The Camelot Hype Thread

In fairness to O'Brien, he runs a very large and expensive operation. The pressure on him must be enormous. Even keeping the horses safe must be a challenge. In the same interview, he says he has just bought the scariest tiger in the world to scare off would-be intruders.

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I think the "best ever" stuff started with Vincent..i seem to remember Pat Eddery ..never one for coming out with that stuff..joined VOB..won the Derby...jumped off Golden Fleece and said he was best he had ever ridden...i think thats was the first time i heard that tbh.

I miss the "he's got speed for a July Cup" one..seems to have packed that one in..wish he'd start it up again..my fav that one is
 
Pat Eddery got badly stung when describing 1978 Wood Ditton winner Leonardo Da Vinci as "the best I have ridden".He won one more race.He kept his powder dry for the most part afterwards bar GF as you say EC1.
M J Kinane when asked about the relative merit of Azamour Irish Champion Stks 04 replied that he "does not do politics anymore".
I am waiting for a horse to be described as a "Jady B*****d", a Funny Old F****r" or "Lairy Lazy Lad".
Camelot is a Legend. Then again, he always was.
 
edgt said:
Pat Eddery got badly stung when describing 1978 Wood Ditton winner Leonardo Da Vinci as "the best I have ridden".He won one more race.He kept his powder dry for the most part afterwards bar GF as you say EC1.
M J Kinane when asked about the relative merit of Azamour Irish Champion Stks 04 replied that he "does not do politics anymore".
I am waiting for a horse to be described as a "Jady B*****d", a Funny Old F****r" or "Lairy Lazy Lad".
Camelot is a Legend. Then again, he always was.
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you are right..leonado da vinci..blast from the past..he got stung real bad saying that was the best..

i think only working for VOB could have got him to say it again..its how the the breeding game works really isn't it?..AOB plays the game..its his job to bullshit a bit...i just ignore him tbh..seems a nice bloke..but he is full of it
 
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Like I said everyone does this every season. It’s a transparent attempt to boost stud value. AOB has more pressure to do this than most due to Coolmore. Dettori reckons he rides the best horse ever every other season. I don’t know anyone with a vested concern in the industry who says his horse might not be quite as good as one that died last year. A dead horse is not worth hyping.
 
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Bar the Bull said:
I don't know what to think. There are three possible answers to this conundrum:

Camelot is better than Hawk Wing, Galileo, Giant's Causeway, Rock of Gibraltar, Yeats, So You Think, etc.

Aidan O'Brien is making a mistake.

Aidan O'Brien is a big fat liar.

What do you guys think?
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I think you have to take into account Ladbrokes' view on his chances going into his races. They have ties with the yard and constantly ducked him big style before his races. They clearly had good information about this horse's ability.

He won the Guineas off a moderate ride. He won the Derby despite hating the track and only getting into top gear late in the day, again arguably off a less than inspired ride (although in mitigation the course might have been an important factor in his positioning).

He lost the Leger to an inspired ride by the winning jockey. On another day he might have won the race by five lengths.

He might have left the Arc behind at Doncaster but losing three shoes in the race couldn't possibly have helped his cause.

I think he is/was clearly a top class horse in a very moderate year. If he stays in training he might go on to show he's the real deal.

I don't believe AOB is the type to be far wrong or to tell big fat lies so, of the options offered, I ahve to side with the first but would prefer if 'none of the above' was an option too.
 
he got outspeeded by a boat in the leger and was never going to have the speed for an arc..you have to have tactical speed to win and he doesn't have gears

he has met his elders once..and fell well short
 
edgt said:
M J Kinane when asked about the relative merit of Azamour Irish Champion Stks 04 replied that he "does not do politics anymore".
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Kinane was happy to extoll the greatness of Sea The Stars, although that was easy seeing as he was about to retire and it was patently true anyway.
 
EC1 said:
he got outspeeded by a boat in the leger and was never going to have the speed for an arc
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I'm intrigued by this. Whilst it would appear to be patently true on the basis of the 2 races in question, I also seem to recall there being a rather extended debate post-Guineas about how he had won that race by showing a burst of speed which then, in some peoples minds, indicated that he may have too much speed for the Derby.

Both statements appear to be true, yet they are mutually exclusive. Which is interesting.
 
could be a few explanations Simmo

.it could be that he is just a lot better than the 3yo's he has met and they made him look quick in the guineas

he may have lost the edge throughout the season..although he's hardly been over raced

he has a temperament issue as displayed in the leger..head up..wouldn't run on under pressure

maybe he doesn't like racing now..could be he remembers the Irish Derby ..he definately disliked that experience.
 
Just look at the form from all his races and what he's beat says everything.

Sea the stars look at the form of the horses he beat says everything.

Frankel look at the form of the horses he has beat.

Only one option....now what is it!
 
SteveM is spot on - Coolmore are all about making stallions and if they can use AOB's quote when marketing the horse, that's what its all about. The old cliches come out time and time again and will continue to do so. The majority of people in the industry don't pay any attention, but there will be those that do and if it secures an extra nomination or two, then job done.
 
Most punters ignore the best ever comments now, surely breeders do too? they cant be that susceptible can they?

I reckon he will put in a good one next year when everything falls right (if he isnt totally soured by that irish derby run, which i suspect he might be)but 'best evers' dont need perfect scenarios every time
 
aha jinny sort of answered that. But the obvious downside is that when you do have a "best ever" eventually, the informed breeders will shrug their shoulders
 
NAME THAT HORSE! Four from the Coolmore catalogue of the 1980s pre APOBrien
1. The fastest horse in Europe; The most versatile horse in The World!

2. " A Truly Magnificent Specimen. His jockey carson was equally impressed: "He can do better than that...this is the best two year old colt I've ever ridden" 11/09/1982.

3.Such was his speed that Lester wanted to (come out of retirement) ride him in the 2000Gns.

4. "This is the best sprinter I've had since Thatching" said MVO'Brien. "He is a very good horse indeed"
 
Desert Orchid said:
I think you have to take into account Ladbrokes' view on his chances going into his races. They have ties with the yard and constantly ducked him big style before his races. They clearly had good information about this horse's ability.

He won the Guineas off a moderate ride. He won the Derby despite hating the track and only getting into top gear late in the day, again arguably off a less than inspired ride (although in mitigation the course might have been an important factor in his positioning).

He lost the Leger to an inspired ride by the winning jockey. On another day he might have won the race by five lengths.

He might have left the Arc behind at Doncaster but losing three shoes in the race couldn't possibly have helped his cause.

I think he is/was clearly a top class horse in a very moderate year. If he stays in training he might go on to show he's the real deal.

I don't believe AOB is the type to be far wrong or to tell big fat lies so, of the options offered, I ahve to side with the first but would prefer if 'none of the above' was an option too.
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They "ducked" him for the Derby because they were up to their bollicks on him at 16/1. I'll leave it to your imagination to work out who played before the Racing Post Trophy. They left him out of the Guineas betting for ages on the basis of that. As we all know the Guineas fell apart as a race and punters kept scratching around looking for one to back against him. Ladbrokes were 5/4 the morning of the race when 2/1 was available. If that's not ducking one than the term means nothing anymore.

Also I heard Derrick Smith tried to get £20k on Canelot with William Hill at 2/1 and was offered £1,000 @ 7/4.

Having said all that it made sense to keep him onside in his own age group because the rest of them were hopeless.
 
EC1 said:
I think the "best ever" stuff started with Vincent..
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Piggott certainly said it about Try My Best - "He could be the best I've ever ridden, says Lester..." (or words to that effect) was the front page headline in the Sporting Life on the day of the 1978 Two Thousand Guineas in which the horse finished stone last.
 
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