Prince of Wales's Stakes

Anyone who thinks Yeats will beat Patkai wants to seriously start thinking. Tartan Bearer found out by the trip, but major boost for Patkai and Tajaweed later in the week.

Tazeez and Twice Over have run really good races here.

Was an entertaining race.
 
Galileo said:
Why is it that any time you someone supports a favourite you are opposing they are "lemmings" or "blind faith" or "mugs"....his run behind New Approach is the single best piece of form in my book, goes on the ground, bred to improve with time etc. Granted he might get beat but he was more than fair claims for people to latch on to.
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I wouldn't have said that if he'd been 2s or something. Money came for MCM yesterday but I wouldn't have called that mug money because he was justifiably an even money shot.

Vision was the only 10f Group 1 winner in that race and for me they should have been joint favourites.

I was the mug yesterday for backing Gladiatorius, you have to go with the animal who looks likely to be best suited to the conditions on the day.
 
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Tazeez ran ok in the circumstances, back at Newmarket he'll be hard to beat. Shame the Champion Stakes isn't 1m1f.
 
Flame said:
Anyone who thinks Yeats will beat Patkai wants to seriously start thinking. Tartan Bearer found out by the trip, but major boost for Patkai and Tajaweed later in the week.

Tazeez and Twice Over have run really good races here.

Was an entertaining race.
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After seeing Patkai get beaten by Geordieland last time (outstayed?) I am not too bothered what Patkai is doing against 10 furlong animals at home. If he was genuinely beating the likes of Tartan Bearer on merit, then he should be running in these races not the Gold Cup!
 
Never wins by much, does he? Dangerous horse if he's pitched in against the 3yos over 10f, could be one of those who'll pull out just enough.
 
Patkai wasn't expected to win last time Galileo, he had been eased off after the run at Ascot (had just over 2 weeks of steady canters and on walker, never done more than a swinging canter) and was left short so he would improve for the run. He also lost a shoe just before the furlong pole which was kept rather quiet. Ryan eased him off late on and wasn't a fair reflection of the margin.

Patkai weren't stopping at the end of 2m here last year and loves Ascot. I wouldn't look into the run at Sandown, Patkai has been trained for the Gold Cup, not a trial and has really blossomed since that last run. Geordieland won't get near him tomorrow.
 
Flame said:
Patkai wasn't expected to win last time Galileo, he had been eased off after the run at Ascot (had just over 2 weeks of steady canters and on walker, never done more than a swinging canter) and was left short so he would improve for the run. He also lost a shoe just before the furlong pole which was kept rather quiet. Ryan eased him off late on and wasn't a fair reflection of the margin.

Patkai weren't stopping at the end of 2m here last year and loves Ascot. I wouldn't look into the run at Sandown, Patkai has been trained for the Gold Cup, not a trial and has really blossomed since that last run. Geordieland won't get near him tomorrow.
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Pakti has beaten trees every time he has gone to Ascot. For a horse not fancied he went off a strong odds on shot on the night..for a horse not fully fit Moore committed him a long way from home. Only chance he has of beating Yeats is if the great horse is off peak...but I guess thats for another thread.
 
EC1 said:
it was all over betfair forum and teh RP reporter page..and announced at the course..thats why it drifted

thought i were doing you a favour posting it
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You were in fairness, but I went in again at 6.6 anyway. I was tilting after Lush Lashes got beat. Poor punting really.
 
I'm glad I missed your post, EC1. It would definitely have put me off having a bet. He drifted to 11.0 in running, I think.
 
10f horse, no Arc for me


About today

good ride by Peslier
unbelievable price for a horse fitting the trends and the one was going to be more suited by the conditions of the race.
 
Flame said:
Patkai wasn't expected to win last time Galileo, he had been eased off after the run at Ascot (had just over 2 weeks of steady canters and on walker, never done more than a swinging canter) and was left short so he would improve for the run.
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I'm sure Sir Michael would be delighted to hear that you are plastering all over a public forum that he deliberately left a horse of his short before running him in a Group 2 race he was odds on favourite for and thus didn't expect him to win.

Great to see the BHA are really clamping down on the 'inside information' rules - jeez, they spend fortunes on paper and postage sending leaflets, letters and posters to owners, trainers and stable staff yet here's Flame merrily posting up all the inside information for all the world to see!
 
Shadow Leader said:
I'm sure Sir Michael would be delighted to hear that you are plastering all over a public forum that he deliberately left a horse of his short before running him in a Group 2 race he was odds on favourite for and thus didn't expect him to win.

Great to see the BHA are really clamping down on the 'inside information' rules - jeez, they spend fortunes on paper and postage sending leaflets, letters and posters to owners, trainers and stable staff yet here's Flame merrily posting up all the inside information for all the world to see!
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Its a bit like saying Denman was not fully wound up at Kempton....
 
Shadow Leader said:
I'm sure Sir Michael would be delighted to hear that you are plastering all over a public forum that he deliberately left a horse of his short before running him in a Group 2 race he was odds on favourite for and thus didn't expect him to win.

Great to see the BHA are really clamping down on the 'inside information' rules - jeez, they spend fortunes on paper and postage sending leaflets, letters and posters to owners, trainers and stable staff yet here's Flame merrily posting up all the inside information for all the world to see!
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Hardly inside info when the horse doesn't do a serious gallop for two weeks therefore leaving it short ????

Anyone who want's to regularly go up and watch horses work can come to the same assessment. It's not private grounds and anyone can watch work, make their own decisions.

Also he stated in the post before the race, in the Racing Post may I add, that the comment was of the following, "he's not done a lot since Ascot but he's a good horse and this should put him spot on for the Gold Cup".

From that I can draw my own conclusion that a lack of a gallop or two and knowing this was a competitive race that he may be found out, but a lot of trainers wouldn't have horses 110% for a trial, that is fact.

The horse ran on merit and got beat, but not working seriously in between would have had an effect in my own eyes.

Today however you state Lock Linnhe would be aimed at the Sussex after the Jersey, prior to entries being out, a clear display that someone has stated to you that it was it's aim, that is no different in regards to info and is divulging inside info as clearly you have been told that the horse is being aimed at a said race.
 
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Flame, you posted it yourself as though it was inside information you are receiving yourself, same as you do with most things you post up about horses! I know the Channon stuff is freely available on their website though.
 
Merely stating my opinion Shadow from what I have seen and from what contacts who I work closely with (certain gallop watchers and journalists) have also seen and been told either on track and that. If I see a horse work bad I will say, same as I would say if one works well. But it's my own perception and regardless to whether I am a good judge or a bad one, it's my opinion of how I see things and look at them.

Seeing certain horses week in week out and then not seeing them for a while can determine that a horse would have been eased off and so forth and I will state that.

I don't write I have been told this, or told that, neither do I say I've had a whisper for this and a whisper for that. I will state stuff as I see on horses galloping or from racing or from the odd message picked up from a fellow work watcher and so on.

Occasionally a trainer may tell you something or an owner and occasionally a lad. No one is doing it for any reward or any intent. If you see a horse gallop and you say to the trainer that went nicely any plans ?, some will not tell you and others will say Im looking at a maiden in 2 weeks at Newbury. They know what you do and have a choice of what they say.

The fact is I think the fact there are people willing to state openly about certain aspects of work and that has led to trainers being a lot more open given they know that if they don't say something someone will.

Having seen Riggins come up the trotting ground and not work and go home, I was able to speak to someone who contacted Cumani who was told it wouldn't run in the HC. I then put on here, knowing a story had already been submitted to the post.

Personally feel when people are more open it leads to a better environment and makes the game a lot fairer and straighter.
 
Forgive me, Flame. I thought you prided yourself on the information provided by your contacts. You must clock up some mileage going to Newmarket so often from Somerset to do all your gallop watching!
 
Like I said I go up now and again, 3 - 4 times a month. I also stated I work with other work watchers, who send me their findings on a weekly basis which is very helpful. I sometimes watch some horses around here and we swap gallops we have. If I haven't seen it or one of my men haven't seen it, I won't write about it. End of the day the majority of the gallops seen by work watchers are in the Weekender every Wednesday so it's not as if the public can't get access to it if they don't want to.

I probably would know all of about 5 or 6 people (mainly trainers whom I know, or an owner with horses in a yard) connected to yards and none of them would really tell you anything about their horses. I would rarely listen to a stable lad tbh as one thing I learn't the hard way is 99.9% of stable lads wouldn't know a good horse if it hit them in the face and by backing so called tips you hear from lads at races never win. If they knew the ins and outs they wouldn't be working in racing.
 
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