Orfevre

Thanks. She is some filly to achieve what she has this year and then beat older horses and colts at the end of the season. Really confirms her and Orfevre's superiority with them pulling away so far from the rest and I believe they both stay in training and will be aimed at the Arc next year, very exciting with those two and Gold Ship potentially coming over. Don't think there will be any 10/1 any Japanese Arc winner next season!

What a sensational race as well, probably one of the best finishes of the flat season for me. I thought I'd get lobbed out in the stewards enquiry knowing my luck this Autumn but hopefully it's turned!

We've now all got Hong Kong to look forward to in 2 weeks before Meydan. See, we can get through this jumps bollocks slowly but surely!
 
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Worth mentioning another Japanese colt in Gold Ship who could progress in Japan towards a tilt at the Arc.

Stunning looking horse too:

GoldShip1Japanese2KGuineas2012KH298.jpg

This beauty runs at 6.25am our time in the Arima Kinen in Nakayama. 7/4 fav having been 3s. Sky Dignity is worth an EW bet at 20s with Race Bets though, Soumillon rides and has good three year old form out there.

7/4 Fav and Race Bets in Germany have him in at 20s for the Arc. It'll be like Pearl Harbor at Longchamp next October!
 
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Gold Ship gags up very impressively.

Presume the Arc is the aim but not heard anything yet.
 
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Got to do something to keep warm in the Winter EC other than these watching plodders jumping over things mucking up the ground at our finest racecourses!
 
the question with this grey is who will ride?
he looks to have similar ability to Orfevre and looks an easier horse to handle
both look better horses than the european that stay in training
 
the question with this grey is who will ride?
he looks to have similar ability to Orfevre and looks an easier horse to handle
both look better horses than the european that stay in training

Why wouldn't Uchida keep the ride? He's done nothing wrong.

Agree about Europeans, we'll need a decent 3yo to stop a Japanese domination as things stand.
 
Gold Ship has looked a very good horse the whole year, the form is slighlty worse than Orfevres but the jockey looks like most japanesse riders a fireman rather than a jockey
I would prefer A. Nicholls or H. Tarner ratehr than this one for the Arc,
the horse has been giving metres in the bends in all his races.

At this moment he looks the most likely winner of next years Arc.
 
looked a good win has the leg action of a horse who may not desire soft ground. european jockey i think would help espeially if the race becamne a tactical affair a pacemaker would be very helpful
 
There is no way they could ride him like that and win the Arc. I wasn't that blown away by that.... Looked a poor field.
 
Poor field ?

in an Arima Kinen you would have a better field than in most Arcs and almost any gr1 in europe

this was top class form
 
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Indeed, the race probably wasn't as strong as last year but this years renewal looks decent with the RP rating the winner 128. The 2nd is an improving sort and the 3rd and 4th are very good markers with their previous runs behind Orfevre and in the Japan Cup.

Don't see the tactics a problem at Longchamp, they rode Zarkava like that. If you're good enough, you win the Arc. It's not very often that the best horse doesn't win regardless of tactics.
 
As likeable as Gold Ship is, I think some people here are getting overexcited about him. First of all, Rulership should have won this year's Arima if it wasn't for his poor start. He might be an interesting horse for the Sheema Classic if connections decide to follow that route and he sorts out his problems at the gates.
The form of the second (Ocean Blue) is nothing special ( a win in a weak G2 is his best performance in 13 previous starts).
Regarding tactics, Gold Ship shows a tendency to be slow at the gates and takes some time to gear up in his races. His rider is always gonna have a problem finding a gap in big fields.
Suny, re watch the 2000gns. That saving ground ride was crutial in the horse winning that race.
With that pedigree, GS is open to further improvement as an older horse, but in my book, he is gonna need to do so to reach the level of form of Orfevre and Gentildonna by at least 4 o 5 pounds plus wfa.
 
As likeable as Gold Ship is, I think some people here are getting overexcited about him. First of all, Rulership should have won this year's Arima if it wasn't for his poor start. He might be an interesting horse for the Sheema Classic if connections decide to follow that route and he sorts out his problems at the gates.
The form of the second (Ocean Blue) is nothing special ( a win in a weak G2 is his best performance in 13 previous starts).
Regarding tactics, Gold Ship shows a tendency to be slow at the gates and takes some time to gear up in his races. His rider is always gonna have a problem finding a gap in big fields.
Suny, re watch the 2000gns. That saving ground ride was crutial in the horse winning that race.
With that pedigree, GS is open to further improvement as an older horse, but in my book, he is gonna need to do so to reach the level of form of Orfevre and Gentildonna by at least 4 o 5 pounds plus wfa.

I don't buy that Rulership would have won, Gold Ship missed the break too and he absolutely dotted up with plenty in the tank and he was clearly superior to his rivals.

Ocean Blue has been progressive this year to be fair, a few judges put him up pre-race and he doesn't hold the form down for me.

On a line through Fenomeno, Gold Ship isn't far behind Gentildonna and Orfevre at all and Orfevre looks to have peaked for me. I've had small bets on both 3yos for next years Arc.

Fascinating and refreshing that the best middle distance horses aren't trained in Europe at the moment anyway (after Cirrus).
 
On a line through Fenomeno, Gold Ship isn't far behind Gentildonna and Orfevre at all

Could you elaborate on how you reach that conclusion?
We are gonna have to disagree about this year's Arima start Gamla.
 
Could you elaborate on how you reach that conclusion?
We are gonna have to disagree about this year's Arima start Gamla.

Fenomeno only 1/2 length behind Eishin Flash in the Tenno Sho and finished infront of Rulership in the same race before running fifth in the Japan Cup only 2.5 lengths behind Rulership that time (Eishin Flash 9th (6.75L). Gold Ship is 1.75L ahead of Rulership in the Arima Kinen with Eishin Flash a further 1.5L back and I'd argue he was value for a lot more given the extra ground he covered and how easily he won.
 
Ok Gamla. I disagree with you as I don't rate GS as highly as you do, but good luck with your bets for next year's Arc.
 
Racing Post rate Gold Ship 128 making him the best three year old in the world in 2012.

Gold Ship sails to top of three-year-old rankings

BY SAM WALKER 11:56AM 28 DEC 2012

WORLD CLASS: an analysis of the international scene according to Racing Post Ratings

CHRISTMAS is a time for redemption. Whatever went before can be resolved with a rich gesture, kindly act or even a prize turkey.

In Flat racing the Arima Kinen traditionally plays the festive last chance saloon, offering one last shot at recognition, one last chance to tie-up loose form lines and one final opportunity to set the record straight.

This year the redemption came right on cue - only in 2012 it was the prize turkeys of the Classic generation who needed their wrongs righting.

For 12 months the three-year-olds of the world were a disappointment; against the older generation successes were rare. Their collective in-running comment might have read: slowly away, always in rear.

But on Sunday, in the final strides of the final major race in the calendar, the three-year-olds finally came good.

Gold Ship ran the Arima Kinen as his contemporaries had contested the entire season. He too was slowly away and he too was held up in rear, a long way off the early pace.

Jockey Hiroyuki Uchida had said he would ride with confidence, but even he may have thought he'd overdone it turning into the short straight, where he could be spotted six wide in tenth, chasing his mount like a fanatical oarsman.

As they straightened up with just over a furlong to go the galloping grey started to make ground. The big race favourite was on his way and the seldom containable Japanese crowd erupted.

It was going to be tight, but they knew he was going to get there and they knew what that meant. He swept the field to a rapturous reception, reaching the front with two seconds to spare to win a shade cosily by a length-and-a-half.

Timed to perfection; a healthy blend of right result with lashings of exhilaration. There's something quite exquisite about timing the run just so.

Two seconds later and the entire crop might have been written off. Instead they welcomed a new champion and a fresh standard bearer for the 2013 campaign.

The Arima Kinen is a gateway race for the best Japanese three-year-olds. Two months after the final leg of the triple crown, it is their last chance to run against the older generation before becoming the older generation.

Orfevre won last year's race as a three-year-old before being pointed at the Arc and Deep Impact was second in the race in 2005 before he took a similar path to Longchamp.

Orferve and Deep Impact both came into the race on the back of a triple crown success and Gold Ship was a little unlucky not to have joined that pair in securing all three Classics.

He was a cosy winner of the first and last legs, but was undone by a slow pace in the Tokyo Yushun, where he stayed on from the rear for a close fifth.

He looked the best horse in the Yushun and was clearly the best in the other Classics, but this year, more than most, it was only against the older horses that true worth could be established.

Frankel's generation were winning everything in the open arena, leaving very little to the youngsters. Gentildonna provided a rare highlight when nosing out Orfevre to win the Japan Cup, while there was almost nothing of note amongst the sophomores in Europe.

But on Sunday, Gold Ship delivered what the three-year-olds sorely needed. He ran out a comfortable winner of an all-age championship race, marking himself as king of his generation.

An RPR of 128+ for Sunday's success makes Gold Ship the highest rated three-year-old on the planet, usurping Dullahan, Camelot and I'll Have Another who had shared top spot on a mark of 127.

It was the best performance from the best three-year-old and he is a very deserving champion. There was a championship field, a decent pace and the form stacks up nicely.

Third place Rulership finished a length and three-quarters behind the winner, giving a good line on Gentildonna and Orfevre, while Tenno Sho (Autumn) winner Eishin Flash finished fourth and championship stalwart Dark Shadow was back in sixth.

A winning rating of 128 matches the level achieved by Orfevre in last year's race and gives Japan another horse with a fantastic shot at the Arc next October.

Orfevre should have won the Arc this year but for his wayward tendencies and he will be gunning for Longchamp again in 2013, along with his Japan Cup conqueror Gentildonna. Throw in Gold Ship and it's starting to look like Japan's race to lose.

The Japanese have a long history of underachievement and near misses in Europe's flagship race, but in recent years the tide has turned in their favour.

They now provide the quality to the global middle-distance division. Orfevre almost proved it this year and next year one of these stars should get the job done.

That Arc win will come to Japan. And when it finally does it will be the beginning, not the end of the story.

TOP OF THE CLASS: Gold Ship, 128 Naosuke Sugai (Jap) (Arima Kinen, Nakayama, 1m4f110y, 23 December)
 
Racing Post rate Gold Ship 128 making him the best three year old in the world in 2012.

Gold Ship sails to top of three-year-old rankings

BY SAM WALKER 11:56AM 28 DEC 2012

WORLD CLASS: an analysis of the international scene according to Racing Post Ratings

CHRISTMAS is a time for redemption. Whatever went before can be resolved with a rich gesture, kindly act or even a prize turkey.

In Flat racing the Arima Kinen traditionally plays the festive last chance saloon, offering one last shot at recognition, one last chance to tie-up loose form lines and one final opportunity to set the record straight.

This year the redemption came right on cue - only in 2012 it was the prize turkeys of the Classic generation who needed their wrongs righting.

For 12 months the three-year-olds of the world were a disappointment; against the older generation successes were rare. Their collective in-running comment might have read: slowly away, always in rear.

But on Sunday, in the final strides of the final major race in the calendar, the three-year-olds finally came good.

Gold Ship ran the Arima Kinen as his contemporaries had contested the entire season. He too was slowly away and he too was held up in rear, a long way off the early pace.

Jockey Hiroyuki Uchida had said he would ride with confidence, but even he may have thought he'd overdone it turning into the short straight, where he could be spotted six wide in tenth, chasing his mount like a fanatical oarsman.

As they straightened up with just over a furlong to go the galloping grey started to make ground. The big race favourite was on his way and the seldom containable Japanese crowd erupted.

It was going to be tight, but they knew he was going to get there and they knew what that meant. He swept the field to a rapturous reception, reaching the front with two seconds to spare to win a shade cosily by a length-and-a-half.

Timed to perfection; a healthy blend of right result with lashings of exhilaration. There's something quite exquisite about timing the run just so.

Two seconds later and the entire crop might have been written off. Instead they welcomed a new champion and a fresh standard bearer for the 2013 campaign.

The Arima Kinen is a gateway race for the best Japanese three-year-olds. Two months after the final leg of the triple crown, it is their last chance to run against the older generation before becoming the older generation.

Orfevre won last year's race as a three-year-old before being pointed at the Arc and Deep Impact was second in the race in 2005 before he took a similar path to Longchamp.

Orferve and Deep Impact both came into the race on the back of a triple crown success and Gold Ship was a little unlucky not to have joined that pair in securing all three Classics.

He was a cosy winner of the first and last legs, but was undone by a slow pace in the Tokyo Yushun, where he stayed on from the rear for a close fifth.

He looked the best horse in the Yushun and was clearly the best in the other Classics, but this year, more than most, it was only against the older horses that true worth could be established.

Frankel's generation were winning everything in the open arena, leaving very little to the youngsters. Gentildonna provided a rare highlight when nosing out Orfevre to win the Japan Cup, while there was almost nothing of note amongst the sophomores in Europe.

But on Sunday, Gold Ship delivered what the three-year-olds sorely needed. He ran out a comfortable winner of an all-age championship race, marking himself as king of his generation.

An RPR of 128+ for Sunday's success makes Gold Ship the highest rated three-year-old on the planet, usurping Dullahan, Camelot and I'll Have Another who had shared top spot on a mark of 127.

It was the best performance from the best three-year-old and he is a very deserving champion. There was a championship field, a decent pace and the form stacks up nicely.

Third place Rulership finished a length and three-quarters behind the winner, giving a good line on Gentildonna and Orfevre, while Tenno Sho (Autumn) winner Eishin Flash finished fourth and championship stalwart Dark Shadow was back in sixth.

A winning rating of 128 matches the level achieved by Orfevre in last year's race and gives Japan another horse with a fantastic shot at the Arc next October.

Orfevre should have won the Arc this year but for his wayward tendencies and he will be gunning for Longchamp again in 2013, along with his Japan Cup conqueror Gentildonna. Throw in Gold Ship and it's starting to look like Japan's race to lose.

The Japanese have a long history of underachievement and near misses in Europe's flagship race, but in recent years the tide has turned in their favour.

They now provide the quality to the global middle-distance division. Orfevre almost proved it this year and next year one of these stars should get the job done.

That Arc win will come to Japan. And when it finally does it will be the beginning, not the end of the story.

TOP OF THE CLASS: Gold Ship, 128 Naosuke Sugai (Jap) (Arima Kinen, Nakayama, 1m4f110y, 23 December)
 
What price would you take when the odds come out in the spring?

Tricky one as we have no idea of the standard of the European three year olds at all at this stage. There isn't much from Europe currently which is going to trouble these three if they come over that's for sure. Also there's the issue of whether they'll even bring him over, it's not been mentioned yet, only assumed.

At least with Gentildonna and Orfevre, you know they are almost certainly coming over although I'd favour the former as she's more straightforward, progressive and fillies have a blinding record in the race.

I'd probably take 14 Gentildonna and 16 Gold Ship having already taken 16 Gentildonna and 20 Gold Ship with Race Bets.
 
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