2000 Guineas

Just watched the Guineas again after hearing that Manning and Murtagh got whip bans. I didn’t notice it at the time but Manning’s use of the whip was pretty foul to look at. It’s the second time he has done it to this horse, did it in the Dewhurst as well, and a 5 day ban was pretty lenient in my view.

As for Henry and his distance, I don't think they will ask him to get any further unless they decide to go for the Classic at the end of the year. Reading some of the papers this morning and they confirmed the view that Henry looked as though he would come on for the run.
 
Originally posted by CFarrell@May 3 2008, 02:43 PM
Manning and Murtagh both gave each of their horses top class rides. Another stride and the result would have been reversed.
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I backed New Approach heavily (for me). Initial reaction was Manning hadn't gone hard enough to draw the sting from the O'Brien animal, and like others I thought he was getting back up. But in the cold light of day he was beaten fair and square by a horse who was delivered with his sucker punch at precisely the right time.

There is little point in saying he would have got back up in another few strides - the Guineas is run over 1m, not 1 mile and a few strides. Murtagh was brilliant, and Ballydoyle have a serious horse on their hands. I don't believe New Approach will ever beat Henry in rematches because he cannot respoond to that devastating kick.

I remember how impressive this horse was on debut, but he disappointed afterwards. The promise of the debut has finally been realised. I just worry about the 100/1 shot coming third, and whether that holds the form down a bit. Also, Jupiter Pluvius must be some machine as he was the Ballydoyle 1st string up till a few days ago!

I will launch a recovery mission on Natagora this afternoon!
 
Manning's ride on New Approach was brutal, but when you see what the risk/rewards are, it's no wonder jockeys have no qualms about breaking them.
 
As I was watching the race I thought that Sanders was being far too whip happy and thought that he would be pulled in - I know he was dragged in, was he done for it in the end?
 
He even hit the horse twice after crossing the finnish line and maybe that´s the reason why NA gave the impression of coming back on top of Henry a few yards after the post.
I very much doubt Murtagh would have made the same mistake, he knew where the post was.
 
Yes it was brutal, and unpleasant to watch - both jockeys were lifting their whips well above their shoulders and belting f*ck out of them for a long time. You can see why they feel obligated to do it with so much at stake, since they get away with it - you can be sure connections compensate them for any loss of earnings! - and until the authorities give notice they're going to clamp down hard, ie with disqualifications, it will continue
 
Unless it rains I cannot see any reason why NA , who I backed , would reverse the form with Henrythenavigator.

NA looks tailor made for the Derby - the decision to miss it , baffles me .
 
Given the improvement shown by the Ballydoyle horses for their initial and even second outing (as highlighted by Adored and Hebridian today at Gowran) there is every reason and likelihood that Henry will not only confirm the form but improve on it considerably, given a sound surface of course.
 
Watching a replay again today, if New Approach had still been in the colours he wore last year, I might have thought I was watching a replay of the 2006 Dewhurst.
 
I wonder would New Approach be better with a pacemaker over a mile. He certainly reacted when Henry came to him, maybe if he had something that he could sit half a length off and quicken away at the furlong pole? I imagine Godolphin would need to step in to help with that.

A small worry is that he could have two gruesome battles over a mile and that we may never see the best of him running at his proper distance.
 
New Approach had plenty of time to respond. Henry when past him alright with a nice turn of foot but it was hardly as quickly and as devastating as what Kings Best did to Giants Causeway.

He was simply beaten by a better horse on the day- a horse, who by paddock inspection, is likely to come on a great deal for the run.
 
The task for New Approach was to run the mile in as fast a time as he possibly could, there were no other tactics. I reckon he could have covered it a tad faster. I'm not disputing that Henry was the better horse on the day (or more fairly, at least as good) and maybe he'd have picked him off regardless. If, as you say, Henry is likely to improve more than New Approach at the Curragh then New Approach will have to run the race as a world record attempt to have any chance of reversing.
 
Originally posted by Galileo@May 6 2008, 11:28 AM
He was simply beaten by a better horse on the day- a horse, who by paddock inspection, is likely to come on a great deal for the run.
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Only a nose better mind! In 2 more strides he'd have been a nose up himself. There's nothing between the colts imo.
 
New Approach going slow up front, then quickening off a slow easy lead would not ideally suit a horse like Henry coming from way off the pace. There were no excuses…indeed there doesn’t need to be, NA ran a cracker.
 
Am I right in saying that Henry's granddam (and Listen's dam) Brigid has had 8 foals now, and every single one a filly? Did she have one last year or this year?
 
I get to answer my own question - according to Tony Morris' piece on Listen last year, after 10 covers in 11 years (8 live fillies, 1 stillborn foal, 1 barren year and 1 uncovered year) she finally had her first colt last year...
 
Originally posted by davidjohnson@May 4 2008, 09:43 PM
I might have thought I was watching a replay of the 2006 Dewhurst.
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I thought same DJ and i find it hard to figure out how, Ravens Pass can perforn like he did in Winkfeild Stakes, Solario Stakes and Craven Stakes. Then run like he did in both the Dewhurst and Guineas

If he performs like he did in the latter two, the drop in trip, easier track, is probably not going to make much difference



BTW, read your Guineas musings on TRF and tend to agree
 
According to ATR Ceefax, O'Brien is leaning towards a tilt at the derby with Henry - that will add some extra spice !
 
Originally posted by Galileo@May 6 2008, 11:35 AM
New Approach going slow up front, then quickening off a slow easy lead would not ideally suit a horse like Henry coming from way off the pace.
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I disagree with the use of the word "slow". The early pace might not have been a breakneck one but the overall time was respectable enough and certainly not consistent with the early stages being slowly-run.
 
I tend to agree that NA ran a blinder. Even if the early pace was not breakneck pace they didn't dawdle and then when he quickened it was far enough out and he had to grind it out all on his own with no company. I can't understand why Bolger, particularly considering who the owner is couldn't have stuck in a pacemaker to tow NA to the 6 or maybe even the 7 pole.
 
Irish Guineas betting with Boylesports:

New Approach 2/1
Henrythenavigator 2/1
Winker Watson 8/1
Jupiter Pluvius 10/1
Myboycharlie 10
Famous Name 12
Ibn Khaldun 12
Fast Company 12
Ravens Pass 12
Georgebernardsh 16
Rio De La Plata 16
Great Barrier R 20
Great War Eagle 25
Hanoverian Baron 25
Sammy The Snake 33
Plan 40
Bruges 40
 
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