US Presidential election 2016

I read loads of stuff in my teens about this type of thing, but it drove me mad. If I want a good dose of paranoya I just watch the X - Files. :)

I know. the idea that someone from the CIA is waiting in the white house tells the president exactly what to do for the next fours years is straight out of a bad b movie aimed at 12 year olds

The believers of this tripe are naturally assuming that the president was elected on a mandate to build a socialist venezuelan paradise or to cosy up to the Putins of this world. objectives which the CIA simply had to stop by walking into the oval office and pointing a gun to his head

in fact even a cursory examination of the presidents actual powers would prove to any twit that they are far more limited than is often assumed. Thankfully. not every leader is a gadafi or saddam to the disappointment of some


or maybe its the lizards?
 
Last edited:
Actually, scrap the above. The last time I looked she was odds-against, now 4/9.

She will be for some time yet. She has the Obama endorsement to come, and her husband

Her big advantage is with female voters. I don't see how Trump stands a chance there, or how he can really get that ground back

Having said that, there is such a thing as the 'October surprise'. A terrorist attack committed on US soil in particular, and by someone who entered the country legally after Nov '15 will likely give Trump the White House, as its going hand him the 'told you so, I was right' narrative; Trump keeps you safe, Clinton puts you at risk etc

I don't think President Romney through the backdoor will happen incidentally, (there is a reason its 200/1) but equally I'm not convinced its a 200/1 possibility either. There are certainly some influential Republicans known to be looking at the possibility of whether they can hold both candidates below 270 using 'local heroes', and then letting the house decide. I just don't see how it works though with the degree of confidence you'd probably require in anywhere other than Utah.

You basically need to find candidates who can stop red states going blue, but do so in such away that running an alternative to Trump doesn't split the vote and let Clinton through. I don't think it works in Ohio for instance where its been suggested (you have a kind of precedent from 1992 when Bill Clinton won comfortably enough there).

I'm aware that its being mooted for Texas, and could be used as a backdoor for Cruz yet using the same strategy. Its a risk. It would guarantee Trump can't win, but its risks letting Hillary in with no insurance policy, but in theory, Cruz could yet capitalise on the same tactics

To summarise it

There is a very strong probability that Romney could take Utah without letting Clinton snatch it
There is a decent chance Cruz could take Texas without Clinton getting it too. This would work as an insurance against Trump springing a surprise in somewhere like Michigan
Cruz winning a local hero verdict in Texas would stop Trump regardless of him winning Florida, or Ohio
It then becomes a crapshoot on Wisconsin, New Hampshire, and Iowa as to whether or not Hillary can get over the line (she might get a local vote in Arkansas yet which would also be enough)

http://www.270towin.com/

She could easily struggle in Iowa, but the balance of likelihoods is that she'd get one of New Hamsphire or Wisconsin, but I wouldn't say it was 200/1 against that

Trump thinks he can put Michigan into play, and its true that both he and Bernie Sanders won primaries there campaigning on trade protectionism. But it still looks like a long shot to me to turn Michigan red. Ben Carson (born in Detroit) might give him some play, but I doubt it in truth
 
Last edited:
I mean, nothing ever really changes does it. They have no infrastructure worth a ****, the rich getter richer and the poor get poorer. So whomever gets in, whatever his intentions, are for nothing after 4 or 8 years.

It's an outmoded system of Government. Y'll should watch Joe Rogan's recent podcast with an Australian guy called Adam Cropp. In it they speculate that in 30 or 40 years we won't need president's, prime minister's etc - we aren't a ******* tribe who needs a chief are we. The Internet is the key, we all have access to so much more information and knowledge so why can't we vote on these issues ourselves rather than rely on some corrupt representative.
 
Last edited:
To summarise it

There is a very strong probability that Romney could take Utah without letting Clinton snatch it
There is a decent chance Cruz could take Texas without Clinton getting it too. This would work as an insurance against Trump springing a surprise in somewhere like Michigan
Cruz winning a local hero verdict in Texas would stop Trump regardless of him winning Florida, or Ohio
It then becomes a crapshoot on Wisconsin, New Hampshire, and Iowa as to whether or not Hillary can get over the line (she might get a local vote in Arkansas yet which would also be enough)

http://www.270towin.com/

She could easily struggle in Iowa, but the balance of likelihoods is that she'd get one of New Hamsphire or Wisconsin, but I wouldn't say it was 200/1 against that

Trump thinks he can put Michigan into play, and its true that both he and Bernie Sanders won primaries there campaigning on trade protectionism. But it still looks like a long shot to me to turn Michigan red. Ben Carson (born in Detroit) might give him some play, but I doubt it in truth

This would be political suicide from The Republican Party. Is it reported anywhere than anyone thinks this is a good idea? Ignoring voters like this would cause rioting i n the streets.
 
This would be political suicide from The Republican Party. Is it reported anywhere than anyone thinks this is a good idea? Ignoring voters like this would cause rioting i n the streets.

A third party run has been under consideration for some time, with Mitch McConnell being to the fore of those briefing it, along with a bevvy of shadowy donors

McConnell is the ultimate political aparatchik, and naturally is worried about the damage that Trump does down the ticket in other races. His definition of political suicide is allowing Trump to become the Presidential candidate which would lead to the loss of the senate and the house. He can cope with a Democrat in the white house, so long as he's controlling the lower chambers

So far as I can gather, it's under consideration, and the grandees of the GOP are aware of its potential, but whether its just posturing or whether its serious, is anyone's guess. It is without precedent though. Running a rebel candidate against your own nomination!

The GOP have invested a lot of time in trying to cultivate a new powerbase only to see Trump destroy it. Critically, Trump isn't beholden to their donors, and can't be relied on to do what they instruct him to. Again, political suicide through their prism is their own loss of influence over a maverick candidate and the party that will no longer bend in the direction they want it to. They simply won't be able to direct policy like they've been used to. They're also extremely worried about the long term damage that Trump representing their brand is going to do. So far as they're concerned, its their party, not the Trump party

Another way a third party run might occur of course is if Trump is denied at the convention and decides to launch something himself. The likelihood there is that he'll confine hismelf to the swing states however with the view to putting the Democrats in. I doubt he has the time or the money (liquid) to get himself on the state ballots unless he's able to hijack something like the Libertarian party! He hasn't got the organisational base to start with. My own guess is that he's much more likely to sit in television studios being paid to bad mouth the GOP candidate rather than waste his money running a Bull Moose campaign

After having asked a few questions of folks however, the plot thickens - get a load of this

Lets assume that we have a result of Clinton 269, Trump 263, and Romney 6

In the event of a deadlock (failure to break 270) the house is offered the top 3 candidates to choose from.
At the same time the Senate (Republican majority) votes on the two respective VP's. The winner of this vote becomes interim President until such time as the house can resolve their vote. The likelihood therefore is that the next President (even if only a temporary one) will be the Republican vice presdiential nominee in the event of a deadlocked result

Now back to the house.

There is no way that any Democrat house member can accept Donald Trump. Any Democrat who broke ranks would get slaughtered at the next election and be out of work. In any event, Trump is a complete affront to them. They'll all vote Hillary. But that won't be enough

House Republicans could in theory drive through Trump using their majority, but its' likely that there will be enough dissent amongst them to ensure that some refuse to support and transfer instead to Romney.

The whole thing deadlocks

My own guess now is that some Republicans will eventually splinter off and agree to support Hillary, but Romney will be under consideration as a candidate of national unity. I suspect he'll be rejected because he lacks mandate, but he did carry 47% of the country at the last election. A figure incidentally that isn't going to be too far removed from what Trump polls all things being equal. Romney's probably unique in being the only single state candidate who could even plead a case.

His other avenue of course is through a contested convention (see notes earlier about how depressed delegates deciding on which way to lose might be energised if Romney becomes available in Cleveland). Our first clue of something seriously untoward going on here is if they change rule 40(b) which they can do on a nod the night before. The general feeling is that they will (its a bit like paying a supplementary entry fee in a horse race). If you decide to do it, its a relative formality

Now anyone who has kept up with this will realise that under my hypothetical scenario, John Kasich is Trump's VP nominee having gone rogue after he got knived in the April primaries and joined the Donald. It might also be at this point of course that with Kasich acting President the hosue Republicans simply hold their ground and don't budge, making it impossible for Clinton to be sworn in until such time as the hosue changes political control?

I suspect that should such a turn of events transpire, John Kasich would beat say Julian Castro (for sake of a name) in the VP senate vote and become temporary President. Would the bookies pay out on this? I don't know?

It all hangs on there being a third party run. If one emerges to run against Trump, then consider Trump's VP as a crafty bet, or if the candidate is credible, you might try backing them to see if they win a negotiated compromise in the house. At the very least, you'll get a lucrative arb

If you want my honest opinion, I doubt that Romney has the bottle to do it, but if he believes that Trump is really the existential threat to the United States that he says he is though ..... ? Well the stakes are incredibly high. There is an avenue open to him that although you'd describe as "unlikely" is neither impossible either

I should say there is a 'chatham house rules' meeting going on right now between Donald Trump and senior Republican figures. No one knows what this is about, but as you might imagine there are 1001 different suggestions
 
Last edited:
Isn't the itony of all this that the establishment are victims of the electoral process they put in place to protect their own interests.
 
Pretty amazing press conference between Presidebt Castro and Obama. Obama tried to force Castro into answering a reporters question on human rights.

How will history view Obama?
 
How will history view Obama?

No idea. I'd say pretty neutral at this stage, but I also think its fair to say that you often need a decade on to see the full influence of a President. I suspect he probably avoided a few snake pits that less prudent would have stumbled into

Mildly amusing exchange with some American's just now. It transpires that Trump has unveiled some of his foreign policy advisors and allowed it to be known that he's thinking of withdrawing from NATO which he sees as a waste of money. In fairness most Americans are horrified by it as an idea, but one of them did suggest that it was about time we (Europe) paid for our own defence. I did point out we don't need to, we've got Turnberry! There's no way he'll let that fall into Russian hands. It was agreed that he'd make an exception to defend the links courses of the UK and Ireland
 
Last edited:
Someone wants €46k @ 7/4 on Betfair on Brexit after the attacks this morning.
 
Last edited:
Mildly interesting tour socialmediasphere in the light of the Brussels attacks. I've speculated before that an attack on American soil in October would gift Trump the white house, looking at some of the emotional reactions out there, I'm convinced of it now

Today's events should play out for 'told you so' Trump and manage to get him over the line in the WTA state of Arizona. After Rubio dropped out there was a lot of 'noise' in the polling and when this happens late deciders have tended to go against Trump, but I suspect he manages he win by about 4pts

In Utah there's two questions really. Can Trump get 15% and qualify for delegates, and can Cruz get 50% and sweep it. I think Trump will get 15% now (he was below that figure on latest) but I also suspect Cruz will manage 55% with Kasich being squeezed

In America Samoa I expect Cruz to take the verdict

As a side note, the early (American) casualties from Belgium appear to be mormons from Utah, so that's a semi focus of their reporting. Cruz is hardly a peacenik though
 
I know. the idea that someone from the CIA is waiting in the white house tells the president exactly what to do for the next fours years is straight out of a bad b movie aimed at 12 year olds

The believers of this tripe are naturally assuming that the president was elected on a mandate to build a socialist venezuelan paradise or to cosy up to the Putins of this world. objectives which the CIA simply had to stop by walking into the oval office and pointing a gun to his head

in fact even a cursory examination of the presidents actual powers would prove to any twit that they are far more limited than is often assumed. Thankfully. not every leader is a gadafi or saddam to the disappointment of some


or maybe its the lizards?
Clive. I was speculating as to what the poster was referring to, not what I believe, as was James RB ffs.
 
Last edited:
No you didn't. Read it again

if it's supposed humour .. Womt have it ...You don't do humour
 
Last edited:
Clive. I was speculating as to what the poster was referring to, not what I believe, as was James RB ffs.

"The poster", is this my new name! Better off just calling me the cats mother :).

Ps, second thoughts.. I think you're referring to Euro. No worries.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for telling me that Clive. It's now really clear to me that I didn't know what I was referring to and you do.

I shall check with you in future.

Seriously!
 
don't check with him if its anything to do with winning friends or influencing people though..he's not too hot in that area..how he does business with anyone is a real mystery..must be an act on here:)
 
Back
Top