Company Policies

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Phil Waters

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Can a company have policies and procedures that are not documented in any written form and expect to be taken seriously?
 
I think you're asking the wrong question Phil.

Few people I've spoken to regarding them, takes NTL seriously, so the question you should be asking is can they enforce it?
 
It's a disciplinary meeting I was taking minutes for last week and the lady (rightly) asked to see documentation relating to the validity of the "offences".

Nobody was able to produce documentation.

Amazingly, I was the only person embarrassed.

It related to an apparent "three absences benchmark". No documentation exists (apparently) backing up this policy.
 
Off topic I know but I'm quite impressed with my company's policy today - well, actions at least!

For longer than I care to remember half of us have suffered from back problems as the chairs are so poor - and we don't move from them for hours sometimes. On coming back from holiday in November I discovered that they'd finally decided to bow to our requests to get new chairs - and the bloody things were far, far worse than the old ones! These new ones provide no support hatsoever & if you try to lean into them they go virtually horizontal. After 6 weeks of increased back pain and visits to the chiropractor more than doubled (as well as taking more codeine than I care to think about) I emailed a guy in accounts outlining the situation and requesting a half decent chair, on the suggestion of a colleague. Within 30 seconds he emailed back to say he as onto it - half an hour later a guy from support services was in asking was I ok & could I possibly manage for another couple of weeks whilst they waited for my ne chair to be delivered? You could have knocked me down with a feather - although I'm in bloody agony where the top half of my spine has completely locked up!
 
There are those waaaaaaaaay better-qualified than me to speak on this, but surely a company as big as ntl has an Employment Handbook? I worked for the Saudi Oil Co. and that had one which ran to about 37 volumes, covering everything in great detail from qualifying for unpaid leave, medical referrals, promotions, pay raises, the annual employee assessment scheme, infractions of company policies, unauthorised absences, and the warning system which could lead eventually to legitimate dismissal. As an example, if you had incurred an unauthorised absence and had failed to either phone in sick for a day, or had taken off several days without a doctor's note, you could be put down as 'unauthorised absence' and not paid for the days you were away. If you obtained a retroactive note from your doctor or hospital, the pay MIGHT be considered for reinstatement. But all of this was spelled out clearly in one of the mighty tomes.

I can't see how a company can expect to be taken seriously if it hasn't produced hard copies of its policies, so that its employees fully understand and accept what they are bound by. Otherwise, every line manager could simply make them up as he went along, some contradicting others. You have to have standard policies which bind everyone, and if you haven't drawn them up, they don't exist.
 
Krizon, the documentation relating to sickness and absence policy is located on the company's intranet and I printed it all off and took it home to read. It is quite detailed but does not mention any "three absences benchmark" in any of its pages. Infact, the word "benchmark" does not appear at all.

The woman received an informal absence warning. She can't appeal because it DOES clearly state that you can only appeal against a formal decision.

I asked later about the benchmark rule and was told it did exist.

Just not in writing, apparently.
 
And was she made aware of this and any other non-written rules when she started work at the company, Phil? This is a bowl of doo-doo. It's like something by Orwell - you break the rules, but you didn't know the rule you broke. Or you wouldn't have broken it. They don't tell you the rule, they don't show you the rule, they just say you broke it, and you're consigned to Room 101... but you can't appeal because there is no appeal because it's not a written rule... sorry, I'm going to lie down for a while. :confused:
 
She could appeal if she had been given a formal punishment. Informal punishments have no right of appeal.

Oh, yes, another point I came across was that the purpose of the disciplinary policy and procedure is to be corrective rather than punitive.

Very funny.

The problem surrounds the whereabouts in writing of this policy (benchmark). It is said that if an employee is absent on three instances in a rolling 12 month period, they have reached the benchmark and any further absences within the 12 month rolling period can result in disciplinary action being taken.

I am concerned that nobody has been able to produce this policy in a document.

She was told that she would have received notification of this policy when joining the company, but it does not state the policy on any contract documentation that I have ever seen.

It's difficult to know what to do next. Not as far as the woman is concerned because her day has come and gone on this respect. I mean as far as going forward is concerned.

The management directly above my own position are very angry human beings. They appear to not like being challenged on anything.

It puts me in an awkward position as I challenge everything if I think it needs challenged.
 
I think you two would hit it off rather well. Two highly-opinionated, fiery, bolshie racing nuts tanking back a gallon or two of Merlot? Why, an evening made in heaven...
 
What the hell is merlot?

I would date Shadow Leader in a flash. If only to annoy the hell out of Jones who would be sick to the stomach.
 
Phil, I've had more informal warnings than I care to remember, and believe me there reaches a point where you take no notice. They can't be made to stick, and in this case, without a sickness policy the company would be well and truly stuffed in a tribunal. I'm frankly staggered that they aren't sent out with your terms and conditions, and would be interested to know what the legal position is regarding the DDA implications of only providing information on your intranet. My God there's enough who fail to follow their own procedures, and it's usually somewhere in this territory that you can snare them, but to not even have one :blink: . If I were you I'd discreetly look for other loopholes, as if they've made a glaring ommission of this magnitude, heaven knows how many opportunities they've allowed to go unchecked elsewhere.

Shadz, your case depends on whether you fall under EU legislation, as there is a directive on the subject. In the UK its considered an H&S issue and each employer has conduct a risk assessment and provide EU standard compliant chairs, where they fall below this threshold. Failure to do so leaves them open to claims, and you'd be amazed how many injuries people can develop when they think there's a bit of potential damages about. I got involved in a dispute about 2 years ago on the subject, which escalated out of all proportion :lol: . I'll spare you a blow by blow account, but everyone had new chairs 48 hours later.
 
No, to be fair Warbs - on one exceptionally polite email to the right person it was all sorted out - very much impressed!
 
Speaking of policies who put Ardross in charge of warnings?

I mean, this wikipedia thing about Cheryl Tweedy is crawling around multiple forums by now. But on here, not only is it removed but i receive a warning from our resident lawyer.
 
It was removed on the F365 forum, and the poster (and others) were banned.

And that's the forum that made some here die of fright when a link was posted to a joke poll about the Suffolk murders...
 
Let them sack her.............. then take them to a tribunal on constructive dissmisal, or and victimisation....you'll have them by the short and curlies!! did you all sign new contracts when taken over by this new VIRGIN company?

If not, your current contracts suffice and there was no absence procedure written into this either? if not you are on a winner......
Go for it PHIL............. ;)
 
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