US Presidential election 2016

Had a look, but unfortunately there's nothing to lay him against on Betfair -- not a penny. Nobody it seems wants to back him. One could of course offer a price but it would need to be crazy high to get any takers. :(

Might be worth backing Kasich then?

Logic says that Maine shouldn't vote for an evangelical Texan. In an open caucus you get the chance to negotiate. I can see kasich supporters persuading Rubio supporters to cross if they can see Trump isn't killing it

Looks like Maine has gone for Cruz. I've under estimated the Tea Party
 
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new poll coming in from Michigan seems to be giving Kasich a 2pt advantage

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep...gan_republican_presidential_primary-3933.html

Trump appears to have blown a massive lead there. He had an open goal and he's (literally) cocked it up. I can only assume that bragging about his dick was the final straw to generate these kind of swings, and thinking about it, why wouldn't it be? Women will recoil at this kind of vulgar behaviour, and blokes will just think feck you. I reckon 'chopper gate' might have swung the whole thing against him - its possible. We still need to see Kentucky and perhaps more pertiently Louisiana which is a primary rather than a closed caucus, but he might finally have over extended himself by trying to turn it into a penis competition :lol:

I'm optimistic for the first time in months that he's blown it, with what has to go down as the biggest blunder and one which was so completely unnecessary. It's almost poetic though that having shown how shallow he was on policy, he's done himself by his own dick. It's also worth noting that Rubio (who started the whole dick thing) is also paying the penalty. I'm sure that this show of vulgairty is turning the contest more than anything that's occured in the field of policy or GOP manouevring

I reckon its worth taking a punt on Kasich tonight (or after he gets blown out). The states will start to swing for him after this round. If he converts Michigan in a few days time, he could go right through the mid west WTA. He would be the choice of the RNC
 
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He had an open goal and he's (literally) cocked it up. I can only assume that bragging about his dick was the final straw to generate these kind of swings,
That, and Romney's intervention?

There seems to be a discernible swing towards Cruz going by last night's results. The Donald, even though he won La and KY in the end -- it was by small enough margins, much smaller margins than the pre-voting polls predicted.
Rubio seems to be a busted flush now.
 
Rubio was the other player in 'dickgate', indeed, he started it, and he's fallen off a cliff since (even though he should win PR today). This is what's making me inclined to think what the American's have dubbed the DDD was the crucial factor (Detroit Debate Debacle)

If you look at the recent polling compared to the result however, the damage to Trump doesn't appear as catastrophic as first thought

KS - 23 from 35 (the big loss)
KY - 36 from 35 (he added a pt)
LA - 41 from 43
(MI) - 31 from 42

There was never any data for Maine, even though the conventional thinking was that Trump should win there. It was a closed caucus however in a small state. There were always grounds for thinking he was vulnerable there, but he was well beaten in the end. I got that bit right, I failed on the identity of the assailant though! I can only assume that the much vaunted Cruz ground game (a euphamism for Tea Party) kicked in. This should become an informative insight going forward

It's worth noting that Nate Silver has already poured cold water on the ARG poll for Michigan explaining that there are house errors in it, and that they've consistently over estimated Kasich by an average of 6%. Needless to say however, this was a state that Trump seemingly had locked up until a few days ago. He's put it back in play now. At the very least he's on a reduced delegate count. He should still carry Mississippi based on his performance in Lousiana and Alabama, and effectively lock up the deep south.

There's a lot of moving parts, but I think the picture is becoming a bit clearer now

Trump is clearly struggling in caucuses (2 from 7), particularly 'closed' contests. There are only 3 caucus states left now (Hawaii, DC, & Montana)

It would be helpful to make up a list of the WTA states now and see just how they're selecting their candidate. Open Primaries are Trump's best bet

Despite what happened in Maine (the result seems to have come down to one county on the Canadian border that broke heavily for Cruz), I think Trump is still holding the Atlantic coast and all things being equal you'd expect North Carolina, New York, New Jersey, Delaware, Connecticuit, and Maryland to hold (could be vulnerable in Maryland to the Baltimore effect, but I can't imagine that there's that many black Republicans). Going inland a bit I'd expect he can probably take West Virginia too

Where he's not making the progress I thought he would is Ohio, Pennsylvania, Indiana, Michigan, Illinois, and Wisconsin. The only state he was polling well in amongst these was Michigan. That was a bit of a stronghold until he introduced 'Mr Helmet Head' to debate. OK Kasich holds a clear hand in Ohio, and you'd expect that Wisconsin could follow Minnesota for trending purposes. This is starting look like where it will now be won or lost. The question is can Cruz get traction here? Logic says not, but the key is going to be Kasich

I don't see Trump doing anything out in the west (or can he?, there are yankee influences on the Pacific coast). Well he might uniquely stand a chance against Cruz? He leads the polls in Arizona but I expect John McCain to oversee that result for Cruz. New Mexico, California, Washington and Oregon all look tough, and will require some kind of game changer. Utah is Romeny country, so you forget that. Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Nebraska and the Dakotas? I can't see how his fascist brand will overpower Cruz's evangelicalism

There is however a possibility that whilst America starts to breath a sigh of relief and perhaps begins to realise that Trump is beatable, this has to be tempered by the candidate who is emerging as the best bet!!! Ted Cruz is staright out of the Curtis LeMay school, except with lashings and lashings of God to boot.
 
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They wouldn't dare, or would they? Wouldn't that just make a complete farce of the whole primary/caucus system?

It depends what their objectives are. If they take the view they can't win the White House, then they might be prepared to surrender the Presdiential race in return for keeping hold of Congress and the Senate. At this point Romney becomes an expendable candidate who can be relied on to maintain a narrative without damaging the brand. As things are shaping up, would he make the process anymore of a farce than Rubio? Marco Rubio will have been categorically rejected, Rommel hasn't been. Their only other option is Ted Cruz, who to be honest, is nearly as bad, albeit he fits the typology that the GOP strategy wanted, its just that they dind't want him as an individual
 
Decent money lining up now wanting to back Kasich for the nomination -- £1,250 between the 17.0 and 21.0 range. The current back price is down to 17.0 from the 22 last night. :blink:
Will you consider trading out your 40's at the present rate for 100% profit, or do you think there is further price-reduction in it over the coming days/weeks ?
 
As things are shaping up, would he make the process anymore of a farce than Rubio? Marco Rubio will have been categorically rejectedl
Which is precisely what I was saying re: Rubio in post #523 above in the circumstances of a brokered convention. It would be just a complete pisstake of the populist voting system ( primaries/caucuses, etc) if he were to be given the nomination. The same applies to a similar Mitt Romney scenario, imho. Would they dare?
I really think Kasich is a better punt for small stakes.
 
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The Kasich bandwagon (if it exists) is dependent on Rubio's participation and the focus then switching to the rust belt

I think it probably does exist

I expect Rubio to take the stage for the last debate, even if he's only assigned the job of 'Trump taunter general'. He might conceivably pull out just before polling in Florida and avoid humiliation, but that will depend on whether he or Cruz is challenging Trump. Tragically for the GOP, Ohio votes on the same day. I expect Kasich to carry his home state, and therefore to remain in the race

The 15th is clearly the crucial date, as indeed many commentators/ observers had predicted weeks ago. It could finally see the field narrow to Trump and Cruz (what an indictment). If that happens you would expect Trump to win I think as people start to look at Cruz and see Barry Goldwater all over again. I expect Kasich to stay in though.

If we get a three horse race, then there's enough states left for Kasich to pick up enough delegates to make him credible at a convention. I wouldn't be shocked if he took California ultimately even though the received wisdom is that Cruz will
 
I am more understanding of people voting for Trump than Cruz, horrendous person. He also looks pure evil.
I do agree. Cruz seems to me to have some very fearful opinions and views -- somewhere to the right of Genghis Khan.
Trump for all his bluster and bombast is somewhat behind Cruz's extremity in matters of Planned Parenthood, women's rights, social welfare, and even migrants. And the idea of Cruz as CiC of the armed forces is scary -- the guy's answer to most foreign policy issues seems to be "carpet-bombing".
I don't like either of them, but as you say in a hobson's choice scenario I would prefer the Donald.
 
I am more understanding of people voting for Trump than Cruz, horrendous person. He also looks pure evil.

You might enjoy this clip

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN1IXDrXgV0

Cruz, is without doubt the most sinister candidate left in this race. Trump is an apprentice nazi compared to Cruz. But what does it say about the GOP that these two emerge from a field of 17 originally?

I think the fact that they've been taken on different days (different ties) probably excuses Cruz myself :lol:
 
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Ate you trading a book on this?
Yes, I suppose I am, mate, although the position I took 48 hrs ago on Kasich is small ( 20 pony's ) thus any possible profit will also be subsequently small. I'll bail for green-up if-and-when his price drops into single figures.
Funnily enough, this market (Republican Nominee) is about the only market of the entire presidential betting landscape that I have traded so far. I also did Trump a month ago in same for a larger amount at 6.6 and got out at 2.5. Which was nice. :)

A few other "straight bets" here-and-there for fun in other markets -- Carson, Bernie etc etc, and the occasional primary/caucus punt.


edit: Kasich at 11.0 now ................. close to single-figure land .
 
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WINNER TAKES ALL STATES - These are all closed Primaries unless otherwise stated

CURRENT SCORE - TRUMP 384, CRUZ 300, RUBIO 128, KASICH 37


South (deepish)
Florida - 99

Mid west Great Lakes
Illinois - 69 (open)
Ohio - 66 (semi closed)
Wisconsin - 42 (open)
Indiana - 46 (open)

Mid west others
Missouri - 52 (semi closed)

Great Plains
Nebraska - 36 (semi open)
Utah - 40 (semi open)
Idaho - 32
South Dakota - 29

West
Arizona - 58
California - 172

North East
Delaware - 16
Maryland - 38
New Jersey - 51 (semi open)
New York - 95


PROPORTIONAL STATES

Michigan - 59
Mississippi - 40
North Carolina - 72 (semi open)
Rhode Island - 19 (semi open)
Oregon - 28
Washington - 48
New Mexico - 24

CAUCUS STATES

Hawaii - 19 (closed)
DC - 19 (closed)
Montana - 27 (closed)

Trump already has the south sewn up. The east of Louisiana broke heavily for him, which we'd combine with Alabama to expect him to carry Mississippi this week. Florida is anyone's guess. It's clearly fluid I think with Cruz having now declared war against Rubio there. Florida with its Cuban ex-pat, and northern retirees doesn't quite behave the same as the other deep south states

You would expect Trump to carry the North East still

You'd expect Cruz to take the Great Plains and to build on Iowa and Kansas by adding Missouri

The two difficult battlegrounds to work out are the Great lake states where Kasich becomes a player, and the western states that haven't really been tested outside of a Nevada caucus

So far Cruz hasn't managed to poll more than 20% in any northern primary. I did read he's failed to poll more than 20% in the non evangelical group too, but can't remember where, so can't source that one. His hopes do seem to rest on the western states and California in particular. I understand he's getting panned in the Bay Area and LA, and you'd expect he'll struggle to Trump in San Diego if the results from Virginia are replicated (navy influence) but the general view at this stage is that he starts favourite for the Golden State
 
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Something I'd overlooked

Louisiana was a state where early and absentee voting was allowed. Apparently Cruz won the day of the vote count. Now if there are no polls between now and Tuesday for Mississippi, you might get a big price on Cruz that could justify an exploratory rattle on him

Florida has allowed early voting which might help secure it for Trump and protect Rubio a bit from the Cruz onslaught
 
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Having dwelt on this a bit longer now, I think there's a 50/50 chance that his Presdiential penis might have sunk him, but the betting markets aren't showing it yet

On a policy issue, people glaze over and quickly forget it if you flubb a technical answer to a question on something like TPP. People don't forget someone bragging about their dick though! If he were responding in the heat of a personal exchange he might have got away with it, but it was in his opening statement. Had he apologised for getting sucked into a juvenile exchage started by Marco Rubio, explained that he thought he was trying to inject some humour into the repetitive debate circus, but now recognises it was misplaced, he might also have limited the damage.

This is why I think the results from Saturday are concealing a swing against Trump

He lost Kansas more heavily then any poll had predicted
He lost Maine in a part of the country where he had hitherto been strong. OK, there might be mitigating circumstances. It was a closed caucus and he lost it largely on the strength of a single county way out on the Canadian border (a quip he's already made about Cruz getting his hometown vote) but he still lost

His two gains are concealing something though

Kentucky is what's called a 'firehouse caucus'. So far as I can gather it was a caucus in name only. It actually behaves more like a primary. Candidates aren't allowed precinct captains doing speeches and voter intimidation where the local pastor curses anybody who doesn't vote for the evangelical. Although I've only read one account to suggest they allowed early voting, they probably did.

What isn't disputed is that Louisiana did allow early voting, and that Trump lost on the day of the ballot. He'd hitherto been rock solid in the deep south, but we have to consider he'd have lost Louisiana without this. Basically his penis position hadn't been fully exposed to the results in these two states. Only Kansas and Maine were able to vote on whether the size of his chopper made him a more attractive candidate, and they said no

Enthusiasm for Louisiana is admittedly tempered by the geographic distribution of the vote. Cruz won the west of the state picking up the counties that neighbour Texas as we might expect. Trump won the east picking up those that border Mississippi.

We also have this poll from Michigan to consider where he's gone from 42 to 31 and lost his lead not to Ted Cruz, but to John Kasich. Now Nate Silver has pointed to some polling errors and ARG's track record, and cautioned that we treat this as an outlier, but he still conceeds that Trump has likely done quite a bit of damage which hasn't yet shown up in election results

By deciding to make his anatomy an election issue he's also taken the debate into new areas. His support has absorbed his numerous policy gaffs but his dick brings him into a whole new area. Can anyone imagine a scenrio where his popularity rises because of it? It's just a hunch, but I think this might prove catastrophic yet, and if it is to, now might be the chance to take a few bets against him before the market catches up or polls get published later today that start to reflect the decline in popularity

Nap - I think you can lay him for the nomination (with the RNC as back up)
I think you can back Ted Cruz or lay Trump for Mississippi
Florida includes early voting so I'd be a bit more nervous about entering that market
NB - I think you can lay him for Michigan
They're making Cruz 2nd fav in Michigan, I think it might be worth backing Kasich who should have the greater traction in the state
If he loses Michigan to Kasich, he's going to lose Ohio too, and quite possibly Indiana and Pennsylvania (I'd be less certain about Illinois)
You might even consider the next candidate to drop out market. Trump is thin skinned. If he loses Florida and Ohio, he'll know he isn't winning the nomination and could actually drop before Rubio, especially if he wants to run third party as he'll need to get his name on the ballot

If I'm wrong, then I'm wrong, and the rollercoaster rolls on, but if this has caused a bit of a sea change, tomorrow will be the day we find out for the first time, not last Saturday. You don't get many chances in political markets at decent prices, so you have to be ahead of the curve and take a chance. I'm not convinced myself. At best its 50/50, but I do think there are clues there to support the idea that Trump might have done himself a whole lot more damage than has hitherto been revealed. It's just a hunch at this stage, but the market will quickly correct if he has done. At the moment he's priced up much lower than 50/50 anyway

Who knows, he might even drop out the race on the 16th!!!
 
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Might have to conceed that my flight of fancy is over

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep...gan_republican_presidential_primary-3933.html

This poll includes findings from the Detroit debate cycle and although Kasich gets a bounce, it's at the expense of Rubio. Also Trump appears to have taken the absent Carson votes too. Looks like Nate Silver was right to sound a note of caution regarding the ARG poll

There is an attack poll from Florida this morning that has Rubio just 5pts behind Trump, but this was taken in the lead up to ST, and before Rubio's collapse. RCP don't include in their averages because it was commissioned by a Rubio leaning campaign pac, and the pollster is also given a health warning by fivethrityeight

It looks like it might be business as usual and the Trumpster is still on the road and rolling
 
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Might have to conceed that my flight of fancy is over

That's a pity. I was sort of hoping your previous post had correctly interpreted a changed mood in the republican electorate -- that post-dickgate the grassroots and the evangelicals had come to see Trump as some kind of Durty Sex Thang and were deserting.
Wishful thinking.
 
I think things are very fluid at the moment. There's a lot push polls flying about, and a lot of contradictory information and opinion. It isn't easy to cut through it. I think on balance though I've over-estimated the backlash against Trumps 'jumbo'. I think it was there for a few days and I thin k he was widely ridiculed with many just despairing of him, but it seems to be subsiding a bit now. It might be enough to overturn 10% in closed causcuses, and possibly 5%-7% in a primary, but at the moment the evidence is mounting that my hunch is wrong (or not right enough to be more accurate), as I think he's losing a bit of support, but not on the scale that he needs to

Also my massive oversight (and God knows why I made it having stressed the point earlier) is that Michigan is an open primary, as is Mississippi. This format suits Trump better than any. It's just possible that any kickback from the base won't show up tomorrow either, as independents can cushion fluff the turnout

In other news

"As the race stands now, with Republicans in charge of both Houses, there is a good chance that my candidacy could lead to the election of Donald Trump or Senator Ted Cruz. That is not a risk I can take in good conscience"
- Michael Bloomberg

Will he form an anti extreme super PAC now to counteract the Koch Brothers?

Also Cruz has opened up series of offices in Florida and started running some very aggressive attack ads against Rubio in the last 24 hours. The suspcion is that 20% of the state have voted early, and Rubio has done well amongst this group (as has Trump). Florida seems to be one fo the few states where Trump has something resembling a ground game and he's spent time there campaigning. The consensus is that Trump will take the state and that Cruz will be neck and neck with Rubio on the day.

Obviously if Cruz can beat Rubio then it finishes 'lil Marco off, but does it mean he drops? Cruz is trying to drive this down into a head to head as quickly as he can. He knows he won't win a brokered convention if Rubio or Kasich are credible, so he needs to eliminate them. He could potentially overhaul Trump still if sweeping the west and the plains states and only suffers a manageable defeat by the time they arrive in Cleveland

There's some fascinating strategy going on right now
 
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Seems like Rubio is melting down and is now being attacked heavily in Florida by both Cruz and Trump

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryPrRr8L21M

Apparently his day of the vote figure completely collapsed in Louisiana too. I think we could be looking 'lil Marco struggling to break single figures in places

Expect Trump to hold on in Mississippi (42% Trump against Cruz 40%, Rubio 11% Kasich 7%)
Trump to win in Michigan (Trump 39% Kasich 33% Cruz 22% Rubio 6%)
Cruz to win Idaho (Cruz 48% Trump 33% Rubio 13% Kasich 6%)

Hawaii is anyones guess Rubio has apparently lost a lead there, but the artcile didn't say to whom! I suspect there could be a military vote in Hawaii which might favour Trump if it turns out like it did in Norfolk for Virginia. I'll take a flyer though on it being closed caucus and say. Trump has won a caucus in Nevada, but it isn't his strength. In 2012 only 1417 participated which gives you some idea as to how crazy it is to call. Hell, it probably only requires the navy's payroll division to turn up and caucus and they could probably swing the whole thing

Trump 28% Rubio 26% Cruz 25% Kasich 21% - pure guess work

In other news, there are seemingly credible sources citing arguments in the Rubio camp about dropping from the race rather than facing Florida and losing spectacularly to both Trump and Cruz in his home state. Sense that there is blood in the water now and no way back for Rubio
 
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Mississippi exit poll

Trump 45%, Cruz 36%, Rubio 9%, Kasich 8%

Easy win for Hillary in the other race
 
Michigan exit poll of the earliest districts that have finished polling:
Trump 35.0%
Kasich 35.8%
:blink:

And YAY, Bernie 5 percentage points ahead of Clinton ! :thumbsup:
 
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