Barney Curley

Don't graft. Work when I want and not when someone dictates. That can be any hour

It really is a different world to you people isn't it?
 
Taxman Ted wants his SATR dough in one week......always a time of year when those running SME's are at their most tetchy
 
clivex said:
??

Do you really think that a tax accountant at this time of year keeps civil service hours?


Do you know what time of year it is? And you were a tax inspector?
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Clive, you really must try and express yourself more clearly. Your initial post merely referred to a "tax guy", not a tax accountant. Perhaps DO could give you a lesson or two?
 
Whatever

I will draw a parrallel with an area of business and financing i know

This particular area has a little bit of a reputation amongst smes for collusions between lenders, accountants and insolvency practitioners. In fact it is often in the press.

There are a couple of lenders who have a particular reputation for being "clever" and basically stiffing small companies for what they can get out of it. But there are 40 odd lenders in the market and I know them all. Some are devious, some a little near thenmark but The majority are straight.

This form of lending is probably the most accessible and most fluent for any business. It is also often cheaper than expected

It should sweep he board with smes

But what am I up against?

Too many (and one is too many) "Insiders" doing rather well for themselves whilst screwing decent businessmen

And does it make this market the easy sell it should be?

Does it ****

The market has in fact cleaned itself up over the past couple of years but mud sticks and it has some way to go. Losing a bad reputation is more difficult than getting a good one


(My blog has some stuff on it and more http://cpcmcredit.wordpress.com/ h
 
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Most people have zero idea about what drives smes and the culture and motivations that surround them. There are always exceptions but I work with many and across many sectors and the vast majority and completely honest simple because.....

If you go in with a "rip off" mentality you will get absolutely nowhere

Relationships are long term and word of mouth is absolutely crucial. It remains the biggest driver of business by far
 
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I do wish you would all stop bickering like little girls. We are debating the cheating ******* trainer not the tax affairs of clive and the "work" of public sector. :)
 
There has been no "cheating", Digger - just a patient plot, perfectly executed by shrewdies.

This extracurricular is much more interesting.
 
Bar the Bull said:
I find it staggering that somebody can claim that the vast majority of business people screw people over, and when Clive defends them, he is made out to be the bad guy.
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Nobody said screw people over Bar...I'm not even involved but you would want to be a pretty naive business person not to exploit all the tax loopholes regarding expenses and claiming back VAT. I think that is the crux of the issue and I have no issue with that personally.
 
trefflich said:
Nobody said screw people over Bar...I'm not even involved but you would want to be a pretty naive business person not to exploit all the tax loopholes regarding expenses and claiming back VAT. I think that is the crux of the issue and I have no issue with that personally.
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The term 'exploit loopholes' is contentious in itself though, trefflich.

Legitimate expenses are exactly that......and if you're late paying VAT, the Revenue can boot your door down at any time, and take yer wide-screen-telly as compensation!

The overheads on SME's are fairly high, insofar as keeping Taxman Ted onside - it's not all cocktails-and-dreams.
 
Grasshopper said:
The term 'exploit loopholes' is contentious in itself though, trefflich.

Legitimate expenses are exactly that......and if you're late paying VAT, the Revenue can boot your door down at any time, and take yer wide-screen-telly as compensation!

The overheads on SME's are fairly high, insofar as keeping Taxman Ted onside - it's not all cocktails-and-dreams.
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What's he on about re vat? It's claimed back against what you have to pay over. Wtf is wrong with that?



Spot on. Vat is zero tolerance

There is a huge myth about expenses too. It's not that easy and I would be certain that most businesses don't claim all they could. I don't. It's a pain to keep the records for a start
 
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clivex said:
What's he on about re vat? It's claimed back against what you have to pay over. Wtf is wrong with that?



Spot on. Vat is zero tolerance

There is a huge myth about expenses too. It's not that easy and I would be certain that most businesses don't claim all they could. I don't. It's a pain to keep the records for a start
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I'm low-maintenance on exes, but haven't claimed for about 50% of them because it's barely worth the effort of time. Client and Agency systems are generally built to discourage such claims.
 
clivex said:
What's he on about re vat? It's claimed back against what you have to pay over. Wtf is wrong with that?



Spot on. Vat is zero tolerance

There is a huge myth about expenses too. It's not that easy and I would be certain that most businesses don't claim all they could. I don't. It's a pain to keep the records for a start
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Didn't say there's anything wrong with it Clive...read the small print...I'd assume you are aware of that nugget of info?
 
I've missed all this . There's nothing like a good laugh when people with passion go off on one . What a laugh I'm having. I thought the neigh forum was a giggle but some of you beat it hands down. The posts read like 'Angry of Mayfair'.
 
If you are calling VAT claimback as a "loophole" you are hardly doing anything other than suggesting its a fiddle which it emphatically is not

If you are talking about within VAT claimback. there are no "loopholes" None whatsoever. Its clear and nailed down
 
clivex said:
If you are calling VAT claimback as a "loophole" you are hardly doing anything other than suggesting its a fiddle which it emphatically is not

If you are talking about within VAT claimback. there are no "loopholes" None whatsoever. Its clear and nailed down
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Agreed...the loopholes are regarding expenses.
 
baracouda said:
I've missed all this . There's nothing like a good laugh when people with passion go off on one . What a laugh I'm having. I thought the neigh forum was a giggle but some of you beat it hands down. The posts read like 'Angry of Mayfair'.
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I'm currently taking anger management classes.
 
trefflich said:
Agreed...the loopholes are regarding expenses.
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In my (albeit limited experience) this simply isn't the case in practice - certainly not amongst SME's.

Yes, you want your accountant to maximise your take-home (otherwise why go into business, right), but the effort-versus-benefit award - not to mention the potential fretting - is rarely, if ever, sustainable, when it comes to expense-fraud.....certainly amongst SME's.

This type of stiffing the system can prevail in large conglomerates - fuel expenses being a primary example - but the beneficiaries of this type of caper are largy staffers having it off in a laissez-faire environment, rather than the conglomerates themselves.

In my own 'industry', the closest you generally get to tax-dodging, is by setting-up off-shore, but the Revenue have dropped the portcullis on that arrangement, and are chasing not only the SME's, but the agencies and accountants that offer management services for such arrangements. The SMEs might not be too concerned (the practice is a loop-hole) but the accountants and agencies are running-scared, and are dropping such clients like stones in their shoe. From that perspective, this particular loophole is being closed by self-regulation , rather than by meaningful legislation.

Regardless, you're looking under the wrong stone.

Fiddling expenses and off-shoring to avoid tax is, amongst SMEs, an infinitessimal drop-in-the-ocean, when set against what we lose in Corporate Tax payments from large companies operating under 'special tax arrangements'.

The value of every SME scam in the country combined, would be dwarfed by what Amazon alone have managed to swerve in Corporation Tax they should have been paying.



The secret of my financial insight can also be yours, for the fabulous, knock-down, one-off fee of £99.99 (excl VAT). Please send your Postal Orders to: Grasshopper Inc (Chemicals, Dyes, Munitions & Disco Pants), PO Box 72727, Pittenweem, The Kingdom Of Fife
 
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