New Approach

Originally posted by Euronymous+Apr 21 2008, 05:46 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Euronymous @ Apr 21 2008, 05:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Headstrong@Apr 21 2008, 06:43 PM


Ramonti won four Group 1s last year. You are hard to please!
Or maybe like so many you just get an idea in your head then have to keep trying to prove it
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He was lucky in at least two of them and really again could a figure even approaching 130 be given for him. Very few people thought a mere filly could have bested him in the Moulin - but Darjina (not very far in front of FB on two occasions) certainly did. [/b][/quote]
How was Ramonti 'lucky'? This horse far from receives the respect his performances deserved. Has similar traits to Giants Causeway, imo. Some people seem to think a horse who wins from the front and by a small margin lacks talent; not the case with Ramonti.
 
I don't think GW was fit enough to get going sooner. Excellent art had 2 opportunites with no excuses to beat Ramonti and took neither.

I think even if either got closer Ramonti would have had pulled out more. Again, that's just my opinion.
 
Originally posted by Headstrong@Apr 21 2008, 06:43 PM
Ramonti won four Group 1s last year. You are hard to please!
Or maybe like so many you just get an idea in your head then have to keep trying to prove it
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More to do with blindly following and supporting a horse simply because it's won said person a lot of cash in the past.

We're all guilty of it.
 
Originally posted by Galileo@Apr 21 2008, 01:03 PM
Perhaps his temperment will not be suited to the day. They possibly hoped he would relax a little from 2 to 3 and that might not be the case. If he didnt relax the day of Epsom his chances would be blown.
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That's what came to my mind as well. The other thing that immediately jumped out at me was that Bolger stated that they would go back to "his other way of racing" (which would be making the running). This suggests to me that Bolger is not convinced that he has learned to settle or that it might not see him to best effect; of course if that is the case, he would have no chance of getting a mile and a half.

I remain far from convinced that the horse has trained on.

Apparently Bolger intends trying Finsceal Beo over a mile and a half at some point as well. :what:
 
The reason for the drift on Betfair for the Derby is now apparent. Evidently, Bolger didn't quite manage to stop all his employees using the exchanges.
 
Jim Bolger always has been and always will be his own man.There is no way Sheikh Mo or any of his advisers told him to swerve Epsom.For me it is the correct decision -Epsom is a balls of a track and in this day and age there are plenty of races with more prestige then the Derby.
 
Seeing as we're discussing Mr Bolgers racing plans. I felt last year that his decision not to run Creachadoir in the Newmarket 2000 was a very curious decision.The horse had a good prep and needs fast ground. Instead he decided to keep him for the Irish version......and what pray for no rain !! If I had been involved in a syndicate that was in that horse I'd be pissed. I believe many of the horses that race in his own colours are part owned by syndicates I'm sure someone on here can advise me as to whether that is correct or not.

Surprised to see people question the quality of last years Winner Cockney rebel, he came from nearly last to first and ran a very fast time. The form stood up in the Irish Guineas and than he nearly won with a broken pelvis shrug::
 
The inference I'd draw from this mysterious decision is that the horse hasn't been showing as much as they'd liked so far this year, and they're giving themselves a bit more time to see if he comes to himself.

This could be due to the lousy weather so far this spring, or to the horse not having trained on, either because he was more of a "made" 2-y-o than we assumed, or because his last race has left its mark on him.
 
Or on the other hand, maybe he's shown so much that they don't want to bother with the hype of the Derby, the weird track, and possibility of injury; so intend to go for equally lucrative and prestigious races which will enhance his stud value more - as Bolger has said.

From what I've been told that's the more likely scenario. The Derby is after all something of a lottery. If you are confident you have the best of the classic generation, maybe you don't need that race to prove it? I'd rather he went too, make no mistake, but in some ways I understand it if he doesn;t

Sheikh thank goodness someone from over the water is sticking up for Cockney Rebel!
I'm entirely of your opinion :D
 
Originally posted by Headstrong@Apr 21 2008, 11:54 PM
intend to go for equally lucrative and prestigious races which will enhance his stud value more - as Bolger has said.

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Irish 2000 Guineas???
 
If he gets placed in newmarket and wins at the Curragh it's hello sweet blue blooded flat mares. if he gets placed at newmarket and wins the Derby he's another stayer and he'll be shacked up with those rough national Hunt types :P
 
The hype of the Derby?

Jesus.

Can someone tell me what other more prestigious races there are that New Approach only has one shot at?

If you are confident you have the best of the classic generation, maybe you don't need that race to prove it?
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Sure **** it, just send him to stud now! You'd be first in the line with a pitchfork...
 
[Sigh] It's a very long season Euro. Maybe they don't want to step him up so early? Maybe they want to concentrate on getting Group 1s at a mile or 1.2 rather than 1.5? who knows? They can aim at the Arc later after all...

The point Bolger made, and it's a good one, is that the Derby is no longer for all its prestige and mystique what drives eventual stud values. And that's the game these people are in, for better or worse
 
The point Bolger made, and it's a good one, is that the Derby is no longer for all its prestige and mystique what drives eventual stud values. And that's the game these people are in, for better or worse
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Try asking one of "these people", namely John Magnier, what single race he most wants to win every year.
 
Originally posted by Headstrong@Apr 22 2008, 12:00 AM
[Sigh] It's a very long season Euro. Maybe they don't want to step him up so early? Maybe they want to concentrate on getting Group 1s at a mile or 1.2 rather than 1.5? who knows? They can aim at the Arc later after all...
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And maybe the guy hasn`t got a freakin clue about planning a proper horses campaign.

I wonder what programme he`d have if Ballydoyle had him



sigh
 
I`m still trying to work out why he`s shortened in the betting for the 2000. I`d be worried if i was an ante-post backer for sure.
 
If your suggesting that Mr Magnier and Coolmore prioritise the Derby over races run over shorter distances than I'd have to say I think your well off the mark.How long does a Derby winner spend at stud before he's shunted off to cover NH mares that's if he even gets a chance. Check the records.
 
If your suggesting that Mr Magnier and Coolmore prioritise the Derby over races run over shorter distances than I'd have to say I think your well off the mark.
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I quite clearly suggested that, given the choice, John Magnier would rather win the Derby over any other race. When he's stood in the winner's circle at Epsom saying things like "this little piece of grass here is where everyone wants to be", or when he's running 20+ horses in the race over 5 years having already won it the previous 2 years running, it's a bit of a giveaway.

The pattern is obvious. They try and win the Derby. Then they try and win the Irish Derby. Then they worry about 10f.
 
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