Bet 365 Sandown Gold Cup

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tiggers1972 said:
This heat of the moment **** is bollocks, they are jockeys and can count......end of story
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So are you arguing that all race winners where the jockey contravenes the whip rule should be disqualified??

I sincerely hope not, since 2-3 of mine would be put in that category and my prize money (not exactly a king's ransom) returned to Weatherbys.
 
LUKE said:
In the 2yo race at Doncaster tonight Richard Hughes eased the even money favourite prematurely and got done for 3rd place on the line-costing some Betfair punters a tidy sum.As far as I am aware there was no ban and nobody calling him a cheat.
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The horse was out cold after geeing terribly upset in the stalls and the paddock - Hughes was nudging and it made no difference it ended up sixth .

I think there is a dividing line between a minor and major infringement of the whip rules - going one or two hits over the line is very different to what Geraghty did today . I think a margin of error should be given but flagrant breach of the rules should lead to disqualification .
 
The Hughes horse finished 4th beaten a neck for 3rd-all he had to do was keep riding in the last 20 yards and he would have finished 3rd.There are punters out there who have good reason to feel hard done by.
 
frontrunner said:
FWIW I believe that any horse who's jockey gets a whip ban should be disqualified. Its a much bigger deterrent than a ban. I agree with Michael O , BG was way over the top today, and cant understand how it can be viewed as a good ride. That said probably the best jockey this season.
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I agree with this. It is perverse to have one set of incentives for the jockeys and a different set for the owners. Both parties should suffer if rules are broken.
 
Did anyone notice how much ground Spring Heeled made from the Pond fence?

It looked like he was being eased off maybe with a view to pulling up and was still only just on the very edge of the camera shot, about 30 lengths behind the leader, as they rounded the bend after the fence. He was noted as staying on past beaten horses but he made up 15 lengths from there to the line.

He'll be of serious interest in staying handicaps on good ground next season.
 
LUKE said:
The Hughes horse finished 4th beaten a neck for 3rd-all he had to do was keep riding in the last 20 yards and he would have finished 3rd.There are punters out there who have good reason to feel hard done by.
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Why ? there were only 7 runners .
 
frontrunner said:
FWIW I believe that any horse who's jockey gets a whip ban should be disqualified. Its a much bigger deterrent than a ban. I agree with Michael O , BG was way over the top today, and cant understand how it can be viewed as a good ride. That said probably the best jockey this season.
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Agreed on all counts - certainly that BG has been the best around this season.
A few days ban is clearly an insufficient deterrent especially in cases like this where the days missed are unlikely to be of much consequence and the day will surely come when a breach of the whip rules by the rider means the horse loses the race however harsh that might seem on the owner and trainer.
 
Imagine if the winner was disqualified yesterday -a winner on merit losing the feature event on Ch4 on a Saturday afternoon-would be another nail in the coffin of racing.
 
You could debate the whip and punishments till the end of time. Not an easy one to get right. I personally thought it was a good ride. The horse kept responding. Though I accept the point regards AP rode within the rules and probably would have won if BG hadn't used the whip as often as he did.

I am not one who would like horses being disqualified but accept the argument for it.
 
....and the day you win a life changing amount only to see your horse disqualified how do you react.Do any of the major racing nations disqualify for breaching whip rules.
 
LUKE said:
Imagine if the winner was disqualified yesterday -a winner on merit losing the feature event on Ch4 on a Saturday afternoon-would be another nail in the coffin of racing.
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Agree it would be calamitous for racing if it happened to the winner of the Grand National or the Gold Cup. But there's an argument to say that if a disqualification rule was in place then that situation would never arise because every jockey would be only too aware of the consequences of overstepping the mark. It would certainly stop the type of gross abuse that we saw yesterday.

The problem for the Stewards is they would need to call an enquiry immediately, often just acting on a hunch.

BTW, Geraghty was also fined £3150, which is about half of his winning percentage.
 
LUKE said:
Imagine if the winner was disqualified yesterday -a winner on merit losing the feature event on Ch4 on a Saturday afternoon-would be another nail in the coffin of racing.
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I'm not sure I agree with this. It might even help revive racing if casual viewers saw rules being upheld. Usain Bolt's disqualification from the world championship 100m final didn't kill the sport.

Letting a cnut of a horse like Battle Group hold up both the Aintree and Ayr Nationals caused no amount of stir among the once or twice a year viewers in my family.

I've been arguing for years along similar lines to michael. Once it becomes an established practice to disqualify the horse, there will be far fewer infringements of the rules.

You don't get many people stealing in certain countries where it's known that you'll lose your hand if you get caught.

If you want to instigate it, perhaps it can be made clear that it will start with races worth less than, say, £10k to the winner for three months, then £20k for the next three months, then £50k for the next six months and then a blanket enforcement after 12 months.
 
C4 racing will have plenty of casual viewers with no financial interest. In fact, it is more likely that a casual viewer will not have a financial interest. Mrs O occasionally watches the racing and a bet would be anathema to her.
 
Sandown is probably one of the toughest tracks with no rails to guide you as you climb the straight from the pond fence, especially after 3 miles plus.
Remember the disqualification of Cahervillahow and the various stewards inquiries after Whitbreads through the years.
Factor in that the winner pricked his ears after responding to each stroke, that Barry G of all jockeys is least whip happy and can get horses rolling like few others as witnessed by his riding all season, then 9 days is severe.
If the horse had no weals or marks and obviously responded then there should be some lee way in the rules imo.
I think there is a case to revisit a case if such a ride "bottoms " a horse to the extent that it loses interest in racing or fails to return to form subsequently.
If Hadrian's turns out to be a Brave Inca/Giants Causeway type of battler then the sentence on Barry is severe; if Hadrians never wins to this level again or turns into a Battle Group then it is not; simple as imo.
Many moons ago Christy Roche got into trouble over his ride on a Bolger 2yo in National Stakes of 1989 (name escapes me - a Nordico colt that won 1st 2yo race of the season)
That horse never won again until he was 5 and was a lead horse for St Jovite at home.
Obviously that horse got bottomed where as Giants Causeway probably lost a BC Classic over a dropped whip.
 
I find BG a bit of a Jekyll and Hyde as a jockey. Whilst everyone else appears to think he has had a wonderful season, my view is that he has had a good second half to the season. When the Henderson horses were running below par pre-Christmas, some of his riding was not very good. Where the whip's concerned, he can be an arse, frankly, and I tend to agree that there was calculation in his whip use on Saturday. The ride on HA was ugly.
 
Charteux , balloted out in this race by one horse, scored on Saturday at Punchestown by two lengths in a 30 K handicap.
I feel I was fucked over on a scale of Briareus when the Tote Trophy was abandoned some years ago (would have hacked up :))......... in the Bet 365 Gold Cup this year.
Different circumstances but same ending.. lol.
Think I've one particular trainer to thank for declaring about eight 33/1 shots and bossing the weights... but I won't name names!
Chartreux one to watch next season that's for sure...
Absolute must for the Ten-To-Follow
 
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Presumably you are referring to Venetia Williams who had four horses in the race, but where else was she going to go with them on the last day of the season?

I hope you had Charteux on Saturday.
 
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