Paris Shootings

clivex said:
It's the Internet. They couldn't communicate before 1990 or whenever, in the same way
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That's certainly a big factor, but then they didn't have the internet in 1936, or the travel opportunities, and yet intenrational brigadists came from all over the world (about 5000 from North America - who were duly arrested on their return with many ending up having to serve prison sentances)

I'm not necessarily disputing your assertion that they'll find something to pin their cause on, only that the Iraq war has made that job much easier than it would have been, as other vehicles would have been a harder sell. I think it's this which has helped increase the scale.

OK it's tempting to post something pithy about naked men being dragged around on the floor on a dog leash by women, but I'll resist!. The bottom line is that if you were a islamist recruiter you could barely ask for a better image to use in order to convince impressionable young men just what an uncivilised and dreadful people you were being asked to help eliminate from the world in the name of Allah's will could you?

Having said that, there are other terrorist causes around the world that went into decline during the internet age too
 
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There were thousands going to Afghanistan to train with aq before 9/11. And plenty from the west too. Probably more than we are seeing now. They didnt need Iraq did they?

one thing we do agree on is that Afghanistan was unavoidable and it beggars belief that some still believe that we should have sat on our hands. Can anyone imagine how strong aq would be now and how much carnage they would have unleashed if they had a full state backing? The weapons they could have obtained? Not one alternative other than action has ever been seriously suggested by the stop the war idiots and their fellow travellerstravellers
 
clivex said:
As an aside I read today that amid khan feels he's more british than farage. Too right he is I reckon. But I recall a French footballer (petit? ) remarking how in the english dressing rooms the black players always considered themselves to be completely english whereas in France it was less that way (well not english but you know what I mean) . Its a bit like the USA, assimilation seems to perhaps work just that bit better?
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Correct. Bizarre, i had an argument with someone about this last night. He feels the majority of the blame is with the French state.
 
Grasshopper said:
It's an incorrect assumption, rather than a "fair" one, Kotki.
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Is it necessary to address current users on one forum with usernames associated with usernames from years gone by? Just wondering...

If so shouldn't you do this for everyone you suspect of formerly being someone else?

Or do you save this compliment for a set few? :)
 
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I don't suspect - I know.

If Kotki is upset about it, he hasn't said anything, and he knows he is at liberty to correct me on the matter, if he feels he needs to.

I don't see it's any of your business anyway.
 
It's just an annoyance, for me personally, whilst reading the guff....:)
 
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It's not whether Kotki is upset, it's clique-y - same as those who call Maruco Paul and Grey Art.
 
clivex said:
There were thousands going to Afghanistan to train with aq before 9/11. And plenty from the west too.
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Not sure about that

Thousands from the middle east and arab world yes, but I'd be a lot more reluctant to attribute those numbers to westerners. For instance only ten Brits were detained at Guantanamo which is well short of the 600 currently estimated to have had Syrian involvement in what has so far at least, been a much shorter duration campaign. It's also worth noting that the origins of the Taleban in particular came out of resistance to the Soviet Union. The west were more than happy to supply at this point
 
Warbler said:
Not sure about that


Thousands from the middle east and arab world yes, but I'd be a lot more reluctant to attribute those numbers to westerners. For instance only ten Brits were detained at Guantanamo which is well short of the 600 currently estimated to have had Syrian involvement in what has so far at least, been a much shorter duration campaign. It's also worth noting that the origins of the Taleban in particular came out of resistance to the Soviet Union. The west were more than happy to supply at this point
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Warbler, I honestly do think that you are trying too hard to find an association between western foreign policy and the root cause of the horrors being committed by ISIS and Alky Aida.
Their "reason" for what they do is hatred for all things western and liberal. Their mission is to kill everyone who is not "with them" -- Christians, Yazidi's, Jews, atheists. To destroy the world and then to create a global caliphate. They are fanatical death cults. Whatever interventions the West may have made in Muslim land is really not a driver of their actions. The Mahdist's of the 1880's in Sudan/Egypt were slaughtering on an industrial scale in the name of Allah -- long before any recent western incursions.
They hate you not for what you have done; they hate you for what you are.
 
Grasshopper said:
Aye.....me and Kotki in a clique of two......get a grip, FFS.
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If you want to have a conversation with him directly, then use whatever name you like. Seeing as you're in the middle of a messageboard, wouldnt you think it would be a good idea to use his username so we all know who you're talking to?
 
icebreaker said:
Warbler, I honestly do think that you are trying too hard to find an association between western foreign policy and the root cause of the horrors being committed by ISIS and Alky Aida.
Their "reason" for what they do is hatred for all things western and liberal. Their mission is to kill everyone who is not "with them" -- Christians, Yazidi's, Jews, atheists. To destroy the world and then to create a global caliphate. They are fanatical death cults. Whatever interventions the West may have made in Muslim land is really not a driver of their actions. The Mahdist's of the 1880's in Sudan/Egypt were slaughtering on an industrial scale in the name of Allah -- long before any recent western incursions.
They hate you not for what you have done; they hate you for what you are.
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Exactly. There really is a lack of understanding about what they are about. Its not as if they are shy telling us is it?

I'm also sick of hearing about the arming of the taleban. So what. It was a mistake and we are where we are.
 
Hamm said:
If you want to have a conversation with him directly, then use whatever name you like. Seeing as you're in the middle of a messageboard, wouldnt you think it would be a good idea to use his username so we all know who you're talking to?
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I've consciously never referred to anyone by their real name. Not that i want to know them anyway.
 
We know how to make a drama out of nothing on this board, don't we.

Hamm, when it was established that 'Bachelors Hall' was an old contact from my time on TRF, I made it perfectly clear I would use the name I originally knew him by (Kotkijet)..in much the same way as I would prefer to call you 'Hamm' if our paths didn't cross for several years, only to reconnect further down the line, when you went by a different nom-de-plume.

Call it a mark of respect on my part, if you will......something I also extend to the limited number of Forumites that I have had the pleasure to meet off-Matrix, by sometimes using their Christian name.

If BH had expressed a desire for me to use his new moniker, I would of course have complied. But he didn't, and seems quite happy for me to use his old TRF handle. I concede that it might be confusing to a degree, but this really only applies if you are a most heinous simpleton - which you aren't, so you have very little to worry about.

If Kotki doesn't like it, I will correct. Until then, you can fu*cking lump it.

I hope his clears matters up. :)
 
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And I think the username "Hamm" is very offensive towards Muslims -- even with a second "m".
It is a username dhosen and clearly designed to be provocative -- knowing full well that pork products are anathema to Muslims.
Disgraceful.
 
I had it down as egregious Jew-baiting myself, but I see where you're coming from, ice.

Bleedin' outrageous, it is.....or isn't.
 
icebreaker said:
And I think the username "Hamm" is very offensive towards Muslims -- even with a second "m".
It is a username dhosen and clearly designed to be provocative -- knowing full well that pork products are anathema to Muslims.
Disgraceful.
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The only two people, it seems,on this board who know where my username comes from are Clive and Grey.
 
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