Balloting

The word 'random' features quite often. I was hoping that wouldn't be the case. How random is the random process I wonder :rolleyes:
 
Do they have a program that does through all the intricacies of each race and figures out who runs. I presume it's not a manual process ? :what:
 
They ring the top trainers and ask them which ones they were only entering to get ballotted so they could run in the race they want to next week, then ballott those ones out. If they still have to ballot a few more out, they pick the useless horses from small yards (can't argue if they get ballotted), then they ballot the small trainer horses out (will never have a voice loud enough to get into the Irish Indo). At that stage you should have the right number and all the better trainers are happy. Random innit!!
 
Cantoris you cynical dog :D
They should call DK and ask him which one Shanahan is going to ride, than automatically ballot that one as Smullen never picks the wrong one and the second choice is always a safe distance down the field.

I have a little pony I bred myself running tomorrow, no star but hopefully he won't fall out the back of the Tele :brows:
 
Originally posted by Sheikh@May 29 2008, 01:12 PM
Cantoris you cynical dog :D
They should call DK and ask him which one Shanahan is going to ride, than automatically ballot that one as Smullen never picks the wrong one and the second choice is always a safe distance down the field.

I have a little pony I bred myself running tomorrow, no star but hopefully he won't fall out the back of the Tele :brows:
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It's a merit system...the one Smullen would ride would generally have the better credentials so would obviously be better protected.
 
In maidens where they are first time out and have no credentials the one Smullen is on is always the right one and the other is not placed, in other words a non trier just out for an educational.
 
Ballot numbers come out the day after entries are made. So your genuinely suggesting that someone in Horse Racing Ireland rings up Mr Weld and asks him which runner he is likely to want to run? Because thats the only way he would find out...lads come on, a bit of common sense!
 
Gal we're being tongue in cheek cynical. I have a fair idea how the balloting system works I just want to get to grips with the finer points. The .doc from Bar is my Bedtime reading.
 
Originally posted by Galileo@May 29 2008, 11:59 AM
Yeah Brave Inca didn't have much trouble getting in!! :D

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Colm keeps telling me that the good horses never have a problem with balloting as he nods his head at €34k in Goffs and then turns and says "I've got another good one for ya"!!

Thankfully, we have never had any real issues with balloting. Brave Inca was lucky enough to get into all his early races except for his first handicap when we just took what we could get as he couldn't jump to save his life. It wasn't really relevant later on. But with KK and CB we have been lucky and picked races where we knew we would get in.

And it is all done by computer programme as every trainer in the country sits there waiting for the ballotting, hoping their horse doesn't get into the two miler they were entered in when it's the two mile four the next day they want to run in!!
 
Sheikh, what's your horse's name?

The scenario of ringing trainers does go on, but it's trainers ringing each other to see which of their entries they intend to declare.
 
HRI Announces Additional Measures to Address Balloting Issues​

Horse Racing Ireland (HRI) today announced an extension of its quality control measures, whilst re-affirming its following key objectives in relation to the racing programme:

Ø To enhance the quality, competitiveness and appeal of racing
Ø To offer substantial prize money ranged in accordance with horses’ ability
Ø To progressively remove the worst horses from the system
Ø To encourage re-investment in young bloodstock
Ø To address the problem of excessive eliminations, especially in low grade handicaps
Ø To re-enforce the merit-based element in the balloting system

A series of measures will come into effect next year that will see:

Ø The continued expansion of the fixture list, with 5 additional meetings in 2009 to a record new level of 355, whilst at the same time maintaining Ireland’s high prize money levels by retaining a minimum race value of €8,500

Ø An increase in the minimum qualifying ratings, up by 2lb for all flat handicaps and by 3lb for all handicap hurdles

Ø Measures that will see the lowest quality hurdlers (rated 77 or less) and flat horses (rated 43 or less) removed from the system at the end of 2008

Ø The continuation of the mechanism to ensure the speedier removal of the worst horses in the future linked to official handicap ratings

Announcing these measures, Jason Morris, HRI Director of Racing, stated: “The level of balloting and eliminations from races in Ireland is still a source of understandable concern within the industry. Some progress has been made following the quality control measures introduced for this year and, over the first seven months, eliminations dropped from 3,026 to 2,072 on the flat and from 10,726 to 10,154 for National Hunt racing. However, the levels remain too high and HRI remains committed to implementing measures that will progressively bring about improvement over the current situation. Irish racing must continue to create a balance between the demand for racing opportunities and the need to develop an industry based on quality, merit and competitive prize money levels”.
 
Something that I was wondering, and in fairness, it only arises once a year so its not a big deal.

If there were 10 horses in the grand national allocated a weight off 10-2, and they happened to be horses numbers 35-44 in the list. How would they decide who gets in?

As I said I was just wondering.
 
The ones with the best current BHB ratings would get in first. So therefore if a horse were to have come out and run well subsequent to the weights being released, they would get in first.

Assuming that there is still a tie, I have no idea what they do next. Possibly drawing lots or pistols at dawn.
 
Garney said:
Something that I was wondering, and in fairness, it only arises once a year so its not a big deal.

If there were 10 horses in the grand national allocated a weight off 10-2, and they happened to be horses numbers 35-44 in the list. How would they decide who gets in?

As I said I was just wondering.
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Horse's of equal protection will be sorted randomly.
 
So it's a minimum of 45 next year ,correct ?

I don't agree with the policy, If people are prepared to train them and own them they should be allowed race them, and the authorities should make that possible. Has he stated what rating is his ultimate goal ?
 
FLAT

  • The minimum qualifying rating will be increased from 45 to 47.

  • Any horse rated 43 or lower at the end of the 2008 Irish season (December), which has run five or more times (six or more times in the case of three-year-olds), will no longer be permitted to run in Irish flat races. (Such horses will be allowed to re-qualify by gaining an improved rating through running overseas).

  • Any horse rated 43 or lower which has run less than five times at the end of the 2008 season will be raised to a mark of 44 at year end. This is consistent with the current policy that no horse is removed from the system until it has run at least five times (or six times in the case of three-year-olds).

  • No horse will be dropped to a mark below 44 when the Handicappers conduct their end of season ratings review.

  • Next year, all horses rated 44-46 will be required to run off a mark of 47, but as per the current system they will not be disadvantaged in the ballot for lower grade (i.e. 47-60/65) random ballot handicaps, because they will be treated for balloting purposes as though rated 47.

  • The same criteria by which horses are currently removed from the system by their handicap rating will continue to apply, but with a rating of 43 or lower (up 2lb from 41 this year) effectively disqualifying horses next season.

HURDLES

  • The minimum qualifying rating will be increased from 77 to 80.

  • Any hurdler rated 77 or lower at the end of 2008 will no longer be permitted to run in Irish hurdle races (again they can re-qualify by running overseas).

  • All hurdlers rated 78-79 will be required to run off a mark of 80 next year but, in a change from current procedure, they will no longer be disadvantaged in the random ballot system for low grade handicaps. Rather than being the first horses eliminated, instead they will be treated for balloting purposes as though rated 80.

  • The same criteria by which horses are currently removed from the system by their handicap rating will continue to apply, but with a rating of 77 or lower (up 3lb from 74 this year) effectively disqualifying horses next season.

  • Hurdlers finishing more than 45 lengths behind the winner in their first five hurdle runs will no longer be permitted to run in Irish hurdle races (again they can re-qualify by running overseas).
 
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