Arc 2010

Right decision to throw Planteur out as his pacemaker carried everything wide - personally think Lellouche etc. dropped a clanger using PA as a pacemaker in a race where he had proven stamina and little to find with a couple of the principles and duly backed him, that's racing as they say.

Great day out and amazing to see my first Arc and first trip to Longchamp, impressed with Workforce's turn of foot and Misty For Me's at around the 200m mark also.
 
I'd like to see pacemakers banned forever from these contests, and I really would like to see some harsh penalties imposed on jockeys - you know, like a 3 to 6 month ban - when they cause such serious interference. I felt at one point we were lucky not to see some riders hit the deck in the middle of the pack, or a couple BD, which would be a damn disgrace. I just want to see horses running on true merits, not being sent out to spoil the day for others - especially not considering what's been invested in them and by the course in showcasing such top races. They shouldn't be reduced to the equivalent of a street brawl.
 
Pacemakers should only be used if there is likely to be a small field. With twelve plus runners there is no need. If I'd backed Sarafina I would have been fuming.
 
Agree re banning of pacemakers - the argument that one or two have won unexpectedly in the past is just disingenuous - it's a real rarity - and they not only cause traffic problems and therefore are an added danger, they also divide racing itnot those who can afford to run a pacemaker and those who can't and that can be dangerous for racing.

Racing for Change could have been usefully looking at this problem and lobbied for thir removal.

I can see the logic, Euronymous, in limiting them to races with less than 12 but how do you limit numbers in G1 races ? It's extremely rare for the entries to exceed permitted runners. Do trainers running pacemakers then have to declare them as such ? If they do - and then the pacemaker wins for some reason - does the result stand ? Because imagine the furore if a declared pacemaker won - cries of fixing would be the order of the day!

They're a menace, though and a voluntary code of conduct about them internationally might be the way to go, with every country's racing authorities bringing pressure to bear against the policy of running pacemakers in Group races.
 
A mid 120s race at best for me. Hard to believe too many ran their race with the way it was run, and I hope people don't rate it too highly just because it is the Arc.

The right horse may have won (Sarafina incredibly unlucky, and you can see Mosse actually almost gave up in the straight when she went right out the back) which was good to see, and a fantastic training effort from Stoute - glad he got the Arc monkey off his back.

Fame and Glory I got swayed into backing and was wrong - definitely not a top top horse.

The only thing I got any way right was how ridiculous it was to rate Behkabad and Planteur 130 and 129 after the Niel - hope we will see that corrected by some way now.
 
Have to agree with this too. Pacemakers in such a field are ludicrous

Fortunately with the revamped Champions Stakes at Ascot likely to become a huge draw the entries for the arc should be well down in future years
 
Nope, on reflection, equine pacemakers should be banned. Can't really have field size limits - it's unworkable and there it's easy to box in a rival in a six horse race with a pacemaker or two. Either a horse is running entirely on its own merits and nobody else's - or it's trangressing the Rules of Racing. End of.
 
Banning it is pretty difficult - change the colours on Midas Touch and it could be argued that he (as a strong stayer) was ridden to his strengths. Not sure the horse actually even hit the front at all?

For me the jockey made all the difference in the result - Moore was by far the strong. Not a slight against the Japanese horse's rider - just different styles and levels. Workforce did very well to pick up that quickly though.

Sarafina looked much better than I thought she was - will be interesting to see her clash again with Midday in America given the likely price of the Cecil horse.

I was dissappointed again with how Fame And Glory was ridden - only seen the race once but sticking a galloper like him in behind horses is just playing against his strengths. He travelled beautifully the whole way which suggests he could have taken a handier position if asked to - the interference cost him any chance of a place as he is never the type of horse to pick up again. He is all about momentum - I would think he barely had a race yesterday. Much like Rip they have messed up his second half of the season again imo.
 
Songs, thanks for extending the logic on doing away with pacemakers - they have got in the way in the past and have unnaturally held up horses against their merits. I'm all for clever riding tactics and naturally using the horses' strengths against others' weaknesses, but these blasted things serve very little purpose now, other than to cause difficulties to genuine runners. They are not being run to obtain the best possible position, as you say, which immediately contravenes the rules - and certainly the spirit - of racing. I don't know how they've been slipped in so often and always approved.

Looking through the posts, seems that this year's contest was a real curate's egg!
 
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Hamm said:
Fame and Glory I got swayed into backing and was wrong - definitely not a top top horse.
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...a little harsh to judge Fame on this surely, he got knocked sideways. It was quite an achievement to finish where he did in the circumstances. Murtagh said he was "killed" just as he was about to make his run (which was pretty evident). The colt needs to maintain a rhythm and was knocked out of it. He was never going to quicken like some of the others, but he may have outgalloped them. I thought he was doing everything right until he got clobbered.

Sarafina also had no luck at all. She might have had something to say in the finish.

This is taking nothing away from the winner. He won it well from a strong Japanese challenge and it was good to see him showing the flourish we saw in the Derby.
 
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I don't know Steve - he's had 3 races against top class horses and not gone close to winning any of them. I hope (though don't imagine) theyll run him in the Champion Stakes as like last year he'll make the market for others.

Sarafina really was a case of what might have been.

Taking nothing away from the winner though - very tough and you'd imagine there's more to come.

I'd almost advocate the Arc being a 16 runner race as it's unsatisfactory for the best flat race to end up in such a series of skirmishes.
 
Hamm said:
I don't know Steve - he's had 3 races against top class horses and not gone close to winning any of them. I hope (though don't imagine) theyll run him in the Champion Stakes as like last year he'll make the market for others.
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...all I know about it is that I'm gutted for Fame. We were just about to see the horse he is. Maybe he wouldn't have won, but I would have liked to have found out. One thing is for sure, no other horse would have done any better after being whacked as he was.
 
Come on! We found out - he wasn't up to it. He has had his chances and hasn't been good enough. He was never going to win before he lost his balance and is just a very good horse, but definitely not a great one.
 
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Hamm said:
Come on! We found out - he wasn't up to it. He has had his chances and hasn't been good enough. He was never going to win before he lost his balance and is just a very good horse, but definitely not a great one.
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What sort of horse do you think Fame and Glory is? He was always going to come off the bridle and find for it. He was coming off it, right in the mix and got thumped.
 
Would entirely agree with that Hamm. I cannot see how he would have had any effective turn of foot from that point.
 
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Galileo said:
What sort of horse do you think Fame and Glory is? He was always going to come off the bridle and find for it. He was coming off it, right in the mix and got thumped.
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He needed to be ahead at that stage and plod on - he wasnt as he didnt have the tactical pace to there.
 
Hamm said:
He needed to be ahead at that stage and plod on - he wasnt as he didnt have the tactical pace to there.
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Go look at the race, the horse cruised the whole way around...tactical pace was not an issue.

I seem to remember him being off the bridle when Sariska loomed up but he found plenty. He is what he is...a relentless galloper. The way he was ridden did not suit but he was still bang there with them when he was wiped out.
 
Galileo said:
Go look at the race, the horse cruised the whole way around...tactical pace was not an issue.

I seem to remember him being off the bridle when Sariska loomed up but he found plenty. He is what he is...a relentless galloper. The way he was ridden did not suit but he was still bang there with them when he was wiped out.
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The part in bold key. He is never going to pass a horse and needed to be ahead just after the turn into the straight to have a chance.

Also, the part about Sariska looming up is spot on - he is fine when a horse looms up to him, but he will rarely pass one in the straight.
 
Galileo said:
Go look at the race, the horse cruised the whole way around...tactical pace was not an issue.

I seem to remember him being off the bridle when Sariska loomed up but he found plenty. He is what he is...a relentless galloper. The way he was ridden did not suit but he was still bang there with them when he was wiped out.
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This is how I see it too and as much as I admire Fame And Glory I do try to be as dispassionate as possible in these situations. I think he was running a fine race this time (unlike last season), but luck went against him in a rough race.
 
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