Hennessy

I don't really think that he will. Cooldine is potential, Denman is great, but Kauto Star is exceptional.
 
Bar the Bull said:
Can't believe I am the first to say this.

What did he beat?

A load of old handicappers.
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Barber's Shop is considered a Grade 1 horse and couldn't lose this of his mark... yet he was flattened. This is without doubt one of the great weight carrying performances anyone alive has seen.
 
betsmate said:
I don't really think that he will. Cooldine is potential, Denman is great, but Kauto Star is exceptional.
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If Denman is in this form (and I think he'll improve again) Kauto doesn't have a prayer against him in the Gold Cup. Kauto may be close to unbeatable in the KG, but Cheltenham (and Newbury) is Denman's course. In this form he would have beaten Kauto last time as he did the time before. There is no reply that Kauto will be able to muster in answer to this true force of nature.
 
Kauto Star and Denman are both truly 180+ chasers and there is very little between them. I couldn't call it. Kauto Star's second Gold Cup surely put to bed any theory about him lacking the stamina on a softer than good Gold Cup.

As good as Denman was yesterday, it's no more than confirmation that he's still capable of what he used to be. I'd be interested to know why you think he will improve from that Steve given you say Newbury is his absolute ideal track and that everyone is telling me Denman is just the type of horse that would excel in handicaps. The way he ran to the line suggests to me there is abolutely no way Nicholls can get him any fitter.
 
Nicholls left a little to work on DJ, Denman was still carrying some condition. I think he will undoubtedly improve on that.
 
SteveM said:
What A Friend will be winning plenty, don't worry about that. And his form to date isn't too shabby.
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We shall see. I certainly wouldn't trust him sticking his head in front when it matters in a battle myself.

Barber's Shop clearly didn't get home.

That said, form looks solid enough.
 
Shadow Leader said:
Nicholls left a little to work on DJ, Denman was still carrying some condition. I think he will undoubtedly improve on that.
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Okay, I'll accept then that he wasn't completely 100% fit, but in form terms I don't think it's possible for him to improve on that run. In either the Lexus (off levels) or the AON (smallish penalty) the way that the races are run won't really allow him to put up such a big effort.
 
My first visit to Newbury since Rooster Booster was pipped in the Tote Gold Trophy. It was just fabulous to be there.

Big Buck's whet the appetite with a fine win. I almost didn't recognise him - no dossing or messing Ruby about. He's a gorgeous horse.

Denman...what can I say that hasn't already been said? He was superb, and it's fantastic to have him back. He really got his act together in the latter part of the race; just stepped up the tempo and had the others quickly in trouble.

I agree with Trackside, What A Friend clearly has bundles of talent, but I didn't like the way his head went up when Thomas got after him.
 
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davidjohnson said:
Kauto Star's second Gold Cup surely put to bed any theory about him lacking the stamina on a softer than good Gold Cup.
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But that Gold Cup didn't have Denman cutting them up front. Next year will be different and Kauto will have to pass a far harder exam.

I'd actually be opposing Kauto even without The Tank in the race because of all the miles he has on the clock. The King George will be his last hurrah.
 
Katharine said:
I agree with Trackside, What A Friend clearly has bundles of talent, but I didn't like the way his head went up when Thomas got after him.
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the horse probably didnt like the way thomas "got after him". :lol:

Hobbs ran a young and promising horse called Dream Alliance (as we all know) against denman two years ago, and the horse was never the same after. really hope that will not happen to what a friend. the welsh national is a gruelling race, esp. for a young horse.
 
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davidjohnson said:
Kauto Star and Denman are both truly 180+ chasers and there is very little between them. I couldn't call it. Kauto Star's second Gold Cup surely put to bed any theory about him lacking the stamina on a softer than good Gold Cup.

As good as Denman was yesterday, it's no more than confirmation that he's still capable of what he used to be. I'd be interested to know why you think he will improve from that Steve given you say Newbury is his absolute ideal track and that everyone is telling me Denman is just the type of horse that would excel in handicaps. The way he ran to the line suggests to me there is abolutely no way Nicholls can get him any fitter.
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Conditions were certainly in his favour, but he looked a little ring-rusty to me and was only starting to show his full exuberance in the second half of the race. This is only a platform from which he will develop in fitness and confidence (remember he's bounced back from the only fall in his career the time before). I can't wait to see him next time out off level weights. I believe we'll see something extraordinary (not that the Hennessy was anything less than extraordinary).
 
SteveM said:
I can't wait to see him next time out off level weights. I believe we'll see something extraordinary (not that the Hennessy was anything less than extraordinary).
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Neither can I. We might see he can't beat speed horses at levels.:)

I suppose the main difference bewteen him and the likes of Roman Warrior is that there might be a big difference between the latter not improving for carrying less, whereas Denman will probably carry the same weight as he would in a handicap.

It could also be that the types Denman beats giving weight are strong types that don't improve for weight coming off.
 
Desert Orchid said:
Neither can I. We might see he can't beat speed horses at levels.:)

...It could also be that the types Denman beats giving weight are strong types that don't improve for weight coming off.
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...and it could just be that this is the best animal you'll see under heaven should you live another fifty years, whether you know it or not.:)
 
Euronymous said:
Timeform give Denman 181.
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Must be about right... a little short of his Gold Cup winning performance. It seems likely that he'll hit above 180, if called to do so, for the rest of this season (another two or three races I guess).
 
It always surprises me that timeform tend to go conservative with the top performances and liberal with lower rankings.
 
It's a shitehouse of a rating when you consider how they marked Best Mate. Denman would have gutted him like a fish.
 
Steve - Timeform rated him 180p in the annual the year he won the Gold Cup. Some may question the need for a 'p' with such a rating, but it was left on with connections on about running him in the following season's Hennessy off 180.
 
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