NH Racing in Crisis

edgt said:
The younger racing fan doesn't have that loyalty.
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Actually, this is a point that's been on my mind - and worrying me - for some time.

Where are the youngsters? The people that might be posting here in 30-40 years' time.

I think the numbers will be severely limited. I just can't see how the 16-25 year-old's of today are going to build up the history we did over 20, 30, 40, 50 years. That's a long term problem surely.

Maybe they are on FB, Telegram etc. But I suspect not.
 
I'm getting bored with it all tbh

Ive barely had a bet on NH racing so far this season, just bet on the A.W and the American at weekends

Apart from Xmas week, Cheltenham and the National i just can't get excited about it

What were looking at here is a slow drag decline, it won't die but in 25 years time it's gonna look a lot different to what it is now
 
One might argue that the decline began a good while ago when the BBC killed off Grandstand and then its regular racing coverage . It does not just apply to racing I think . The ending of terrestrial coverage has caused cricket no end of harm too in numbers watching and kids playing .

When I was a child in the 70s and early 80s the existence of Grandstand and World of Sport meant that I knew lots about lots of sports , from skiing to speedway because they were shown on terrestrial TV - nowadays football is the behemoth that smothers all other sports and to be frank the current schmaltzy ITV racing coverage would never have drawn me in as the - never understimate the intelligence or overestimate the knowledge coverage of Wilson and O'Sullevan - Scott and Oaksey did .
 
I've gone off the NH over the last few years as they all seem to have Cheltenham on their minds and i cant trust trainers to run their horses honestly.i think some trainers would rather have a winner at Cheltenham rather than a bigger prized race.
Willie Mullins has so many horses he can gauge how good they are and hide them away,like state man.
What chance does the punter have,only the ones in the know.
I think Paul Nicholls has realised Cheltenham isnt the be all and end all and that's why hes started so well.
On the flat we have some big hcap every other week and even then there are trainers who can afford to pass up 30g to keep them hcapped for a richer race.
They penalise trainers/jockeys / horses if they dont try and finish unplaced but what about the ones that finish 2nd or 3rd that dont try
And dont say that dont happen because it does.
What about hold up horses that shoot off into a lead or the other way round.and horses running over the wrong distance.
This is why I rely on what I see instead of studying the form.it does for me.
They should make a rule that every horse has to have at least 3 runs that season to be allowed to run at the festival.
Then we might see them more often.
 
There’s parts of that post that I disagree with (and parts I do agree with), Outsider, but the ‘qualification for Festivals’ aspect did occur to me when I was writing my earlier post…..though I felt it needed a bit too much consideration, as I was responding to the thread.

I do think it’s an interesting idea though.

The counter argument is that horses have to have run three times to qualify for handicaps anyway……and part of the enjoyment of the puzzle, is in figuring out which ones may have had their light somewhat hidden under a bushel. And it’s not beyond the realms of punters to do this. State Man did eventually go off as favourite for the County in March, as did Saint Roi the year before, and whilst it’s perhaps difficult to spot these plots miles out, the job gets easier once decs are made.

I think the real problem when it comes to ante-post betting at the Festival in particular, is the multiple entries that novices and handicappers (and even Graded horses) recieve. It’s hard to bet with much confidence, when a single Mullins novice hurdler (for example), could be entered in the Supreme, the Ballymore, the County and the Martin Pipe, and you might not know which race is being targeted, until the Sunday beforehand - and maybe not until the Tuesday.

Maybe limiting a horse to a maximum of two Festival entries, would be one way of helping fix this problem?
 
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What a difference a week makes

Constitution Hill produced that

Great novice chases and hurdles in Ireland both days and a bumper crowd at navan with the big handicap going to ordinary connections

And the mare is back next Sunday
 
I haven't connected as much with racing this year. I have watched as much as usual and am naturally looking forward to a few weeks time abut the thoughts of preview nights and twitter non stop snippets doesn't excite me and the season to date as left me a bit meh.

The cautious campaigning of a superstar in Britain combined with a lack of good horses overall and the dominance in Ireland of Closutton isn't a long term success recipie for the sport we all adore.

I don't think i'm alone on this but interested to hear your thoughts.
 
I’ve been obsessed with racing ever since Desert Orchid reignited my childhood love of it. But I can’t summon up much enthusiasm this year. I used to get really excited about Grand National weights day but it just totally passed me by this week.
 
I don't think it's fair to say there aren't any good horses. There are loads of them but 90% of them are trained in Ireland.

That said, I do think Shishkin and, before him, Altior are/were genuinely top drawer.

Hopefully the UK will also have Caldwell Potter coming through the ranks.

No doubt somebody will want to argue that the current ratings are inflated. I think Ruby W might believe so. Personally I don't. About 20 years ago they had to upgrade all the ratings (hurdles certainly, not sure about the chasers) based on the data being processed by the powers that be. I don't think they've had to do so since because the computers are keeping a daily track of the levels and ratings are being accorded more accurately.

Oh... another potential superstar is Il Est Francais but of course he is trained in France (where all the best horses nowadays seem to be bred, so what's going on there?)
 
granger said:
I haven't connected as much with racing this year. I have watched as much as usual and am naturally looking forward to a few weeks time abut the thoughts of preview nights and twitter non stop snippets doesn't excite me and the season to date as left me a bit meh.

The cautious campaigning of a superstar in Britain combined with a lack of good horses overall and the dominance in Ireland of Closutton isn't a long term success recipie for the sport we all adore.

I don't think i'm alone on this but interested to hear your thoughts.
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They are getting like Christmas decorations- put up far too early, ATR's is on the 29th Feb ffs
 
I couldn’t agree more with you. I’m getting more pleasure out of going Pointing than ever before as we’ve had really big fields recently in Wessex (no doubt due to many other areas losing fixtures due to waterlogged courses) and another bumper day promised on Sunday at Larkhill. I went to Badbury Rings last Sunday and we had 9 races, the Maiden having been split into four divisions of which 50 of the 56 entered ran. That’s literally unprecedented. Christian Horner (plus his Ginger Spice wife all decked out in her regular white ensemble.....so practical for a muddy field in the middle of Dorset!) of Red Bull fame had two runners and duly arrived in a navy helicopter. I’d had prior warning when his office rang me to ask where they could land it!

I did venture to Taunton yesterday as my “other” forum, Jumping For Fun, was sponsoring the Hunter Chase. It drew 23 entries which pleased Bob Young, the manager of Taunton as he said they’d never had so many entries for a Hunter Chase. Ten ran including former decent ex Rules horses, Lalor and Lieutenant Rocco but it was Macklin who prevailed after the other two went off a bit quick in the ground. Will Biddick who also trains Macklin sensibly sat off the pace and picked them off at the business end. It was a pretty nice performance. I’ve heard rumours of Cheltenham next for him but I’ll know more as I’m due to do an interview with Will shortly.

Will Biddick currently has a quite phenomenal strike rate with his training. This season he has run (up to yesterday) nine horses. Of those he rode eight of them. They have ALL won! The only horse that didn’t was ridden by a novice rider attached to his yard and had leg problems. These wins include two Hunter chases (Macklin and Regatta de Blanc) and the prestigious Coronation Cup at Larkhill (Regatta de Blanc). I think it’s a remarkable achievement hence my asking to do an interview with him.

Macklin is the second horse his owner, John Studd, has had with Will. The first was the now retired Porlock Bay....who obviously won the Foxhunters in 2021. Say no more!
 
We could have a national this year with half the field trained by Mullins and Elliot.
Small fields,Nrs and no bog the night before has made me lose interest.
They complain about the prize money and then there is only 3 or 4 runners for 50+ grand races.
You can't back horses with confidence in hcaps in case they are looking at Cheltenham.
I suppose that's always been the case.
I'm looking forward to Cheltenham even if I don't back a winner because its top Racing.
 
I don’t think encouraging people to blow their brains out is necessarily contributing to the thread, reet.
 
Maybe Point to Point is thriving because it’s sport with a capital S with the b in betting and business in lower case. Quite the reverse nowadays in NH racing.
 
barjon said:
Maybe Point to Point is thriving because it’s sport with a capital S with the b in betting and business in lower case. Quite the reverse nowadays in NH racing.
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I think I’d be hung out to dry by JFF if I was accused of saying pointing is thriving....it isn’t and we have plenty of problems, not least because it’s run by volunteers. I’m just very fortunate to be in the best Area (Wessex) where we seem to have some very well run meetings, backed up by quality and quantity compared to some other Areas.
 
The article was written in November 2022 but could have been written this week. Too much emphasis on Cheltenham. I haven't followed NH racing for that long relatively compared to others but the emphasis on Cheltenham has become more obvious in the 24 years I have been. The extension to 4 days hasn't helped imho. I hate Royal AScot but the same here since the inclusion of the Saturday as a 'royal' day when it was not previously I feel has not helped it. Emphasis also far too much on the pissheads and not the racing.
If Henderson is so worried about CH being injured if he's that fragile should he be running at all? If the be all and end all was not Cheltenham, and working the season back from that, possible these type of horses would be out once a month/every three weeks and if they don't like the ground would be pulled up, or out, but would be back in the next week/3 weeks/a month's time and no one would think any less of them.As said I've not followed it as along as others - remember watching Night Nurse/Rummy etc on tele - but the greatest horse I think I have ever seen was Kauto Star and I don't remember him regularly not running 'cos of bad ground or any other reason. The only time I remember him not running was with top weight at Newbury in the Hennessy and I was absolutely fine with that as knew it wouldn't be too long before he would appear. ( I don't need to corrected on that, it it's wrong, it's wrong but that's my recollection). My point is he ran on all grounds and ran more times than he did not.
 
jinnyj said:
I think I’d be hung out to dry by JFF if I was accused of saying pointing is thriving....it isn’t and we have plenty of problems, not least because it’s run by volunteers. I’m just very fortunate to be in the best Area (Wessex) where we seem to have some very well run meetings, backed up by quality and quantity compared to some other Areas.
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I stand corrected :D, but the main point still stands doesn’t it? You don’t kow tow to the bookies in designing your programme, for example.
 
In terms of mustering enthusiasm, I'm not sure I muster much most years unless there is something I fancy really strongly and that's not all that often in the big scheme of things.

Rooster Booster in 2003, definitely, Vicente in the NHC a few years back (could have won with a better ride, imo), Our Connor, Altior, Shishkin and C Hill probably the ones that come to mind.

This year the one I've been looking forward to most is Salvador Ziggy in the NHC but it's not on the same scale as some of the above.

It's probably because the Irish racing through the season leaves me cold. Two or three stables dominating the better races, the vast majority at short prices, and McManus picking up the scraps in the handicaps. I really only watch the DRF, some of the Christmas meeting at Leopardstown and the major handicaps and tend only to bet in the latter.

Still, once it's upon us, Mrs O becomes a widow for ten days, starting at the five-day dec stage for the Tuesday racing through to the Midlands National on the Saturday, and almost every race, including the awful X-Country, Bumper, mares' races and Hunters', is worth watching.

And now and then you get a day like the Golden Thursday a few years back when all seems right with the world.
 
There are probably too many graded races in Ireland. This has a few effects. Big clashes can inevitably not happen and it is easier for top stables to be dominant as they can target other grade 1's and spread out a wider pool of horses.

I look at every jumps race in Ireland and weekend racing in the UK, so i could not argue that my interest has waned. I think we are arriving quicker than expected possibly (it has been forecast) at a saturation of racing and too much focus on everything 4 days in March
 
Grasshopper said:
I don’t know how practical that is, barjon, given bookmakers probably sponsor 90+% of races.
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Yes, that gives them the whip hand to the detriment of the sport. Like the capital B in business - I doubt that Cheltenham stuck on the extra day because they thought it was in the best interests of the sport?
 
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