That's Nice

[Bachelors Hall]

Well, not really. Quite the opposite in fact.

The 3:10 at Thurles, long odds on favourite in the maiden hurdle steadily backed throughout the day until around seven or eight minutes before the off so not a typical case the market correcting itself. In the space of those eight minutes, went from 1.16 to 1.41 at the off. Never travelled a yard and broke down between the last two. Was put down shortly afterwards.

It doesn't look good. At all. Indeed, it looks pretty horrific.

If somebody knew that the horse wasn't sound before the off then it is animal abuse.

If somebody knowingly profited from animal abuse then jail would be too good.

I hope I'm just tilting at windmills and that the drift and the sad event are a coincidence. But there NEEDS to be a full enquiry here because a horse has lost its life in highly dubious circumstances for reasons which may be unspeakably abhorrent. If there isn't one then I would feel very uncomfortable watching another Irish race.

 

[Diamond Geezer]

Stewards Enquiries today

"B.J. Geraghty, rider of Thats Nice trained by Michael Hourigan, reported to the Clerk of Scales that his mount was pulled up having sustained a serious tendon injury."


I can't believe BG would be a part of anything underhand, naive as that may be.

 

[Frankel]

Not sure I can buy in to this.

 

[Bachelors Hall]

I'd be quite content that BG wasn't in on it because he certainly looked to do his best (professionally) on the horse. I do recall how Sprinter Sacre was pulled up because he "didn't feel right" and would trust his judgement in that respect. BG rode That's Nice last time at Listowel and although the conditions were comparable, the horse travelled much better in a much more competitive race. That's Nice was no Sprinter Sacre though so if the horse was unsound beforehand, I doubt BG would have been told.

I'm not one to cry skulduggery and do accept to a degree that the sport isn't entirely straight. If you bet on horses then you pays your money and takes your choice.

Nevertheless, the significant late drift along with marked difference in the way the horse travelled is so alarming that I'm questioning whether or not something truly sickening has happened today.

As for the enquiry, it's fairly obvious that the horse had a tendon injury. I'm more interested in ascertaining when this injury was initially sustained.

 

[Aughex]

chances decreased from 86% to 70%, thats like a 2/1 drifting into 9/2.. truth be told the liquidity only starts rolling with 10-15 mins before the off so it can happen.. an investigation should be done anyway because Ire racing is being avoided more and more due to the lack of trust..

 

[Dave G]

Could the drift not be after people have seen the horses appearance in the parade ring and decided it didn't look to be race ready?

 

[Grasshopper]

Could the drift be related to the fact that there was probably only tuppence-ha'penny in the market in the first place?

 

[BennyB]

Could the drift be related to the fact that there was probably only tuppence-ha'penny in the market in the first place?

Exactly - how much actual money would have been involved in that drift? A few hundred?

Now clearly betting coups happen, and I'm in no way saying the game is 100pc straight, but I'd be quite confident nobody would fatally nobble a horse for a three figure sum.

 

[Bachelors Hall]

chances decreased from 86% to 70%, thats like a 2/1 drifting into 9/2.. truth be told the liquidity only starts rolling with 10-15 mins before the off so it can happen.. an investigation should be done anyway because Ire racing is being avoided more and more due to the lack of trust..

I would be satisfied by an investigation for peace of mind more than anything.

Could the drift not be after people have seen the horses appearance in the parade ring and decided it didn't look to be race ready?

He did have the longest break in the field but it was only 48 days so he must have looked exceptionally fat. Were that the case, why run a horse if it is that blatantly not ready? Particularly as it wasn't even his seasonal debut? How does a horse get so unfit in such a relatively small space of time?

Could the drift be related to the fact that there was probably only tuppence-ha'penny in the market in the first place?

Exactly - how much actual money would have been involved in that drift? A few hundred?

Now clearly betting coups happen, and I'm in no way saying the game is 100pc straight, but I'd be quite confident nobody would fatally nobble a horse for a three figure sum.

If the market was only a couple thousand deep then it would certainly help assuage my concerns. Is there a way of finding out exactly how much was bet on the race?

I also think that it's improbable that this was a concerted plot to risk the life of a horse for a few thousand. However, it can't be underestimated how low a person might stoop for quick money. I can't, in my mind, rule out that *somebody* knew there was something off with the horse and took advantage of the information.

 

[Colin Phillips]

Hope you are wrong on this one, BH!

 

[Frankel]

If anything like this was proven then a public flogging would be to good for them.

 

[Grasshopper]

If the market was only a couple thousand deep then it would certainly help assuage my concerns.

It's a 5-runner, mid-week, maiden hurdle from Thurles in early November, with three of the jockeys on the outers absolute unknowns (one of whom managed to get himself unseated after the winning-post).

The market would have been weaker than a mincer's handshake. I don't think there is anything sinister in this whatsoever, Kotki - it's just rank bad luck that the jolly carked it.

 

[Bachelors Hall]

Perhaps. Although it would be nicer to know the strength of the market rather than to presume same based on the race's profile. And even if there was a weak market, that wouldn't absolve a guilty party if a misdeed had occurred.

I truly hope you are right and that my misgivings are completely unwarranted.

Unfortunately, I suspect that this thread will be the last thought given to the matter and that it will pass without any official probe.

 

[Grey]

My guess is the horse had not been doing much at home in recent weeks - might the tendon issue have already been bothering the horse without it coming fully to light? - but they let him take his chance because it looks too good an opportunity to miss. The bookies price him up based on known form, but the owner and trainer tell a few people at the track they expect a win but not to be getting stuck into him, and the drift starts.

Even if Grassy and me are right, should there have been an enquiry? I've an open mind on that. Connections could give their explanations, but the real evidence needed would be from veterinary records and betting intelligence, which would not be available to the racecourse stewards on the day. Referring the matter to the Turf Club is only done at present if there are grave suspicions, but maybe it should be a more routine procedure that would not automatically be seen as tainting the people involved.

 

[Grasshopper]

Perhaps. Although it would be nicer to know the strength of the market rather than to presume same based on the race's profile. And even if there was a weak market, that wouldn't absolve a guilty party if a misdeed had occurred.

I truly hope you are right and that my misgivings are completely unwarranted.

Unfortunately, I suspect that this thread will be the last thought given to the matter and that it will pass without any official probe.

You think too much, pal.........these are not the droids you're looking for.