Margaret Thatcher dead

Yes. Dull narccistic prick writes an article on Thatcher which probably says absolutely nothing but will no doubt be ME ME ME!

Brand does fascinate me though. I never thought anyone could make Vic reeves seem funny in comparison. Quite an achievement
 
Please choose from one of the following two options:

1. I have read the article in question, and as per my expectations, it failed to amuse, educate or move me.

2. I have not read the article, and will instead judge it on a set of preconceived notions I have about the author.
 
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Something you wont hear on the bbc

How many mines were closed during thatchers time ? 154

How many duriing wilsons shorter reign ? 261

And yes harry. Glenda iss a failed minister who was too thick to cope with an easy brief
 
trudij said:
Your last paragraph sums it up for me - I've had texts from people who are nothing to so with the mining industry or the forces and some were babies when she was PM - my answer to all of them was "so why so much hate for a frail old lady? What did she do to you?" (I can sort of understand miners and forces being not that sad !)
The weirdest answer (from someone who wasn't there either and supports neither team involved!) was that he hates her because when hillsborough happened, she swept it under the carpet and blamed the hooligans....

I really worry about the next generation sometimes, so much hate....
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I would think that the reason so many younger people are protesting etc. has little to do with Thatcher herself, but that they see her as the mentor of the present Government and their attacks on Education and Benefits
 
Cheers Colin

Haven't read it all by any means but larry elliotts and Simon Jenkins pieces are very good. Don't agree with every word but they are fair and balanced
 
I'd like to say I think Clivex is a legend.

No can someone tell me this is based on an idealisic bullshit, cheers.
 
Just a bit curious like: if the mines should have been kept open, then why didn't Blair or Brown open them?
Haven't heard Clegg banging on about them either
 
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harry said:
Just a bit curious like: if the mines should have been kept open, then why didn't Blair or Brown open them?
Haven't heard Clegg banging on about them either
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reopening costs.

and there would no point now as the UK markets for coal are being dismantled over the next 8 years.
 
Scottish Coal have just announced that they are shutting 6 of their 8 open cast mines because they can't afford to keep them going.

Unfortunately the one which keeps me awake on a regular basis is one of the 2 staying open.

Which is another thing to blame Maggie for - if she hadn't shut all of the deep mines, they wouldn't have needed an open cast mine a mile away from my gaff.

Bitch. :D
 
harry said:
Glenda Jackson: swap places in the coffin you worthless ugly munter
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One of the greatest actors of her generation and a magnificent speech that told the truth and stripped away all the fawning Tory cant .

Can someone please explain why the taxpayer is paying for this ridiculously overblown funeral - it was a prime candidate for privatisation .
 
Theres a rule n business that when negotiations get personal with character attacks the argument is lost.

No different in politics. But then again we all know that the argument has long since been lost. Socialism is finished at that's that.

Having said that jackson simply does not have the resources to offer anything else. A failed junior minister. Somewhat short of thatchers abilities


Milliband must be livid this week. To win the election he needs floating voters. Those voters going to gravitate to the desperate juvenile behaviour we've been watching?
 
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As a political junkie I can't but be impressed by her winning three elections having swung so wildly in the polls (how rigorous the methodology was I don't know admittedly). Her achievement in outfoxing Heath and Whitelaw etc. to the leadership - especially given the not inconsiderable handicap of being a woman - is impressive as well. I remember reading that The Times quoted her at 1000's to be PM in 1967.

That said, I fail to see why her 'uncompromising' attitude should be seen as something especially laudable. She didn't lack the nuance to act pragmatically (as she showed in dealing with Hong Kong), but she was unwilling to compromise on many issues. In being so deliberately confrontational, she poisoned the political water.
 
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Politicians need to draw a line in the sand and she frequently got it right. Endless fudging and compromise got us to the situation we were in in 1979. No good

Up against bobby sands and scargill you do not compromise.

Suny. Only on here surely. I suppose it's where you define socialism but if we ar talking command economies and state control of much of our lives, few agree and they are mostly in straightjackets.

It is significant that the banking crisis didn't shift the electorate to the left one inch. Hard left socialism is dead and desperately drifted off into alliances with religious bigots. Says it all
 
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clivex said:
It is significant that the banking crisis didn't shift the electorate to the left one inch. Hard left socialism is dead.
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This is probably fair comment, if taken in a UK-centric context. I'm not so certain it applies across the wider European landscape.

It all depends on what you mean by 'hard-left'?

Granted, the Party-cronyism of the ex-Soviet Bloc states has largely been swept aside, and State-control of industry has passed into private hands all over the continent. From that perspective, I'd agree.

But what about the self-evident activism in moderate States like Greece? Large protests against the tools of capitalism (EU, IMF World Bank, wider finance industry etc), the calling of General Strikes, street demos all over the parish. These are classic, hard-left tendencies too.

Broadly-speaking, you are correct, though the situation is obviously much more complex than a simple black/white argument would suggest.
 
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Greece is pretty ropey example though really. And they are actually protesting about having to pay any taxes at all. They are baffled as to why they should pay anything towards their own public services and why germans are reluctant to do so (read boomerang and you will realise that Greece deserves nothing). A bollard has a better grip of governance and economics than the average bubble

Havent defined it well but the late great Tony Judt did so when he drew a clear line between social democracy and socialism (he despised the latter). The clearest difference is that the first believes strongly in a free market and reasonable distribution whilst the latter is for heavy state control command economy. There are within the labour party believers of both and they are much further apart from each other than cross party.in fact it was this schism which was labours downfall in late 70s and 80s and could still be going forward.

On the social level and as we have see this week, there is also a strong sloganising element to to the harder left which parades hatred based on class and creed (anti semitism is certainly a factor) and as ive said before, Milliband (who is developing fast as a leader) must be livid. The floating voter took one look at those protesters and probably thought... they are floaters
 
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The loonies on the extreme left are just as mental as the EDL types on the opposite wing, blaming their loser lifes on other people.
 
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