Wind operations

sunybay

sunybay

At the Start
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I wonder when these will have to be declared as are blinkers, visor , hood and when a horse is gelded.
 
Wind ops put PN on the map..he was one of the first to realise how important they are followed by NJH

Not sure of Martin Pipe was the first but he was bloody good at finding out what would make them run faster, longer:)
 
I once had a horse with a fairly prominent Irish trainer. (Think Hull City, not Chelsea.)

He wasn't finishing his races out and a wind problem was discussed. We suggested an operation. The trainer said - "yeah, why not, a few grand and he'll be beaten 15 lengths instead of 18 lengths."

Stuck with me.
 
A trainer can easily tell if a horse has a wind problem.......you only need to be standing close to a gallop and you can hear them.

Occasionally it doesn't become apparent until you run them and the jockey tells them.

Such was the case with a horse PN had.ran like a monkey at Market Rasen and they gave him the op.

He came back out was backed off the boards, won and went on to win the Galaway plate.

Of course the public knew nothing and when he won on his comeback, backed like money had gone out of fashion, punters having no clue why probably lost out.

It's not like trainers could hide it if they did introduce it on a race card and passed a rule that the vet would also have to report it to the BHA
 
Tipperary Tim had a tracheostomy op the morning of his Grand National run in 1929.
He won at 100/1, mainly because every other horse fell.
The Stewards introduced a ruling after that a horse could not run for 8 days after such an operation, presumably to give the opposition a chance to be better schooled !
Wind ops have been fine tuned in the past ten years to a huge degree esp by Paul Nicholls and co.
Getting horses to peak fitness after same used to be a problem as more training was required; PN and co have cracked that as well.
Of course the above procedure is now banned in race horses.
 
sunybay said:
I wonder when these will have to be declared as are blinkers, visor , hood and when a horse is gelded.
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Does the RP site also tell you when a horse was gelded. I know a while back I bought a RP on course and it had details in there but not on the website at the time. My friend had backed a horse on the flat and it had been gelded only 22 days earlier. On a stable visit one of the trainers (think it was Tom Dascombe) had said horses wouldn't usually run for around 6 weeks after a gelding operation and here was one just 22 days after the chop. Ran absolutely awful and my mate was cursing, saying if he'd known he might have thought twice about backing it.
 
mowgli77 said:
Does the RP site also tell you when a horse was gelded. I know a while back I bought a RP on course and it had details in there but not on the website at the time. My friend had backed a horse on the flat and it had been gelded only 22 days earlier. On a stable visit one of the trainers (think it was Tom Dascombe) had said horses wouldn't usually run for around 6 weeks after a gelding operation and here was one just 22 days after the chop. Ran absolutely awful and my mate was cursing, saying if he'd known he might have thought twice about backing it.
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look for the word g just under the horses name
 
Tanlic said:
A trainer can easily tell if a horse has a wind problem.......you only need to be standing close to a gallop and you can hear them.

/QUOTE]

Not strictly true - if a horse flips his soft palate (the fleshy bit at the back of the tongue, which can cover the windpipe), it is impossible to hear from the ground. And very few riders are able to identify it. Many horses do it as a nervous habit and you can hear them faintly especially when pulling up from a canter/gallop. A tongue tie helps hugely (its why the majority of horses in the US race in them) or if its bad then the palate can be cauterised.
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Well Jinny going back a few years when I rode out and rode work every other day if you were at the top of the gallops you could hear them whistle so loud the girls in the next village would turn round to see who fancied them:lol:

Not stricktly wrong either Jinny.......as you will know the'tr not all the same

I am no vet but even walking round the yard you can hear a horse who may have a wind problem and the obvious ones who after work pull up at at the top of the gallops gasp for air and wheeze like hell because ofthe lack of oxygen...........No doubt some trainers get carried away with it but it can make a huge difference to a horse.

NJH though Sprinter Sacre stopped in the Supreme because he was a bit too immature but when he was told it was his wind the op totally transformed him.

Obviously I can't pass an opinion from here on him but according to one pundit he said he still makes horrendous noises associated with his breathing?? don't know if anyone else picked up on that or not
 
But your talking bout Hobdays or tie backs Tanlic, soft palette cauterizing is a different wind op entirely.

One of the big Irish trainers gives every two year old in training an op, does them in batches and has them back in work very quickly
 
Miesque said:
But your talking bout Hobdays or tie backs Tanlic, soft palette cauterizing is a different wind op entirely.

One of the big Irish trainers gives every two year old in training an op, does them in batches and has them back in work very quickly
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Bolger?
 
It would only make sense to declare wind operations if they were all identical, but in reality the term can cover a variety of procedures some of which can be effective, others less so. Some of the bigger NH trainers are now routinely having expensive hobdays done on all/most of their young horses, regardless of whether the operation was necessary. So declaring this information would mean nothing.

The poor old punter would then have to ask himself a)what type of wind operation was it and b)was it necessary? And why stop there? What about stomach ulcers, which can have at least as negative an effect on a horse's performance as poor wind? I haven't yet heard that a course of Gastrogard should be declared, but I'm sure that something along those lines will be suggested before long.

All of which just adds up to information overload and further confusion for the poor punter.
 
Diamond Geezer said:
SS has had seven breathing ops
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I've heard 18 8 and now 7......Not saying he doesn't have a wind problem he obviously does but there's got to be more to it with him than that.

BG said he was noisy going down the back but as someone commented at one of the previews apparently he's always been noisy

Gawd knows he would have done plenty work prior to the QMCC and it's a fair climb up the seven barrows gallops

He reportedly worked brilliantly as ever on several occasions and nothing shows up then when the pressure on in a race he stops like shot.

I'm not a vet, far from it, but there's got to be something more than a wind issue.

They said they were going to scope him but if anything has come to light it would seem they are not talking. However I'd imagine if it's nothing obvious they will have packed him off up to Liverpool University or to somewhere like Newmarket Equine Hospital for thorough examinations over a period off time .......so it could be a few months before we hear anything
 
Tanlic said:
I've heard 18 8 and now 7......Not saying he doesn't have a wind problem he obviously does but there's got to be more to it with him than that.

BG said he was noisy going down the back but as someone commented at one of the previews apparently he's always been noisy

Gawd knows he would have done plenty work prior to the QMCC and it's a fair climb up the seven barrows gallops

He reportedly worked brilliantly as ever on several occasions and nothing shows up then when the pressure on in a race he stops like shot.

I'm not a vet, far from it, but there's got to be something more than a wind issue.

They said they were going to scope him but if anything has come to light it would seem they are not talking. However I'd imagine if it's nothing obvious they will have packed him off up to Liverpool University or to somewhere like Newmarket Equine Hospital for thorough examinations over a period off time .......so it could be a few months before we hear anything
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Have they checked his stomach ulcer levels? PJN has been ahead of the game with that, but I'm not sure about NJH.
 
I'd be surprised if they haven't checked him out yet - once one starts they all cop on! And the Lambourn vets are pretty good.

I just felt he didn't look as good as he has done in the past. When he was at the peak of his powers, he looked every inch the equine filmstar. Incredible gloss to his skin - that was missing this year. For me for a horse to be 100% at this time of year, it has to have a coat you can see your face in and dappling across its neck and down its quarters. The pointer I ride out looks superb at the moment, dancing around, sqealing & bucking on really good terms with himself - sadly hes bred for 7f and is the slowest horse out. He does try though and has been 3rd, 2nd & 4th this year. If we can find a 4m4f point to point, we may get a win out of him this season!
 
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One of the first noted wind op experts was Jeffrey Braine sr who perfected his skill operating on donkeys' larynx' during World War 2, so as donkeys bringing supplies to the front lines did not give away their whereabouts.
The original hobdey op has progressed to a wind op for every occasion.
The Nicholls' team have fine arted it obviously but their ulcer status needs fine tuning now.
Interesting that this problem occurs near the end of the season after a busy training/racing schedule.
My nutritionist buddy blames concentrate high energy high protein feeds which do not suit herbivores but there you go.
In the old days the feeder was the most important person in the yard, the larger stables having one to feed colts and one to feed fillies.
How many stables still have the feeder as the most important person ?
 
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