Champion Hurdle 2015

Absolutely. The Christmas Hurdle isn't likely to be run at the same pace as a Champion Hurdle, or a Supreme for that matter. Those with a turn of foot just below can still win these races if they are run to suit. For me I think it's still unlikely Irving will be good enough though.
 
Walsh on Faugheen at Kempton.

'As we saw at the weekend Paul Nicholls’ horses are absolutely flying and he will be a tough nut to crack but if we have aspirations about Faugheen being a Champion Hurdle horse – to beat The New One, Jezki and Hurricane Fly down the line - he’ll have to be accounting for Irving'.
 
Interesting, and absolutely spot on. As I said earlier you'd think he'd be trying to make his own pace if nothing does it for him. He doesn't appear to be giving Sign Of A Victory any chance at all though based on that statement.

One thing that gets forgotten is that Kempton is still a Test if they go for it.
 
EC1 said:
the thing with Irving is..he's a trial race targetter...he doesn't have to be CH class to win em..those that are CH class in these races..are there using them as trials..so won't be beaten up to beat him

thats what it is i think DO
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That’s fair enough in that context, EC1. I just thought there were some remarks to the effect that Irving was a realistic CH contender. They shouldn’t be beaten up to beat him but they should still beat him.


Maruco said:
Absolutely. The Christmas Hurdle isn't likely to be run at the same pace as a Champion Hurdle, or a Supreme for that matter. Those with a turn of foot just below can still win these races if they are run to suit. For me I think it's still unlikely Irving will be good enough though.
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If that’s the case, why is it regarded as a speed test? Is there any evidence that Irving has the requisite turn of foot anyway?


Maruco said:
Interesting, and absolutely spot on. As I said earlier you'd think he'd be trying to make his own pace if nothing does it for him. He doesn't appear to be giving Sign Of A Victory any chance at all though based on that statement.
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He maybe didn’t think to mention SOAV because it isn’t at the front of the betting. On ORs SOAV has a lot to do too and I can’t see him being beaten up here either. Surely it is more important for them to get a better idea where he stands two and a half months short of the big race.
 
Desert Orchid said:
Can some kind soul point out to me what I'm missing about Irving? Where in his CV is there a snotter's chance in the Champion?

The Fighting Fifth was a very weak affair.

He wasn't going to win the Elite when he came down. He'd have been a decent second but he was only off 148.

He was gubbed out of sight in the only trial that matters, the Supreme.

In the Dovecote he only beat Amore Alato 5 lengths at levels. The latter, nearly a year later couldn't beat Snake Eyes off 137.

What are you guys seeing that I'm not??
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Agree with all of that, and it all points in the same direction - he won't have the speed for this.

Ruby's probably never even ridden against SOAV, so would hardly comment on his chance.
 
I don't think Henderson and Geraghty confuse geese and swans when it comes to Champion Hurdle contenders. With the potential I see in SOAV, if he lines up/is intended to, 8s is massive. He would be running in another handicap if they thought he was a sub 160 animal.
 
Hamm said:
I don't think Henderson and Geraghty confuse geese and swans when it comes to Champion Hurdle contenders. With the potential I see in SOAV, if he lines up/is intended to, 8s is massive. He would be running in another handicap if they thought he was a sub 160 animal.
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Surely you don't think that Henderson was having us away by saying that he took him out of the Ladbroke because of the going?
 
You didn't but NH did. As it happens, SOAV looks to be the only danger to the top 3 in the CH so whatever happens on Boxing Day should be informative. I'm on each way Jezki at 6/1 and it seems so obvious that I'm slightly concerned that the price is still available.
 
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I certainly never said Irving was a CH hurdle winner. I said precisely what EC1 went on to say, that he may peak or cause an upset in a trial. i'm not sure what gave you that impression, DO, from what I have see posted that is.
 
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No problem, marble. I didn't mean to imply that you had. It was just in my head that Irving was being talked about as taking in this race en route to Cheltenham and was thought (the thread is too long for me to check by whom) as a possible for both races.
 
You were probably mixed up with something I said Mo. I said the three of them in the Christmas Hurdle could well all be in the top 5 in the betting come March.
 
“We ran him over three miles in heavy ground last Christmas so he has plenty of stamina.“He’s surprised me that he’s as good as he is. His point form was nothing special. I think he won his point-to-point in May and I’m not sure he has a pedigree that he’d be a Champion Hurdle favourite, so it’s a huge leap.
“When he came here my first impression was that he might have been worth half the money we paid for him, but that is true of half the horses that arrive here.
“Last year when he won (at Cheltenham) he was as fit as the hand of god, as they say. He was so fit there wasn’t a pick left on him, this year he has come back and could be 100 weight heavier.
“When I sent him to Ascot, I was worried going there with the size of him. Dan Skelton, who stood in for me on the day, remarked to Ruby (Walsh) that he’d never saddled a horse as fat as that for a big race. If he can do that with that amount of condition on him there must be huge improvement in him .
“The day we bought Faugheen we were looking at a novice chasing career. Whether he’ll jump a fence now or not I don’t know, that will depend on his next two runs. I wouldn’t have dreamt about Champion Hurdles when we bought him, though.
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I reckon if Sign Of A Victory can get in the shake-up here he'll be doing very well. He has a lot to find on his bare form. It's a matter of how much he had in reserve at Ascot and how much he has improved since then but I remain hopeful my initial impression was correct.
 
I am also negative on Irving -was beaten when falling in the Elite,made heavy weather of winning at Newcastle and Kauto Star aside this isn't the greatest meeting for PN.Decent place lay for me if the price is right.
 
Geraghty in bullish mood,

'No one is underestimating his chance (Faugheen) – how can you with a horse that’s never been beaten since stepping foot on a racecourse including his point to point.

But in SOAV I have a horse that will cause him plenty of problems, make no mistake.

He’s got lots of pace as he showed when I brought him home on the bridle at Ascot at the beginning of November.

He’d done exceptionally well over the summer and the performance was impressive. There was a chance he could have run in the Ladbroke at Ascot last Saturday but he showed with that comeback win that he really does need quicker ground to allow his pace to kick in.

Although there is rain forecast for later on Boxing Day it should be ideal for the hurdle and this level track should be another point in his favour. I rate him a serious player'.
 
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ruby owes paddy brennan a drink

aside from putting his back legs through the last an immaculate performance once again
 
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