhat by 11am. At that stage I started sending bet requests to the two lads on the Whats App group. We staked a fair chunk. I noticed that Waterloo Bridge was getting very lively in the first. It was 18/1 with the firms but they were asking 9/4 it to place on the machine. 9/2 the place was some value. I though "Jesus, we better get a bit more of this in play." The last bet I sent out to the guys was a request for €15 2x2x2 each way trebles. That may well prove the biggest bet I'll ever be involved in landing. Waterloo Bridge 18/1 won the first and when War Envoy 12/1 got up by a neck in the Britannia we had two bullets in the last for the sweep. Space Age 10/1 made all in the last and we netted around €50k between the three of us, it was surreal.
How did the two guys react?
That was the best part, the money really meant something to them where as I was thinking I'm one step closer to 100k. One of them bought a car for his wife or something stupid like that. The three of us raised a glass to celebrate in three different countries that evening, it took a good while to come down that night.
Did you put your money away in a savings account?
Nope This is the first picture I took when arriving in Vegas a few months later...
So is the syndicate still going?
No we took out too much cash and the inevitable poor run kicked in after I got back from Vegas and the pot dwindled. We built up a big position on the Eagles winning the NFC East in the NFL. I think when they were 11/8 we had them for €12k and their demise was similar to the syndicate. We got badly beat up in November and December and I got a pain in my bollocks and disbanded the syndicate.
Was there any regrets?
I missed firing off bets everyday but I didn't feel I owed either of them anything. They had won more money then they could ever have dreamed of on their own and learnt a thing or two about betting. It was time to move on.
So you've tasted betting senior hurling now, you know you can't ever go back. How do you reach those heights again?
I don't. My partner loses her job after we get back to Dublin after Christmas. That was some blow. Instead of planning financial security I'm back slinging it out in the gutter. It was a testing time.
When you say it was a testing time do you mean the relationship with your partner or your state of mind?
They're not mutually exclusive, one is directly correlated with the other. I was the betting Quarterback that was the MVP in the Super Bowl and now I was 0-7 and no prospects of making the playoffs the following year, everything suffered. It's that feeling of failure that is very hard to kick. No one else is judging you but you're conscience keeps you awake at night that you're not in a better position and that you're not as good as you think you are.
Like our previous chat, we're getting to the darker side of Slim Chance. What was the low point of 2016?
I'd struggle to think of a highlight, I felt like the world was against me, everything suffered. I didn't give a **** about work any more, I was sick of pandering to cunts for nothing. I looked around the room and saw lads that were in the job 10 or more years and I had no respect for a lot of them. One of them in fact, repulsed me to the end that I called him a clown and that I wouldn't have him sweeping the floor at the 2015 Xmas party. He was shocked but I didn't walk my comments back in the proceeding days, I meant them.
What was it certain colleagues that you lost respect for these people?
I have to tell this story because for me it sums up the parasites that swim in the reptile infested pool of the betting industry. A few days after I landed the €50k touch one character in work asked me if I wanted to go for a beer after work. Now everyone knows I struggle to turn down a beer but it was a strange request as I wasn't overly friendly with said colleague. We hadn't got 50 yards from the office after work when he asked me for a loan of €1k to pay his rent. I was appalled, it made me physically sick. he was everything I don't want to be. He was in a job he was no longer any good at, living on past glories and skint because he's a degenerate gamble. He didn't get a cent off me.
So obviously there's a lot of moving parts here. You no longer enjoy your job, you're beating yourself up over not turning €16k into €100k and you've struggled financially for the first few months of the year because of things out of your control, what gives?
Nothing. things just got worse. I was in the height of **** at work because my performance had completely dropped off. The merger was a load of bollocks and had sucked the life out of the work place, going to work had become a drag so I went to HR and explained my concerns. The night before I hadn't slept because of the stress of what was going on in work and that was not an isolated incident. They offered me a way out and I quit.
How do you pack in a good paying job in these economic times?
Because I had nothing to lose anymore, I didn't give a ****.They offered me a stupid amount of money to walk out the door that day. It was the best I had felt in a year. I felt liberated, I owned my life again. I didn't tell people I was going to try and go pro because I know people and people want you to fail so I didn't want the scrutiny.
How do you pass the days? Do you miss working
Very easily. I've learnt more in 4 months punting then I did in the last 4 years. When its the rent on the line it matters more. My days are structured between getting bets on and networking and doing a bit of house work!
How has it affected other parts of your life?
My future has never been so uncertain but I've never been so satisfied with life. I'm in good form everyday unless I'm doing my absolute brains and I get far more pleasure in the smaller things in life like meeting my girlfriend for lunch or walking her home from work. Things you're too tired to do when the life is sucked out of you in an office selling your soul for shareholders 45 hours of the week.
Are you still involved in syndicates?
Not formally no, I've done some great networking and have the parts in play to be really successful, I just need to keep in between the party. I'm confident I can chop it off or at the very least make enough money to not need to work. The most fascinating character I've met is a pro punter of ten years. He went out of his way to get to me because he thought I could add to his artillery, he was right. I'll be disappointed if we can't win a chunk together.
Obviously not working and having a steady income is a massive risk. have you looked for a job?
I've done three interviews. One in London when I nearly threw up in Hammersmith at the idea of this being my life. I spoke to an outfit in Gibraltar that made working there sound like a life sentence and most recently with a wannabe big exchange player in Cork
Did the idea of going home to Cork not appeal?
I thought I had the job, they checked my references and everything but I'm a good judge and when I came out of the interview I wasn't convinced I'd got it, When I did my second PP interview I knew I'd nailed it. The employers aren't the problem, its me. I can't sell myself on something I don't believe in. Instead of speaking with passion I now rattle off a correct interview answer without breaking stride. I don't want the job and they know it. How can you be passionate about getting €2.5k a month to have the have the life drained out of you doing a job a chimp could do? The individual flair in the game is dead. When I got off the train in Cork for the interview it felt like going backwards in life. I'd worked in Cork City in 2010 and I wasn't that person anymore. It felt like failure and that's no way to live your life in pursuit of a "career". The taxi driver thought I was a dub and treated me with contempt, his accent annoyed me. I thought "**** this ****, he doesn't know I'm originally from around here, what a condescending prick." It was time to go back to Dublin and dig in.
What does success look like now to you
Surviving when everyone is expecting me to fail.
OK I think we've taken up enough of your time, its 4am and there are bets to be placed in a few hours. For the inferiors on the thread can they expect the Will Win thread to revert to the glory days of 2013?
I don't think the winners can automatically be replicated but the sense of fun on the thread can. If there is one thing I've learnt from the syndicate its that winning with others is far better than counting your winning alone. I'll see over the next few days and weeks what sort of bets I can source for the guys on here without upsetting anyone who's feeding m the good stuff. Watch this space.
