Not So Glorious Goodwood

Bar the Bull

Bar the Bull

At the Start
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May 2, 2003
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Glorious Goodwood is usually my fourth favourite southern UK flat meeting of the summer.

Not this year, though.

The racing in prospect does not set my pulse racing like a bacon double cheeseburger would.

I know we are all meant to be excited about seeing Frankel, but do we really need to see another 1/10 romp against outclassed opposition. For me it is an obstacle he needs to overcome before he steps out of his comfort zone.

I am hoping we see Snow Fairy in the Nassau Stakes, because otherwise we are meant to get excited about whichever horse John Gosden elects for a lap of honour.

It doesn't appear that any of the top 2yo's are being aimed at Goodwood.

There will probably be some good handicaps.
 
If you can't get excited about watching a horse like Frankel run then you'd probably be better off taking up golf...
 
When did a good 2yo ever run at Goodwood? It's a horrible track where the best horse usually gets beat.
 
Shamardal in the Vintage? Had a Breeders Cup Juvenile winner in second that year as well.
 
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Bar the Bull said:
Glorious Goodwood is usually my fourth favourite southern UK flat meeting of the summer.

Not this year, though.

The racing in prospect does not set my pulse racing like a bacon double cheeseburger would.

I know we are all meant to be excited about seeing Frankel, but do we really need to see another 1/10 romp against outclassed opposition. For me it is an obstacle he needs to overcome before he steps out of his comfort zone.

I am hoping we see Snow Fairy in the Nassau Stakes, because otherwise we are meant to get excited about whichever horse John Gosden elects for a lap of honour.

It doesn't appear that any of the top 2yo's are being aimed at Goodwood.

There will probably be some good handicaps.
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first of all
cheeseburguer with bacon is not the food for gourmet people

Frankel
he outclass any horse he faces
the only 3 difficult cahllenges he would have would be:
Black Caviar at her best over 3 1/2 f
Cirrus in top form on heavy ground over 12f
and Orfevre over 12f+
other than that he would canter any field


Snow Fairy is good but Nassau does not look a bad race
Radysina, Giofra , The Fugue and company are not a bad edition

2yo
always good 2yo run in the meeting



the season is being eclipse by the rain but once the weather comes good the level will improve
 
Bar the Bull said:
I never said it is. Scaramanga, Realadrid are a wonderful football team. But I wouldn't be queueing up to see them play Doncaster Rovers.
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Would you rather they played some other team at netball then BtB?

It's laughable. sir Henry has the best miler I and many others have ever seen yet he gets dogs abuse on virtually every internet forum for not stepping the horse up in distance. This despite the fact he has actually promised to step the horse up at some point this season.

I wonder if the same critics grew tired off Kauto Star winning Gold Cups and expected him to take on flat horses over a mile to prove his credibility. Or perhaps they howl in derision because Fame and Glory's trainer hasn't had the nerve to run the horse over a stiff six furlongs.

The horse is a MILER. If there isn't a horse to challenge him over a mile it is because Frankel is simply too brilliant. Most racing fans are happy to celebrate that fact, not constantly snipe at the trainer or accuse the horse of being boring!
 
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I have been lucky enough to see Frankel twice Scaramanga and it was breathtaking both time. However I to look forward to seeing him step up in trip, it's only natural I suppose that we take his dominance over a mile for granted now and that we are impatient to see him over further.
 
bloodnok said:
I have been lucky enough to see Frankel twice Scaramanga and it was breathtaking both time. However I to look forward to seeing him step up in trip, it's only natural I suppose that we take his dominance over a mile for granted now and that we are impatient to see him over further.
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You and me both bloodnok. I've booked my remaining holiday leave to coincide with the Juddmonte and I'm praying that's where Sir Henry steps him up. If he never extended the horse beyond a mile though I would be happy to accept his informed opinion. Why should he risk the horse's unbeaten record if he were to genuinely believe a mile is his limit?

It looks for all the world to me that Frankel will breeze 10 furlongs, however I'm happy to accept Sir Henry's judgement over any number of armchair experts on internet forums.
 
BTW Just to clarify I'm making these points generally. Not directing them at BtB. It was just that his original point appeared to allude to the notion that seeing Frankel run over a mile again would not be exciting. I could watch the horse galloping on his own and enjoy it. He is thoroughbred perfection.
 
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Scaramanga said:
I wonder if the same critics grew tired off Kauto Star winning Gold Cups and expected him to take on flat horses over a mile to prove his credibility. Or perhaps they howl in derision because Fame and Glory's trainer hasn't had the nerve to run the horse over a stiff six furlongs.
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I actually agree with your general point, but surely Kauto Star is a particularly poor reinforcement of it?

Kauto Star won from 2m to 3m2f in top class company. Using your (not particularly relevant) comparison, if he were a flat horse he would have ran in the July Cup, the QEII and the Arc. And he would have them all.
 
Scaramanga said:
You and me both bloodnok. I've booked my remaining holiday leave to coincide with the Juddmonte and I'm praying that's where Sir Henry steps him up. If he never extended the horse beyond a mile though I would be happy to accept his informed opinion. Why should he risk the horse's unbeaten record if he were to genuinely believe a mile is his limit?

It looks for all the world to me that Frankel will breeze 10 furlongs, however I'm happy to accept Sir Henry's judgement over any number of armchair experts on internet forums.
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Fingers crossed for the Juddmonte then. I fully agree that Cecil's decision must be respected and that just seeing him run at all is something to be appreciated. I just think is would be a shame if we did not see him run against some top notch 1m2f and dare I say it mile and a half horses! Unbeaten records are fine and dandy but it's competition that makes the sport I feel.

That is not to say that him staying at a mile would tarnish his greatness in my book, any more than it would were he to get beat over further.
 
trackside528 said:
I actually agree with your general point, but surely Kauto Star is a particularly poor reinforcement of it?

Kauto Star won from 2m to 3m2f in top class company. Using your (not particularly relevant) comparison, if he were a flat horse he would have ran in the July Cup, the QEII and the Arc. And he would have them all.
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The whole point was to illustrate the old maxim 'horses for courses'. If you don't like that example then feel free to supplement your own.
 
bloodnok said:
Fingers crossed for the Juddmonte then. I fully agree that Cecil's decision must be respected and that just seeing him run at all is something to be appreciated. I just think is would be a shame if we did not see him run against some top notch 1m2f and dare I say it mile and a half horses! Unbeaten records are fine and dandy but it's competition that makes the sport I feel.

That is not to say that him staying at a mile would tarnish his greatness in my book, any more than it would were he to get beat over further.
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I only want to see him run over trips he gets Blooknok. IMO there isn't an animal drawing breath that can beat this horse at the distances he excels at. I can see no merit whatsoever in Sir Henry running him 'out of his comfort zone'.

I'm convinced he'll step up two furlongs at least and remain unrivalled. Finding out will be the pinnacle of the flat season for me.
 
That is not to say that him staying at a mile would tarnish his greatness in my book, any more than it would were he to get beat over further.
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It wouldn't tarnish his greatness, but it would place it within limits
 
Grey said:
It wouldn't tarnish his greatness, but it would place it within limits
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You see I honestly don't get that viewpoint? Of course the horse has a 'limit'. That was the point I was trying to make about Kauto Star. You might as well say he had limits because he was only a jumps horse and not able to contest flat races. :confused:
 
Scaramanga said:
If you don't like that example then feel free to supplement your own.
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I think Denman would be a far more apt comparison at this stage.

I have no qualms with the way Cecil has campaigned Frankel (in fairness, I doubt Bar does either). For all that I understand perfectly well why they won't do it, I'd love to see Frankel step back in trip to 6f. Were they to throw caution to the wind and unleash him for the 6f race on Champions Day on (presumably) his last start, I think he would blow the hinges off the place.
 
I don't have a massive problem with keeping him over a mile either.

Horses for courses and all that.

But I am not excited about him taking on horses a stone or more inferior with no variables against him.

If I was going to Goodwood I would maybe be excited.
 
At present Frankel is a great miler. Even a very great one. Can he show a greater range?

I think he will have no problem displaying the same greatness at 10f but it's not proven yet. There is also a good chance he could win top races at even 12f but that is much more speculative.

But for the time being he is a miler only.
 
trackside528 said:
I think Denman would be a far more apt comparison at this stage.

I have no qualms with the way Cecil has campaigned Frankel (in fairness, I doubt Bar does either). For all that I understand perfectly well why they won't do it, I'd love to see Frankel step back in trip to 6f. Were they to throw caution to the wind and unleash him for the 6f race on Champions Day on (presumably) his last start, I think he would blow the hinges off the place.
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I make you right there. It would be easy to imagine his optimum trip actually being 6/7 furlongs.
 
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