Dingle Or An Daingean?

BrianH

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Irish town to vote on re-adoption of English name

Owen Bowcott, Ireland correspondent
Wednesday October 18, 2006
The Guardian


dingle372.jpg

Dingle harbour – the town has become a battleground for the preservation of the Irish language as it prepares to vote on re-adopting its English name. Photograph: Richard Klune/Corbis

A referendum to decide whether a remote fishing port formerly known as Dingle can readopt its anglicised name has become a battleground for the future of the Irish language. The row comes as preparations are made for Irish to become an official language of the European Union next year, despite the fact that no qualified interpreters have yet been recruited.

The result of what is technically a plebiscite among 1,222 County Kerry voters is due tomorrow and is expected to reveal strong popular resentment towards the government's requirement that it should be known by the Irish place name, An Daingean.

The county council has begun removing road signs bearing the word Dingle and replacing them with the new name. The town is within a Gaeltacht, one of the country's few designated Irish-speaking areas.
Ireland's Official Languages Act gives the minister for rural, Gaeltacht and community affairs, Éamon Ó Cuív, the power to order that only Irish place names be used in those areas. Mr Ó Cuív has warned that his department "cannot act on" the ballot, administered by Kerry county council, because it is not legally possible to have an English or bilingual name in a Gaeltacht area. He has said that the ballot has no legal basis.

But locals argue that if they win 612 votes - more than 50% of votes available - it will be a moral victory and should persuade the government to rethink its policy.

On a wind-buffeted peninsula jutting out into the Atlantic, An Daingean, as it is currently known, is the largest town within any of the Gaeltachts. Most of its income is derived from tourism. The decision by Mr Ó Cuív was highly unpopular with residents and the proposal in the referendum is to rebrand the port with a bilingual name - Dingle An Daingean Uí Chúis.

At Barr na Sráide, a pub on the town's Main Street, the owner, David Geaney, was confident of bringing back the old name. "People feel they are being bullied," he said. "They have lived with 'Dingle' all their lives.

"The fishing industry is nearly dead and farming is struggling. So 70-80% of the town's business is in tourism. If you are a tourist and trying to find the area, it will be a bit of joke if you can't find the name you recognise. We are all proud of our heritage but we want to be able to speak both [languages] and the minister is denying us the opportunity for that. Some traditionalists are slow to change."

It will not be a secret ballot and some fear it could prove socially divisive. Each postal vote has to be witnessed and individuals' names are on their papers.

The largest tourist attraction in the town for years has been Fungie the Dingle dolphin, a permanent resident in the bay who escorts the fishing fleet home. Trips out on a boat to see the playful creature are the highlight of many tourists' visits.

Those behind the plebiscite have warned that there is already another town in Ireland called simply Daingean, more than 100 miles away in County Offaly, and the name change could confuse foreign sightseers.

The chairwoman of Dingle Peninsula Tourism, Sile Gorman, has endorsed the bilingual solution. "Twenty years ago our children had to emigrate because there was no employment in the area," she said. "Now, because of tourism, our children have a real choice and can remain on the peninsula ... the government have spent millions promoting the Dingle peninsula brand and now they want to throw it away".

A vote by An Daingean to adopt the bilingual version would be an embarrassment for the government's promotion of Irish. On January 1 next year, following years of lobbying at Brussels, Irish will formally become an official language of the EU.

An advertising campaign has been launched seeking those qualified to meet the exacting standards of simultaneous translation required by the European parliament. Six potential recruits are undergoing further training. Only two MEPs - one Sinn Féin's Bairbre de Brún, from Northern Ireland - regularly use Irish in debates.

The one area where there has been a phenomenal growth in the use of the language is in cities where many families, particularly among the middle classes, have begun sending their children to schools where the whole curriculum is taught in Irish.

A spokeswoman for the department of rural, Gaeltacht and community affairs said: "The town name has always been An Daingean. The only thing that has changed is that the Irish form now has official status. If people want to put up tourist signs pointing to Dingle, that's fine."

Around 100,000 people are believed to use Irish as their main language on daily basis. At the last census nearly 43% of the population claimed to have some ability to speak the language.
 
An advertising campaign has been launched seeking those qualified to meet the exacting standards of simultaneous translation required by the European parliament. Six potential recruits are undergoing further training. Only two MEPs - one Sinn Féin's Bairbre de Brún, from Northern Ireland - regularly use Irish in debates.

This sort of crap annoys me. It's not entirely clear from the above, but are they saying they are going to have at least 6 dedicated Irish to Other language translators permanently available for whenever Baibre de Brun, a competent English speaker, wants to stand up and waffle in Irish. It must cost the bones of €250,000 a year to keep an employee in Brussels.

The one area where there has been a phenomenal growth in the use of the language is in cities where many families, particularly among the middle classes, have begun sending their children to schools where the whole curriculum is taught in Irish.

This phenomenon is surely not unrelated to fact that many of these schools have been producing exceptional Leaving Certificate results.

As for Dingle, it is no doubt in a beautiful part of the country, but has been ruined by profiteering as only Kerry people can do.
 
The European Parliament will need interpreters from Irish into each of the so-called bridge languages and vice versa to work at plenary sessions and committee meetings.

The Parliament will also require translators of the written word, as will the Commission, Council, Court of Justice and Court of Auditors. Every piece of Community legislation, invitation to tender, recruitment notice, etc will have to be rendered into Irish.

I imagine more than six people will be needed to take care of all that, and I am amazed the othe Member States agreed to it.

Mind you, I think the cost of maintaining an average EU employee in Brussels must be a lot less than €250,000. Not everybody is an MEP or a Commissioner, or even a head of unit.
 
This kind of thing really bugs me too. The thinking behind it is strictly "teach the children in Afrikanna" in nature. W@nkers.
 
Mind you, I think the cost of maintaining an average EU employee in Brussels must be a lot less than €250,000. Not everybody is an MEP or a Commissioner, or even a head of unit.

I made the figure up, but between salary, pensions, office accomodation, administrative support and training, recruitment costs, living accomodation and expenses I'd be surprised if the figure was way off the mark.

As you've pointed out though, the HR costs are only part of it.
 
I reckon the average gross cost per post is around €180,000 (£120,000), reducing to €160,000 when tax, health and pension contributions from staff are taken into account.

According to the Court of Auditors annual report, the EU spent €6.36 bn in 2004 on "Administration". This figure includes, as far as I can tell, everything related to salaries, pensions, office costs, training, security, embassies, settlement allowances, expatriation, the running of the twelve European schools, the EU's satellite agencies, the creches, medical fund, outside services etc. There were 33,043 permanent and 2,060 temporary posts that year. This gives an average cost per post of around €180,000 (or £120,000) per annum.

Staff contributions to the EU budget, pension fund and medical fund came to €740m, or around £500m, which reduces the cost per post to around €160,000 (£110,000).

Mind you, pension costs will rise in the future because the EU is still a relatively young and growing bureaucracy. When staff numbers eventually stabilise the cost per post of pensions will rise because the ratio of retired to active staff will increase.
 
Originally posted by Grey@Oct 19 2006, 02:01 PM
The EU spent €6.36 bn in 2004 on "Administration". There were 33,043 permanent and 2,060 temporary posts that year.

Mind you, pension costs will rise in the future because the EU is still a relatively young and growing bureaucracy.
Glad to see it's still growing...

:lol:
 
This is one of the daftest stories ive seen in ages.

Quite frankly theres a whiff of anglophobia behind this silly proposal but so be it...

i woudl guess that sense will prevail
 
Originally posted by clivex@Oct 25 2006, 11:21 AM
This is one of the daftest stories ive seen in ages.

Quite frankly theres a whiff of anglophobia behind this silly proposal but so be it...

i woudl guess that sense will prevail
Obviously you are in full command of the facts Clivex having read a special briefing in The Sun.
 
The county council has begun removing road signs bearing the word Dingle and replacing them with the new name

Thats the fact

perhaps if you could think you may wonder what drives such a pointless and self defeating action
 
Dingle is in a Gaeltacht (Irish Speaking) area. I'm not sure what they are, but there are economic benefits to living in these areas, in return the residents are obliged to preserve the Irish language. It is therefore not unreasonable to expect the place names in the area to be in Irish.

Dingle, however, is a fairly powerful brand name in the tourist industry, so it is not wholly unreasonable for the residents in the area to want it changed back.
 
I think we may be dealing with a Cromwellite, lads. Luke - sharpen the pikes, and I'll set the heather blazing.

Mel - you can be the informer.
 
Originally posted by clivex@Oct 25 2006, 02:38 PM
The county council has begun removing road signs bearing the word Dingle and replacing them with the new name

Thats the fact

perhaps if you could think you may wonder what drives such a pointless and self defeating action
Well, Clive, seeing as we're speaking "frankly", if changing the signs would have the effect of keeping patronising types like you away from the place, I'd be all in favour.
 
'Anglophobia' and they want to put the sign in English? Perhaps if you understood English, cliveykins, you could contribute more intelligently and less ambitiously. Have you noticed any spots on your body recently? You might be coming down with Foot-in-mouth disease.
 
Luke

Let me explain this slowly once again

Setting alight newspapers on planes and the consequent response to that by fellow passnegrs and the authorities has everything to do with 9/11

Is that difficult to understand?
 
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