Company Policies

  • Thread starter Thread starter Phil Waters
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Anything but that. :blink:

There is little to elaborate on - I now work for the contractor which does installations in Scotland. Which almost certainly means that I really shouldn't be slagging off The Client's working practices on an internet forum. But there you go..

Jolly nice chaps they are too (The Contractor).
 
Not read right through this

But ive fired "sickie merchants" before

go for it... they know what what
 
Clive, you have never "fired" anyone before in your life. For a start, being able to terminate someone's employment requires you to be in a superior position to the person in question.

Nobody would put you in a position of authority based on you being an idiot.
 
Thought it might amuse you Phil. Willie Walsh has just been on the radio sounding anything but sure of himself :lol:

Basically, it revolves around management bullying over the sickness procedure. Walsh of course denies that there's anything wrong, but as was pointed out to him, you just don't get that kind of mandate in a ballot if there wasn't.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6285177.stm
 
I was just reading about Virgin Mobile and their sickness policy. It embarrasses ours.
 
Originally posted by Warbler@Jan 21 2007, 08:11 PM
Thought it might amuse you Phil. Willie Walsh has just been on the radio sounding anything but sure of himself :lol:

Basically, it revolves around management bullying over the sickness procedure. Walsh of course denies that there's anything wrong, but as was pointed out to him, you just don't get that kind of mandate in a ballot if there wasn't.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6285177.stm
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I would back BA on that. An average of 22 days is absolutely shocking on the part of the workers and they deserve all that they get. Whatever happened to a fair days work for a fair days pay?
 
Phil. Cant be bothered.

Is there anyone here whos managed staff who hasnt wanted to dump someone whos constantly off for this or that?

I would say, if not, then you have been very very fortunate

Simmo...is that 22 days off sick on average? if so...totally agree
 
BA insisted it was merely cutting high levels of sickness absence. The average of 22 days had been reduced to 12 but this was still above the UK average of seven per worker per year, it said.
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Thats incredible

Given that they probably have a good number of staff who are only off sick when sick, then you can imagine how high some figures are

Fact is this does make life harder for those who are genuinely ill.
 
Think about it first folks.

How many workers are routinely asked to work for an extended period of time in a pressurised tube at 30,000 feet for hours and hours at an end. When you factor in that this tube flies all over the world, to some reasonably 'exotic' locations, and can carry upward of 450 different people in a very confined space. any one of whom might be carrying heaven knows what by way of illness, or country of origin, it doesn't seem at all unreasonable to expect their sickness levels to be above average. I'm struggling to think of a job in honesty that has a greater capacity for not just picking up infections, but some quite bizzarre ones at that.

I remember coming back on a diseased China Airlines flight from Beijing. I was fine when I bordered, by the time we got to about Eastern Europe, I along with everyone else on the flight had succumb to some infectious bug. It reminded me of film called the Casanadra Crossing. Half the plane was violently ill by the time we landed.

By the time you add jet lag, sleep deprivation, lack of fresh air and diet into equation (clearly they have to exist on the same rubbish that their passengers do) We might be able to cope with it one off, they eat it everytime they fly, I think you'll agree that its plainly disingenious to even try and draw a comparator with 'land based' office jobs and their work station to floorspace allowances
 
I was thinking much the same thing, Warbler. In my first two or three years in teaching I was off several times. The stresses of the job allied to dealing closely with hundreds of kids five days a week, eight hours a day inevitably mant you picked up a number of the many strains of cold and other viruses doing the rounds. After the first few years your immune system deals with most but you're still working closely with potential carriers of just about anything.

I've always thought air cabin crew must be more susceptible due to the cramped nature of their surroundings. I know I've been ill a few times after flights to/from Europe.
 
I would imagine that the jet lag/flying across time zones is factored into the workers shift patterns somewhat.

Nevermind 22 days off sick, or 12, or even 7 a year - I've taken precisely 2 days off sick in the last 3 years! The only time I take a day off sick is if I physically can't get out of bed. Here in Gib the locals treat their sick entitlement as additional holidays and I know of one lad who asked his line manager one day "how many sick days to I have left to take this year?" - I kid you not. It drives me mad to get into work and hear "so-and-so isn't coming in today - they've rung in sick" knowing damn well there's nothing wrong with them that actually would stop them coming in and it's more than likely as not a hangover.

As for the strike issue Simmo - don't ever consider working in Gib. They're so workshy here that half the population turns out to strike with frightening regularity whilst loving standing around yelling & carrying placards. They weren't too impressed with me one day when, on coming across a crowd of them getting in my way outside the office (the Union building is opposite ours)I shouted at them "why don't you just get on and do an honest day's work, for God's sake?" or words to that effect. It bugs me that the whole attitude out here at least is "I don't like that, let's strike". It's a good job some of us aren't so damn workshy or the world would grind to a halt!
 
To be honest I was struggling to think of job more at risk to high absenteeism?. A laboratory researcher into tropical illnesses? but even they've got a controlled environment. Clearly you need to compare like with like to make any sense of these figures, and there is an additional factor of course as cabin crew first and foremost, are the trained H&S operation of the aircraft, rather than the 'trolley dollies' of popular myth, so need tobe fit to work in the event of emergencies etc. I don't know what the CAA's requirement is, but one assumes there's some threshold of passenger to trained crew ratio, that has to be in place before a plane is deemed fir to fly?

The truly remarkable figure in this whole episode is the 96% who voted for strike action. That is simply phenomenal. For Willie Walsh to say there's nothing wrong is plain cobblers. You just don't/ can't get that level of response unless the workforce has got very real concerns. And it's not as if they're picking soft times of the year either, (or England world cup matches like the RMT :lol: )
 
Had one girl working for me who was off sick so much i forgot what she looked like

Of course all her colleagues chuntered about it

One Monday (its always Monday) she rang in with flu (always flu) and said she was "signed off for two weeks" and wouldnt be back before then. Of course she knew full well the exact timespan of her flu virus...

After weeks she came back

"on yet bike" ...tears blah blah

Colleagues chuntering...Unfair harsh blah blah


Time passes...three months later across the office, two of my (very good) staff, S to M " Tracy's started a new job. shes really happy. I just called her"

"oh really, what did she say"

(my ears pricked up)

" err mmm nothing"

"what?"

" she's off sick"

Word for word...100% true
 
Originally posted by Warbler@Jan 22 2007, 12:23 PM
It reminded me of film called the Casanadra Crossing. Half the plane was violently ill by the time we landed.
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Hopefully without a rickety old bridge to cross at the end of the journey. It'll never take the weight!


I know several Air Stewards/Stewardesses (4 to be precise). Not one of them has anything to say about their job which is uncomplementary, barring being pissed off if they are constantly on shuttle duty to Leeds/Bradford or some equally exotic locale.

Those who work on long-haul flights to the farther reaches of the world are especially happy and not simply because they get to "see the world". Whilst their hours of work are arduous at the time, they are more than adequately compensated in their shift pattern for this.

None of the three who work long-haul have ever, to my knowledge, succumbed to tropical diseases. Now, admittedly, the sample size is small, but I would suggest that if the problem is so rife that they push the average days sickness in their entire company up to 22 days, that at least one of them would have suffered a life threatening illness at some time.

I would further suggest that pilots and steward(esse)s are a tiny proportion of the total workforce.

I would further, further suggest, that the discontent displayed is more a result of years of having been allowed to get away with murder suddenly being taken away from them and their being made more accountable for their own actions.

Unlike SL, I have no problem whatsoever with people going on strike when they have a genuine greivance. On the evidence that I have been presented with thus far on this problem, I can see no such evidence.
 
If there is a genuine grievance and other avenues have been pursued prior to strike action leaving no choice but to go on strike then I don't have a problem with it. What does annoy me is striking pretty much for the sake of it - which is precisely what we have here in Gib. The shysters that turn out for their twice-monthly strikes haven't done a day's honest graft in their life! It's strange too that they tend to strike mainly in winter - of course in summer they all work half days so they can bugger off to the beach at 2pm anyway, God forbid striking should stop them lying on the beach, no, darleeng!
 
I've just done a few quick calculations and allowing for a reasonable distribution of sickness types across the company, in order to get to an average of 22 days sickness per year across your workforce, you would need 5% of your staff being off for 6 months or more, 10% having a quarter of the year off sick, 35% being off for a few weeks a year and just 52% falling into the national average bracket of a week or so.

That compares to a "normal" company, where the respective figures would be (in the same order) 1%, 2%, 5%, 93%.

It is beyond me how anyone can defend that.
 
With respect Simmo, I notice you invoke Munch. That's how I feel when i read that. Please compare like with like otherwise, don't bother trying.
 
Alright let me try another way or few.

You invoke 4 friends, but rather revealing you don't declare any of them as BA employees? Revealing? I'd say so. I suspect any of us can fall back on rival companies/ alternative employees for evidence? It means nothing! The strike is against the company not the job.

The fact that you then go on to say how much they enjoy their jobs etc only lends weight to the BA claim I'd have thought? They essentially do a similar job? so why do BA cabin crew vote 96%

Your asserrtion that they've been living the good times in the first place and can't cope with a new regime, is frankly guess work, it's possibly based in professional rivalry from the people you've picked that opinion up from? and at the worst I'd have to suggest your having a wild stab in the dark. The simple fact is, you don't know, and the sooner you acknowledge that the credible you might appear.

By contrast, I don't know for certain what's caused it (I suspect I know, but until I find out I've kept that to myself) you however don't seem to extend them that decency and are quite prepared to speculate. The union that's called the strike is also my own, and although we take a firm line, we aren't unreasonable either. 96% is frankly phenomenal. I've tried agitating a workforce, I've tried getting the vote out, I've tried organising pickets to turn up at early hours, and I'll promise you, you'd never get remotely close to that response if there wasn't something seriosuly wrong. This is a workforce that last struck 10 years ago (baggage handlers are contract and covered differently) this is not an out and out militant, but one who feels pushed. What interested me last night was the callers to radio 5 who were business class customers who supported the crew. Explain that? even they've noticed the standards dropping.

Please try understand people before you resot to your calculator and speculation based on 'my friends'
 
It turns out that another woman (even younger than the last one) was given a written warning today because of her lateness/absence.

Being late back to sign in from breaks and lunches counts as being late.

She has been off 3 times since July last year, the 2nd of which was due to losing her unborn baby and she tried to commit suicide. She was off for 4 weeks.

Her most recent absence (due to flu) has triggered alarm bells and she received a warning.

Richard Branson must be spinning in his hot air balloon.
 
Having had a quick fag and cup of tea and considered your history Phil ;) Lets just say I apologise/ reserve my right, for previous insinuation - disappointed :angy:
 
I'm seriously struggling to believe any employer would behave like that Phil? And coming so soon after the previous one, I can't help concluding that you might just be up to a bit of your ........... :brows:
 
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