Telling It As It Is.

SlimChance said:
I hate machines and I hate problem gambling but it's not my fight. It's not for punters to worry how bookmaker make their money.
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I agree

And its not for "weknowwhatsbestforyou" tossers stick their fcking noses in

None so patronising towards the (supposedly) poor as those that pretend to "care" about them
 
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clivex said:
There is a touch of "we know whats best for you" in the opposition to these machines. I don't like them and would rather they didnt exist but its naturally reflexive to push back against the likes of Harriet Harman with her inarticulate patronising bleating

Im also not so convinced that there are any more lice covered kids surviving on Pedigree chum and sleeping in wheelie bins than at any time in the past

Nutter gamblers (who always have struck me as either self pitying wrist slashers or basically plankheads) have always existed and always will
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Spot on
 
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Grey said:
It is self evident from the growing number of betting shops in parts of the UK that the FOBTs are drawing in more people than the traditional forms of gambling. It is also well known from New South Wales and elsewhere that FOBTs are more addictive than other forms of betting.

The argument offered by Slim, Grassy and others that if FOBTs were restricted the people doing their brains on them would find some other way of losing their money is disingenuous and is based in any case on assumption rather than fact.

These machines weren't always banned in Ireland, by the way. In the 1980s they were the mainstay of the amusement arcades that were proliferating in Irish town centres in the way that betting shops are now spreading in the UK. However, when it became apparent in the 1980s that the social consequences were unacceptable every local authority in Ireland - bar one, Bundoran Urban District Council, I think - decided to ban them.
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That is not my argument at all, Art.

My argument is I don't give a fu*ck what happens to them either way.
 
Clivex, as you use the word "maybe", it's safe to assume you know nothing about the Socio-Economic range that the majority of these FOBT players fall within and the means available to them, as recorded by recognised studies, perhaps you should go off and educate yourself, before spouting drivel and posting inaccurate guesses.

As to your remarks regarding people being patronising, can you please identify those that you know to be so on this thread, you can't, because you know sweet F.A. about the morals of anyone on an anonymous forum, that you have never met. A lot can be gleaned as to the type of person you are though, even through your anonimity, as long as I'm alright Jack, f*ck everyone else. Thank f*ck you're a minority in this world.
 
Clivex, as you use the word "maybe", it's safe to assume you know nothing about the Socio-Economic range that the majority of these FOBT players fall within
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So because of that range they are problem gamblers then?

As i said..

These machines take cash only dont they?

Whats worse, someone losing it on their credit cards online or someone just using their cash?


So why not the same fuss about online gambling ?
 
I've never forgotten the days when, as a student, I summer-worked as a board marker for a Tote shop opposite John Brown's in Clydebank. I'd been working there for about six weeks and knew a lot of the guys who were 20p-50p punters. Sticking £1 on was quite a big bet for some of them - even a 10p yankee was unusual - and fiver bets were very rare.

On Fair Friday, the start of the summer fortnight holiday, the yards closed at lunchtime and our place was heaving, most of the guys having stopped at one of the locals en route and getting quite tanked up, and I can tell you there were dozens of '£20w fav' bets flying across the counter. I know because they drafted me in there to help cope with the demand.

Some of those guys left the shop with nothing left of their holiday pay and they were due to go away with the family the next morning.

Since then, I have never been able to support anything that encourages people to lose control of themselves.

I consider myself extremely fortunate that I do not have an addictive nature but I know people who do have it and it really can make life a misery for the people around them.

I do not believe a laisser-faire attitude in this respect is helpful to anyone.
 
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Clive, you can top up at the counter with a credit/debit card.

Slim, you can't bet at all now, they won't take a bet in a shop, anyone with an active online account, is a long term loser, winners closed instantly.
 
Gambler said:
Clive, you can top up at the counter with a credit/debit card.

Slim, you can't bet at all now, they won't take a bet in a shop, anyone with an active online account, is a long term loser, winners closed instantly.
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Please don't lecture others when you're making factually incorrect statements yourself. Winning accounts are most certainly not closed instantly.
 
Gambler said:
Clive, you can top up at the counter with a credit/debit card.

Slim, you can't bet at all now, they won't take a bet in a shop, anyone with an active online account, is a long term loser, winners closed instantly.
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Name me a bet you want to get on? If it's worth my while, I'll get you and me on.
 
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Ive had plenty of accounts ,closed most famously by VC after thirty years. But I still get serious dough on at Hills , Ladbrokes, Corals and of course the best, Betfair. Spread it around
 
Slim, you need to have a look at other racing forums, rather than being stuck in a bubble, have a look at the Betfair forum to start with, multiple daily posts on there about account closures, out of respect for this forum and it's owners/administrators, I will not post links to the hundreds of examples I could give of said account closures on multiple other racing forums.
 
SlimChance said:
Name me a bet you want to get on? If it's worth my while, I'll get you and me on.
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Again read my posts, I don't need you to get me on, as the whole point I'm making is that due to us not having FOBT's here in Ireland, we can still get on in a shop, obviously to within reason, why will Paddy Power here in Dublin take a grand bet off me no problem regardless of the shop and them knowing me, yet won't take 25 e/w over the counter in the UK, it's simply because of FOBT's, the whole premise of what this thread is supposed to be about.
 
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Gambler said:
Slim, you need to have a look at other racing forums, rather than being stuck in a bubble, have a look at the Betfair forum to start with, multiple daily posts on there about account closures, out of respect for this forum and it's owners/administrators, I will not post links to the hundreds of examples I could give of said account closures on multiple other racing forums.
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You read the Betfair forum? Oh lord Jesus cop yourself on.
 
Gambler said:
Again read my posts, I don't need you to get me on, as the whole point I'm making is that due to us not having FOBT's here in Ireland, we can still get on in a shop, obviously to within reason, why will Paddy Power here in Dublin take a grand bet off me no problem regardless of the shop and them knowing me, yet won't take 25 e/w over the counter in the UK, it's simply because of FOBT's, the whole premise of what this thread is supposed to be about.
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IThere is a very good reason but I doubt you're clever enough to witk it out. It's got NOTHING to do with FOBTs. Christ like how naive are you?
 
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For the betting shops to lure their punters in to signing these petitions, as a kind of subtle 'you're a hypocrite if you don't' gesture, is lower than a snakes belly.

I've heard this one turned into some sort of crusade against Cameron, worth remembering though that he is only reacting from pressure from his opposite... The Hon Ed Milliband.

Too many machines in too many shops in too many places that don't need casino's on every corner. As true as it gets...

No doubt those in lovely rural areas came out in force to sign this, along with a few chattering class types, but go down to Hackney or one of these places and I reckon there won't be as many signatures!

A few shops close...so what. Why should bokkmakers be ensured a trouble free passage where profit is absoloutely assured through creating problem gambling nationwide, where of course the NHS will pick up the tab in later years.
 
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istabraqfromneigh said:
detest these machines, and totally agree they are bad news for everyone apart from bookies. they are also being used as a vehicle to whip the bha slowly into getting a bum deal where horseracing is concerned. the real problem is that bookies are relying less and less on horses as their cash cow and they letting the bha know this in no uncertain terms.

just to go off piste... folk on here and other mediums often moan about bookies not taking decent bets anymore, so as a tenner or twenty man, how much a we talking here ? hundreds or thousands, or more that you lads are getting knocked back on ?
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I've seen clued up people get turned down for £200 singles in shops around me.
 
marble said:
For the betting shops to lure their punters in to signing these petitions, as a kind of subtle 'you're a hypocrite if you don't' gesture, is lower than a snakes belly.

I've heard this one turned into some sort of crusade against Cameron, worth remembering though that he is only reacting from pressure from his opposite... The Hon Ed Milliband.

Too many machines in too many shops in too many places that don't need casino's on every corner. As true as it gets...

No doubt those in lovely rural areas came out in force to sign this, along with a few chattering class types, but go down to Hackney or one of these places and I reckon there won't be as many signatures!

A few shops close...so what. Why should bokkmakers be ensured a trouble free passage where profit is absoloutely assured through creating problem gambling nationwide, where of course the NHS will pick up the tab in later years.
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My problem with it is the governments view appears to be "It's OK for people to ruin their financial stability with FOBT's, so long as we can take a bit more than we were last year". They kicked up a fuss in the media and then did bollock all to address it other than boosting the tax coffers.

It's not exactly a deterrent to the bookies to get rid of them, and its no detterent at all for people to stop playing them. The only people truely affected are the staff at those shops that close.
 
Gambler said:
Slim, you need to have a look at other racing forums, rather than being stuck in a bubble, have a look at the Betfair forum to start with, multiple daily posts on there about account closures, out of respect for this forum and it's owners/administrators, I will not post links to the hundreds of examples I could give of said account closures on multiple other racing forums.
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I thought your arguments were well thought through until you posted this :blink:

The Betfair forum is cesspit.
 
Why has this thread not died? What place does FOBT debate have on a horse racing and betting enthusiasts forum? It's not our fight.
 
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