AP McCoy

EC1 said:
He's not getting praise for that though

Its a bit like comparing drummers;)

Lester is a classy Jazz drummer to Fallons John Bonham style..Walsh is a similar comparison to McCoy...they both have strengths..one looks more stylish than the other.

Neither is "better" than the other..one is just more pleasing to the eye in riding style.

or guitarists;)..McCoy is Pete Townsend to Walsh's Julian Bream;)
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You want a music metaphor?

McCoy headlined Reading, Ruby played Carnegie Hall....
 
McCoy could have been both. Do you know how many Saturdays he's been at the gaffs and not the big meetings. It's unthinkable to me that he's a great jump jockey. If he was he wouldn't be riding the gaffs when the cameras are elsewhere. He could have taken a different path, a greater path.
 
he will always be regarded as a legend though..based on numbers and endurance..you won't change that.

you make him sound like a failure
 
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EC1 said:
he will always be regarded as a legend though..based on numbers and endurance..you won't change that.

you make him sound like a failure
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He's not the greatest jumps jockey of this decade, of his generation never mind of all time.


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Give this thread another hour and EC1 will be agreeing with SlimChance, it is quite a turn around.
 
SlimChance said:
He's not the greatest jumps jockey of this decade, of his generation never mind of all time.


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who said he is?

he's ridden more winners than any other jockey is waht is being appreciated..significantly more winners ...in a game where people pack it in whilst they are still in one piece
 
EC1 said:
who said he is?

he's ridden more winners than any other jockey is waht is being appreciated..significantly more winners ...in a game where people pack it in whilst they are still in one piece
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It's no different from Dermot Weld being lauded and waxed lyrical about for training 19 winners at the Galway festival every August. Everyone else else is trying to win the big races but you're a hero for winning the most tin pots!

How has AP never had a top job? He could have walked into the Henderson job and rode proper horses. No one will remember the 3,657 yacks that make up his 4,000 winners. He sold his career short.


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In 30 years time when you compare the eras most people will remember Ruby and Kauto or Barry and Sprinter rather than McCoy and 4000(+)
 
FrogTheBountyMuncher said:
In 30 years time when you compare the eras most people will remember Ruby and Kauto or Barry and Sprinter rather than McCoy and 4000(+)
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no..they will remember Kauto Denman..the jockeys will be forgotten

but that is not what is being talked about on the news today..the main news..you and Slim have missed the whole point imo

Horse racing made the main news today..for a good reason..makes a change from some cheating barsteward needling horses does it not?..or would you rather have it that each time racing hits the headlines its for the wrong reasons
 
You keep banging on about him selling out Slim and yet he left the winning conveyor belt of Pipe's yard - where he was constantly criticised for quantity over quality - to be retainer to the pre-eminent owner of our generation.

In the hope of riding the big race winners and yet you sound like you believe it was purely financial.

Is it his fault that during his tenor Nicholls and Mullins (both largely sans JP prior to recently) have dominated, with Henderson providing an increasingly ample supply that will hopefully soon reward AP with the CV entries he deserves.

To paraphrase another AP (o'brien), listen - I'm by no means his biggest fan but you can't question what he has achieved.
 
EC1 said:
no..they will remember Kauto Denman..the jockeys will be forgotten

but that is not what is being talked about on the news today..the main news..you and Slim have missed the whole point imo

Horse racing made the main news today..for a good reason..makes a change from some cheating barsteward needling horses does it not?..or would you rather have it that each time racing hits the headlines its for the wrong reasons
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The irony being he got to 4,000 riding plenty that were cheating.
 
wilsonl said:
You keep banging on about him selling out Slim and yet he left the winning conveyor belt of Pipe's yard - where he was constantly criticised for quantity over quality - to be retainer to the pre-eminent owner of our generation.

In the hope of riding the big race winners and yet you sound like you believe it was purely financial.

Is it his fault that during his tenor Nicholls and Mullins (both largely sans JP prior to recently) have dominated, with Henderson providing an increasingly ample supply that will hopefully soon reward AP with the CV entries he deserves.

To paraphrase another AP (o'brien), listen - I'm by no means his biggest fan but you can't question what he has achieved.
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What has he achieved? Numbers over substance. He sold out to JP. He could have got out and took the Henderson job which was partially his when Mick Fitz retired but ultimately he remained loyal to the devil.
 
JP. The man who has single handily stopped more horses than anyone in the history of horse racing ownership. A number bigger than 4,000 too.
 
I'm not going to argue that point, for more than one reason but it shouldn't cloud judgement over a hard working, come from nothing sort of bloke who has achieved more than his god-given afforded him any right to.
 
wilsonl said:
I'm not going to argue that point, for more than one reason but it shouldn't cloud judgement over a hard working, come from nothing sort of bloke who has achieved more than his god-given afforded him any right to.
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If he'd taken the Henderson job he'd be riding at the foremost meeting every Saturday and would have rode some superstars which he deserved more than others in the sport. He has a career filled with riding the gaffs on Saturdays.
 
SlimChance said:
If he'd taken the Henderson job he'd be riding at the foremost meeting every Saturday and would have rode some superstars which he deserved more than others in the sport. He has a career filled with riding the gaffs on Saturdays.
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Slim, you yourself have stated that AP McCoy chose to "stay loyal" to McManus, rather than take the Henderson job. Loyalty is a virtue often missing in top-end sportsmen, and is generally to be applauded, rather than wielded against someone as "selling out".

Whatever his riding-arrangment motivations, they should not detract from what he has achieved in an unprecedented career. :cool:
 
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