Madeleine Mccann

Technically speaking. Can someone be charged for murder, if a dead body isn't found. Surely until such time as a dead body turns up, the girl remains 'missing'. Though I seem to think there's a charge called 'suspicion of murder' isn't there? It reminds me of a bizzarre case in Australia where a missing persons arm complete with a distinctive tattoo was mysteriously found inside the stomach of a Tiger Shark. The evidence of the sethering proved that the dismemberment was nothing to do with the shark but had been accomplished using a knife. However, in the absence of a dead body a murder enquiry couldn't be launched as a human arm doesn't equal a dead body etc
 
Peter Falconio's body was never found in Australia, yet they successfully prosecuted someone for his murder.
 
Ditto at least one of the Moors Murders? I've a feeling Fred West's bodies weren't all found either yet he was convicted for them.
 
Ugh!!!!

Funnily enough I was trying to dissuade the lads from buying the habitual kebabs after a session in Po Na Na last week on the grounds that "you have no idea what is in it - it'll be cats & foxes scraped up from the road".....:laughing:
 
Originally posted by Venusian@Sep 11 2007, 07:45 PM
Headstrong, the significance (to me) about the open window and shutters are:

1. The parents both said they must have been forced open from the outside, but this has been shown to be untrue. They had been opened from the inside.

2. If an intruder had walked in through the unlocked patio door, then why would he/she open the window and shutters before leaving?
Click to expand...
Venusian, yes sorry, I did get your point, I was just adding a bit to it.
I was drinking with a journalist friend this evening; he got a news flash by text on his mobile that the twins were being taken into care, but I can't find anything to confirm this on news websites [have not looked far]
 
I think Leicestershire Social Services were meeting to considering taking the twins into care, HS. It was mentioned on the BBC news yesterday morning.
 
It appears the police are looking for special permission "emergency powers" to search an area in Portugal they haven't been able to search before. No one knows yet where this place may be but it could be wasteground, or a place of workship. Prosecutor also rumoured wants approval to seize an un named item too. Surely not, Cuddle Cat? :suspect: Still not sure what they hasn't been "seized" already as possible evidence since Kate was named as a suspect.
 
Has Cuddle Cat been eliminated, can he account for his movements :eek:

The media is rife this morning (but then lets not forget this was the same media that was previously responsible for tipping the police off about Robert Murat and digging up all sorts of lurid innuedo about him).

The new search area appears to be digging up some roadworks if they are to be believed, but the idea that they've been able to pull a stunt like that looks a bit far fetched I'd have thought. I can't see how they'd have concealed a 3 week dead body in the first place in those kind of temperatures, then moved it, and cemented in over in the middle of the night without the workmen noticing. If they knew there was a concrete mix about to be poured the next morning, then it's just about possible, but it would be leaving far too much to chance.

The other story doing the rounds concerns a substantial find of DNA matched hair in the spare wheel undertray in the boot of the car. Now that would take a bit of explaining, but then I don't know how many hire car companies there are in the resort, or how big their fleets are. The balance of probabilities would be stacking up against them if this is indeed sustained, but a possible doubt would still exist, and since this would be a criminal prosecution 'doubt' would be the burden of proof required, as there would always be a chance that the McCanns could have hired the same car 25 days later?

Leicestershire Social Services will just hold a meeting, set up a steering group, and then write a strategy for consultation.

They'll be more worried about the mental state of the parents I'd have thought. Not an easy one in fairness to them. Who'd want to be a Director of Social Services? If they act, then they've entered into a proxy judgement, there is however a worse case scenario which they need to guard against
 
The balance of probabilities would be stacking up against them if this is indeed sustained, but a possible doubt would still exist, and since this would be a criminal prosecution 'doubt' would be the burden of proof required, as there would always be a chance that the McCanns could have hired the same car 25 days later?
Click to expand...

That would be on the records and i think they would have remembered anyway
 
If there was a hair of Madeleine's on the parents jumper and they through it in the boot it could easily fall into the car. I would be suspicious if there was masses of her hair in the boot. Without getting too grim, if they moved her after a few weeks she would surely have to be well wrapped up given the condition the body would be in…so how would it be possible for significant amount of hair to be in the boot. This case just gets stranger and stranger and I am beginning to think the media is in that much of a rush to get news they are literally reporting every report they get and most of it is well wide of the mark.
 
According to the Irish Independent they will be able to tell whether the hair came off Madelaine when she was alive or dead.
 
...yes...and in the Times too

in fact, they know already. Doesnt take much analysis by all accounts

Suspect the confidence of the Police could be based around that
 
Masses of hair in DNA context presumebly only means one or two undamaged folics.

You could cross contaminate the boot as you've described Gal, but to get a hair or two into the bit where the spare tyre is requires you to remove the boots carpet, then unhinge the trap door containing the tyre, then pull the tyre out, and then drop the hair in. If any cross contamination has gone on you'd expect it to be in the drivers and front seat passengers chairs
 
Masses of hair in DNA context presumebly only means one or two undamaged folics.
Click to expand...


No

You need to get the Times! Not the Guardian....

apparently they have made it clear that this was not a couple of strands and that the amount involved could not have been accidentally transferred
 
So much doesn't add up.

If the hair in question was from a corpse, or the result of the test was imminent, why would the police let the Mccann's go back to England?

Can the McCann's not request Honest Tom's lie detector test? Even if the results are not 100% accurate and (presuming their innocence) there was an outside chance it would land them in hot water, surely the primary/only concern for the parents is to get the police to refocus their efforts on catching the real villain.

It seems totally unbelievable that the McCanns could possibly have hidden a body for three weeks and then moved it in their own hired car without drawing any attention. If the police didn't have a 24 hour watch on them, surely at least one semi-suspicious investigative journalist took a chance and did.
 
It seems totally unbelievable that the McCanns could possibly have hidden a body for three weeks and then moved it in their own hired car without drawing any attention.
Click to expand...

Perhaps they had help?
 
If the hair in question was from a corpse, or the result of the test was imminent, why would the police let the Mccann's go back to England?
Click to expand...

Procedure.... and at this stage they couldnt stop them
 
It's hard to imagine how you could persuade anyone to move the body of a child you had killed, especially when half the world are out looking for her and ready to lynch anybody who might be involved.

I suppose nothing is impossible though.

I expect we will find out what evidence the police have if they are charged, and it's probably safe to assume they don't have as much as they are pretending if they aren't.
 
Unless of course somebody had access to the hair and knew which was the McCann's car and needed to have the police focus only on that possibility.
 
Originally posted by an capall@Sep 12 2007, 01:29 PM
Unless of course somebody had access to the hair and knew which was the McCann's car and needed to have the police focus only on that possibility.
Click to expand...
Was wondering when that would occur to somebody else... :what: I must read too many crime novels - "I bin fitted oop guvnor!".
 
That occurred to me, however, that somebody appears to have been doing a pretty good job of getting away with it, why take the risk of getting caught breaking into a car with a clump of a dead girls hair.

It is starting to feel like an episode of Columbo.
 
Back
Top