Sea The Stars - Retirement Announced
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What does that say about the four champions I'm supposed to have in the yard!!
How should i put this.....its not them, its you??!!
Indeed so oh wise one... :adore
although I did have a good bet on him in the Guineas, along with Mastercraftsman).I opposed Dancing Brave in everything up to the Arc, when I got tired of the pummelling I was receiving and switched camps.
Just the St Leger
Reading between the lines of the 'fishul announcement, I suspect he's fit and healthy enough but not sparkling, therefore the decision probably wasn't a difficult one. Would Chris Tsui accept my drop-dead-gorgeous 22yo daughter as his wife? She'd only cost him a quarter-share in the horse.
1) I can forgive them that one.
and
2) Disgraceful! :lol:
Indeed so oh wise one... :adore
I opposed Dancing Brave in everything up to the Arc, when I got tired of the pummelling I was receiving and switched camps.
Shame you didn't follow your previous example !:lol:
As for STS in the Arc-
1 Kinane said it was his easiest victory ! Hardly consistent with a horse out on his feet or one likely to have beaten by lots of so so Arc winners .
2 Carson made an interesting and I understand accurate observation that when they showed the close up of STS he was looking for other horses - which suggested he was dossing
3 When Soumillon comes to congratulate KInane as they are pulling up - STS takes off again - not really consistent with a knackered horse
The problem seems to be this - F & G was beaten by horses that some massive fans of his think should never have been able to beat him and that STS did not zoom clear and win by ten lengths . This fallacy that a horse is not an all time great unless he goes miles clear was being repeated by Randall in the RP .
No they don't - the ones that obsess ratings junkies do but STS never did - he always did enough and has never been truly extended .
Consider the example of MCM- beaten one length at York- five at the Curragh when another horse was able to push STS a bit harder. Conduit left for dead at Sandown much closer here as there was nothing even capable of giving STS a real race in the Arc .
The fact is that STS's style of racing ,and his perfect temperament made him capable of achieving successes that all the greats cannot match - in six consecutive G 1 races .
G-G
Senior Jockey
Maybe you do - but what do you mean by 'everything was against him except the ground?' What was against him?
:lol:
I actually think suny has a fair point however. STS has done brilliantly well to win the races he has and Oxx perhaps has been even more brilliant to eke out his resource. Kinane thought he was about to go over the top and his coat is beginning to go. They did right to stop here. That’s not to say he wouldn’t have won the Classic, but I doubt he would have been at his best. He won the Arc well, but there have been better absolute performances even in recent years.
I don't doubt that there have been - for example, Sea the Stars had nothing in opposition to help him get a high rating, when you consider his propensity to win by short margins means he needs another horse, or horses, to help him get that higher rating.
However, to claim Dalakhani's Arc (this isn't a go at Dalakhani BM!) is superior is just plain wrong, imho.
However, to claim Dalakhani's Arc (this isn't a go at Dalakhani BM!) is superior is just plain wrong, imho.
I agree with the decision and he might well be about to go over the top . STS might well have pulled it off over the top or not but why bother. I think the change of climate when he was beginning to go in his coat would have been unwise after such a long season .
As for the Arc - I don't see better performances for the reason already expounded- there was nothing to push him .
Good post Ardross, though I'd hate to be you the next time a strong fancy of yours is beaten by one of Mr Miller's!
Likening this to a "good decision" is like a cricket fan being "happy" with Peterson retiring after a brilliant ashes hundred or a football supporter being "pleased" with Rooney packing it in after a hat trick against Brazil.
Im not sure about either breeding though...
Maybe all a bit harsh and cant blame connections (i mean Tsui really needs the money doesnt he?) but we are too accustomed to all of this and to see STS take on another generation would have been great sport if not great business
Its the problem with flat racing...
I still find it a bit sad. Almost like the thought by some no doubt that hes "not going to get a higher rating so why race him?"
Im not sure about either breeding though...
Maybe all a bit harsh and cant blame connections (i mean Tsui really needs the money doesnt he?) but we are too accustomed to all of this and to see STS take on another generation would have been great sport if not great business
Its the problem with flat racing...
I still find it a bit sad. Almost like the thought by some no doubt that hes "not going to get a higher rating so why race him?"
Harbinger
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I think ratings have lots of relevance for horses at the top end of racing, but that Sea The Stars had that checkbox ticked in the first week of July.
Ballydoyle more than anyone helped to make STS's reputation. They provided the main opposition to him and ensured that each of his races was a true test.
What will they do with Fame, Rip and Mastercraftsman? Might they keep them in training in the hope of showing they were good enough to collect more than one Gr1 each in a normal year?
Fame will certainly stay in training, Rip possibly but I am pretty sure MCM will be retired.
Harbinger
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True, and whilst it shouldn't affect a rating, achievement absolutely has to be taken into account when it comes to assessing a horse's place in history (despite what John Randall thinks). Sea The Stars has nothing to worry about on either front.
If he wins the Classic I would think he will retire straight away - even if he does not he has every right to retire as a serious stallion prospect.
I would be interesting to know what Coolmore is thinking - leave STS pretty much unchallenged in his first season (in the belief there is no real point taking him on) keeping the likes of F&G and RIP for next season when the buzz has died down a bit or taking him on head on with MCM and RIP in the breeding shed.
My point is that with soundness an ever increasing topic in the suitability of a horse to stand as a stallion, that shouldn't be discarded or diminished because a horse has won certain races.
He has had too many little injuries, and it would be nice to see him prove he can stay sound for a longer period of time than he has done so far.
Coolmore would be wasting their time taking on STS in the breeding shed with 5 RVWs and 5 MCMs; better off to wait a year.
He has had too many little injuries, and it would be nice to see him prove he can stay sound for a longer period of time than he has done so far.
Coolmore would be wasting their time taking on STS in the breeding shed with 5 RVWs and 5 MCMs; better off to wait a year.