Kauto Star

Would kauto star have won?

  • Yes

    Votes: 21 46.7%

  • No

    Votes: 24 53.3%
  • Total voters
    45
Even if he had of won it would have been unimpressive and one of his worst runs for some time. Makes the King George that bit more intriguing.
 
I'm not voting as it's such a 'what if'. He was under a lot of pressure already but although he looked beaten, he has the class to perhaps have got up on the run in.

I think Nicholls' yard might be showing the pressures of too fast an expansion.
I think it's very hard for a trainer to concentrate on that many horses.
Alan King too is very in and out. Each yard has almost 200, don't they?
 
The weather down in the West Country has been very bad too and that might be affecting the yards - lots of runny noses. Newmarket horses running OK as it's been relatively dry up here

Peter Bowen's and Evan Williams' are running OK though and Wales is always wet LOL
 
Headstrong said:
The weather down in the West Country has been very bad too and that might be affecting the yards - lots of runny noses. Newmarket horses running OK as it's been relatively dry up here

Peter Bowen's and Evan Williams' are running OK though and Wales is always wet LOL
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You what, I live in the heart of the west country and we aint had cold or wet weather really, its been pretty good to be honest, plus I have been to 5 yards around my area of late and none have had runny noses, where have you got these wonderful facts from Sara, I'm intruiged, people don't seem to realise Nicholls' horses are overbet and over hyped, they aint all stars and the majority have run as expected.
 
Headstrong said:
I'm not voting as it's such a 'what if'. He was under a lot of pressure already but although he looked beaten, he has the class to perhaps have got up on the run in.

I think Nicholls' yard might be showing the pressures of too fast an expansion.

Ain't stopped him in the past and any yard with alot of runners will not have hundreds of winners, you can't win everything.

I think it's very hard for a trainer to concentrate on that many horses.

Thats why Paul has two head lads and two assistants and alot of competent staff, he spends alot more time with his horses than alot of trainers and has a huge attention to detail.

Alan King too is very in and out. Each yard has almost 200, don't they

Nicholls has 140 tops, probably nearer 130. Some rotate to him and Richard barber, but they have about 35 lads there, riding no more than 3 - 4 lots.
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!
 
I'm in Gloucestershire so not quite the West Country but we've not had much rain or cold weather either - I've hardly been putting my heating on and believe me I always feel the cold!
 
Read Isinglass's remarks on another thread! - and from what I've heard from a lot of friends in the West of the country it has been damp and muggy over there (certainly compared with over here in the East) - and I certainly found it so last weekend, even as far to the cetnre as Oxon and Berks! And I do watch weather reports etc... Warm muggy weather is just what horses don;t need

As for Nicholls, I made it clear I was speculating, but there is no doubt in my mind - nor that of many others - that, notwithstanding Nicholls' horses are usually overbet, they have been having a pretty poor run for the last month with only 4/5 or so winners from c38 runners, some of them which you would expect to win (I don't have the figs following today).

You would expect that kind of strike rate in a yard with a lot of 'also rans' but not from a yard which can pick and choose its horses - and it's well below his usual % so I dont; think it's just that he has poorer horses this season!
 
Anyone care to guess how much, on average, the "Nicholls factor" shortens his runner's price's by?
 
3rd in Gold Cup.

I agree Denman will win if back on song, but I still think Kauto is the second best 3m chaser around, I still however feel I would like to see him retired, before he takes one fall too many or starts to get beaten in races he would at his best win, like fptp says he owes connections nothing and whilst not an old horse it certainly should be asked whether he has peaked or not.
 
Flame said:
3rd in Gold Cup.

I agree Denman will win if back on song, but I still think Kauto is the second best 3m chaser around, I still however feel I would like to see him retired, before he takes one fall too many or starts to get beaten in races he would at his best win, like fptp says he owes connections nothing and whilst not an old horse it certainly should be asked whether he has peaked or not.
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I would hate to see him getting beat by horses that wouldn't even see him on the first circuit let alone beat him in his prime actually beating him then P Nicholls and Co should be ashamed of them selfs if that ever happened.
 
6-4 looks a massive price for the race thats perfect for him the only danger is tidal bay i could see another victory of 5 lengths over Christmas .
 
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I don't think he would have won if he had stood up: after hitting the fence his stride shortened dramatically and I don't think he would have got there. Also thought Thomas should have sorted his reins out and got hold of him before the second last. There seemed to be a lot of 'flapping' going on. KS looked a little stiff from what I could see after but hopefully he will be fine.
 
Lets not be too quick to write off Kauto Star. He has been a bit flat on his last three runs but if he is o.k after todays run he will take some beating at Kempton and I would be very tempted to take the 6/4.
 
G-G said:
Thomas should have sorted his reins out and got hold of him before the second last. T
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He had a good hold of him here......

kauto_fall_haydock_c4.jpg
 
I'm with g-g, I thought although he was travelling like the winner, his jump at the second last was him shouting "i'm not liking this", and even if he had of won I'm not convinced it would have been by a wide margin.

I wouldn't want to be lumping on at 6/4 for the KG either, as from what I saw today he couldn't break out of fourth gear. If Denman is still 5/4 when he comes back in Febuary i'd think that would be a much better "banker" for the GC!

This was the first year I decided it would be "perverse" to leave Kauto out of my tentofollow aswell, as i'm usually a left of centre thinker who likes to do the opposite to everyone else!
 
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Wasn't keen on the way they let Tamarinbleu have such an easy lead - nor ST's tactics up the straight, the left, right, left attitude he took to approaching fences.

Still it's likely to be one less competitor for him when he sits on Denman in March.
 
Crikey, you don't half read some bollocks on these forums.

Kauto Star was put on the ground by Thomas riding like a tosser.
 
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