Novice Chasers 2012-13

He will have a lot of miles on the clock, too.

Pretty sure there have been a few Arkle winners aged 8...Moscow Flyer and Sizing Europe and I think Lord Noelie was 8 when he won the RSA chase.

But none of those horses had many miles on the clock when they won their novice championships; well compared to Overturn anyway.
 
Overturn doesn't really strike me as the kind to take to fences let alone improve for them (as Arkle types invariably do) and is usually the type of horse I would be looking to take on in novice chases. However, word from the yard last year was that he'd been schooling really well over them so he just may be one to keep an eye on.
 
My way de solzen was pretty old when he won the Arkle... Can't remember how old though without looking. Overturn is not a horse i'd be backing for novice chases, looks all over a hurdler to me.
 
Too old and too small to be starting a chase career now. He's the best dual purpose horse around so let him do what he does best.
 
A few observations from Kim Bailey on his website today and ones which most trainers will have to adopt to.

October 1st is just around the corner and the first day of entries for the new novice chase rules; there are immediate problems.

Sedgefield has removed its Beginners chase and novice handicap chase and replaced it with a handicap and a bumper; they quite entitled to as there is a 20% reduction of novice chases this season.

Newton Abbot on the same day (Tuesday) has a straight novice chase and the entries include Hinterland a 141 rated hurdler of Paul Nicholls. Nothing wrong with that but it does mean under the new rules that if you have a 100 rated hurdler you have to take him on to qualify to be able to use you hurdle rating over fences next time; it certainly makes for competitive racing?

My dilemma, which is the same as most trainers, bar perhaps Paul Nicholls, Nicky Henderson and Philip Hobbs is that I don't have many hurdlers rated 120 or above to go chasing.

In the past I have used their hurdle rating to run in novice or handicap chases and try and win with them, rather than have a run run behind a horse rated over 20 lbs higher.

South Stack who has won 3 hurdle races this summer is schooled and ready to run over fences, but again off 105 there are no races for him now, so he has to run in a novice against horses far superior.

The down side is that he takes and needs 5 weeks between races to do his best; so to be able to use his hurdle rating he has to have one pointless run in 10 weeks to comply to the new rules.. Can you imagine how happy his owners are at paying training fees for that long for no reason.. South Stack will now have to stay over hurdles sadly.
 
Those remarks from Kim Bailey are interesting.

Generally speaking the incentive structure in NH racing should be in favour of horses going chasing if they are up to it. The example given suggests the new rules might work against that. On the other hand, is it not better that a horse's first few runs over fences have to be in novice company?
 
Was told Present Lodger going to start off in bumpers but don't understand that at all. Presently campaigning for a change of heart on that one.
 
Bar the Bull said:
Pretty sure there have been a few Arkle winners aged 8...Moscow Flyer and Sizing Europe...
But none of those horses had many miles on the clock when they won their novice championships...
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My updated stats on the Arkle read:

6yos and 7yos do well (winning 15 of the past 21 renewals). 5yos no longer have the 5lb allowance they used to receive so are unlikely to do as well as in the past. Six winners aged over 7 in the past 30 renewals and two in the past 20 (Moscow Flyer and Sizing Europe).

Bobsline 8
Boreen Prince 8
Danish Flight 9
Comandante 8
Moscow Flyer 8
Sizing Europe 8
 
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Winning trainer Charles Byrnes said of the Davy Russell-ridden Gigginstown House Stud-owned Sea Of Thunder: "The ground is everything to him and it won't be easy for him to get that ground again. He might go to Cheltenham now in November. Three miles on good ground is what he wants, he has no business going on soft ground."
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...you might have thought with a name like Sea Of Thunder he wouldn't have minded a bit of cut.:D
 
On The Bridle said:
Boreen Prince - should have won the Gold Cup the same year - now there was a horse...
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A good old stick. They don’t seem to make em like that these days. He did indeed turn out in the Gold Cup a couple of days after beating future Champion Chase winner Buck House in the Arkle. Did well to be competitive in the Gold Cup too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERpTgaSnQrY
 
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As a 14 year old I remember having a double max on Boreen Prince for the Arkle. Wasn't often that a 50pence piece went over the counter in those days.
 
Aragorn said:
Wasn't that often 14yo's were placing bets either was it? :ninja:
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All the guys I go to Cheltenham with started punting at an early age and are still standing after 30 years.The has been some spectacular self destructs on the fringes of the group but strangely enough I think starting out doing ten and twenty pence bets for years was a good apprenticeship.
 
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